Sub Fraud In The US.. WARNING Z396297

[Tools]

It has come up that there have been some counterfeit Subs found in the US at a couple of different locations in the South/Southwest..

Apparently counterfeit Sub Cases (more than one) with serial number Z396297 have been sold with legitimate movements.

Frequently Counterfeits from the same maker all have the same serial number so check any potential Z Sub purchase carefully........ this will be a very difficult fraud to detect if the movement is a Rolex 3035/3135..

[Idle Swede]

Are they gold or SS Subs Larry?

[Dilemma]

It just never ends does it.

[DAVIDSW]

SS Subs.

[Idle Swede]

Originally Posted by DAVIDSW

SS Subs.

Pheew, no worries then.

[Nicko]

Mentioned here as well...


http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=124774

[Mockingbird]

Thanks for bringing this to all of our attention! You may have just saved some people from having a terrible experience buying.

[Jason71]

That ROYALLY Stinks!!!! Thanks for the heads-up though Larry

[thoang]

I would hope that any prospective buyers Google serial number Z396297 and this thread shows up.

[kcmo]

Crazy!

[jets]

Wow. I suppose this one more reason folks buy new from AD's.

[Renoir]

Originally Posted by jets

Wow. I suppose this one more reason folks buy new from AD's.

+1

It's nuts....even the vintage stuff has been well counterfieted.

[Bon Temps]

The fakes will only get better. Rolex will have to stay a step ahead and we all need to be very vigilant. As many wiser than me have said before; buy the seller then buy the watch, or as Mosco puts it "consider the source" !

[kingblackbolt]

Legitimate movements but in a fake case... damn that is confusing! Would Rolex even service this watch if it was sent to the RSC? Thanks for the serial number Larry!

[vintage69]

My watchmaker,Dave, has warned me of the fake Rolexes. He showed me a very well made Chinese Daytona the other day. He said the movement was excellent but the giveaway was the main spring and the slight difference in the size of the hands. By the way, one local AD verified the watch as real!!! Dave verifies watches for some of the major auction houses.

[JUSTROLEXES]

Thanks for the Updates Larry

[karmatp]

This is why people hide their serial numbers. It has happened before and it will keep happening, really sad.

[therolexguy]

Originally Posted by karmatp

This is why people hide their serial numbers. It has happened before and it will keep happening, really sad.

as I see people posting theirs all of the time.

[Brunotheboxer]

Not for nothing..........But why put a real movement in a fake case???? I dont get this whole concept.. I'm not saying this is not happening, I just dont understand it.

[Титан]

Originally Posted by Brunotheboxer

Not for nothing..........But why put a real movement in a fake case???? I dont get this whole concept.. I'm not saying this is not happening, I just dont understand it.

It makes the watch more legmitate when they open the caseback and see the movement, this will sell the watch so a non AD jeweler will believe the watch is a real Rolex and the customer buying is then duped. The real Rolex case is worth more than the movement.

[Tools]

Originally Posted by Brunotheboxer

Not for nothing..........But why put a real movement in a fake case???? I dont get this whole concept.. I'm not saying this is not happening, I just dont understand it.

Here is what the issue here is... this is not a Replica or fake, which is well known and mostly sold to wannabees (except on e-bay). Most replica owners are well aware of what they have and not what we are talking about at all..

...........This is counterfeiting with intent to defraud...

For example...an old Datejust is worth a couple of thousand...a z Sub is worth twice that, or more...

If you can duplicate a case well, then manufacture many of them, cannabalize older Rolex watches with real movements, you can easily double your investment............ but you are doing it by defrauding unsuspecting customers... You could go even further and put fake movements in the real DJ cases that hardly anybody checks out, and still sell them at close to their Rolex values...

[Traveler]

Originally Posted by Tools

Here is what the issue here is... this is not a Replica or fake, which is well known and mostly sold to wannabees (except on e-bay). Most replica owners are well aware of what they have and not what we are talking about at all..

...........This is counterfeiting with intent to defraud...

For example...an old Datejust is worth a couple of thousand...a z Sub is worth twice that, or more...

If you can duplicate a case well, then manufacture many of them, cannabalize older Rolex watches with real movements, you can easily double your investment............ but you are doing it by defrauding unsuspecting customers... You could go even further and put fake movements in the real DJ cases that hardly anybody checks out, and still sell them at close to their Rolex values...

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXX

whatever. So they then use a real dial, real hands, a real braclet as well ? Just swaping the case and inserting a real movement is not going to cut it. And IF, then what do they do with the real case ? Put a bunch of fake parts on it ? Try to resell it with an engraved serial number ? The whole thing still makes little sense and seems a whole lot of effort for not alot a reward.

[toolr]

This is why I only buy new from an AD.

[SLA]

Have there been confirmed fakes with the Rolex-Rolex-Rolex engraved rehaut with the serial number at the 6 position?

[2th Dr]

That stinks! Thanks for the heads-up Larry!

[hennabav]

Thanks for the update Larry!! I'm sure we all appreciate this...and all keep our eyes open for them.

[gmaines]

Larry, Thanks for the heads up....

[MitchSteel]

larry, thanks for the heads up....

x2

[nch209]

This stinks... Wonder if there is a single legit one with That serial... That would
stink more! Was there any notes about the band codes???

Lots of fakes... I saw another GMT2c that looked darn good. Be careful
out there.

[eagle_lex]

just because the movement "looks" like a legit rolex momement... dont even believe that. some of these high end replicas/fakes have rolex "looking" movements as well. i would say that is what is in these. much better profit and no hassels finding a legit movement and swapping it. the newer fakes are VERY good. one maker even uses unique serial numbers on every fake they produce.... they use to use the same one over and over (in the OPs case here) but not always the case. u can usually tell just by winding the movement if you are a rolex owner. ETAs dont wind anything like a Rolex movement.