How To Tell JLC From In-House AP?

[Time Exposure]

Is there a way to tell which models have a JLC-base caliber versus an in-house AP movement? Does it depend on the reference/model? Is it by serial number?

[ray0750]

the model number I think.

[~dadam02~]

JLC use AP movements in some of their watches? You learn something new everyday.

[Time Exposure]

Originally Posted by ~dadam02~

JLC use AP movements in some of their watches? You learn something new everyday.

huh?

[FightOnSC!]

AP supposedly used JLC movements in their earlier watches. AP movements are not used in JLC watches.

he's just curious as to which models have a JLC based movement...i was told however that AP's movements, while in-house, are BASED off of JLC's movements.

who knows?!

[~dadam02~]

Originally Posted by FightOnSC!

AP supposedly used JLC movements in their earlier watches. AP movements are not used in JLC watches.

he's just curious as to which models have a JLC based movement...i was told however that AP's movements, while in-house, are BASED off of JLC's movements.

who knows?!

Got it, thanks for clearing that up

[kilyung]

There are a number of models using JLC-based movements. JLC has one of the most (if not THE most) number of movements in the industry. They're not called the "watchmaker's watchmaker" for nothing. One of the best watch values bar none and one of my favorite brands.

The most famous model using a JLC-based movement is the 15202 Jumbo with the 2121 based on the JLC 920. Interestingly JLC has never used the 920 in any of its own watches as it was commissioned by the trinity. It is also the only movement to have been used by all three trinity brands (PP Nautilus, VC Patrimony, AP Jumbo). IP for this movement now belongs to AP but is still licensed to VC. So technically it's now made by AP but was not originally designed in-house.

The 2329/2846 movement found in the Dual Time model is also a JLC 889 based movement. This movement is used by JLC and VC.

[Hairdude1]

Originally Posted by kilyung

There are a number of models using JLC-based movements. JLC has one of the most (if not THE most) number of movements in the industry. They're not called the "watchmaker's watchmaker" for nothing. One of the best watch values bar none and one of my favorite brands.

The most famous model using a JLC-based movement is the 15202 Jumbo with the 2121 based on the JLC 920. Interestingly JLC has never used the 920 in any of its own watches as it was commissioned by the trinity. It is also the only movement to have been used by all three trinity brands (PP Nautilus, VC Patrimony, AP Jumbo). IP for this movement now belongs to AP but is still licensed to VC. So technically it's now made by AP but was not originally designed in-house.

The 2329/2846 movement found in the Dual Time model is also a JLC 889 based movement. This movement is used by JLC and VC.

Good to know...Thanks Mike

[jackwebb]

Originally Posted by kilyung

There are a number of models using JLC-based movements. JLC has one of the most (if not THE most) number of movements in the industry. They're not called the "watchmaker's watchmaker" for nothing. One of the best watch values bar none and one of my favorite brands.

The most famous model using a JLC-based movement is the 15202 Jumbo with the 2121 based on the JLC 920. Interestingly JLC has never used the 920 in any of its own watches as it was commissioned by the trinity. It is also the only movement to have been used by all three trinity brands (PP Nautilus, VC Patrimony, AP Jumbo). IP for this movement now belongs to AP but is still licensed to VC. So technically it's now made by AP but was not originally designed in-house.

The 2329/2846 movement found in the Dual Time model is also a JLC 889 based movement. This movement is used by JLC and VC.

Wow that makes me want to look into JLC which I have never had an interest in before. Thanks Mike

[michaelryuen]

Great info there ! Thank you

[iim7v7im7]

I am sure that many of you know this....

For many years up until Richemont purchased JLC from VDO (2000), AP had a 40% ownership stake in its Vallee de Joux neighbor. The $168M that it received from the sale enabled AP to be able to purchase Renaud & Papi in 2003. This is why you now have the AP Calibre 3120 in your RO watches.

There is far too much focus on whether a watch contains an AP movement or a movement made to AP's specifications by Frederic Piguet or Jaeger-LeCoultre with AP acting as the Etablisseur instead of as a Manufacture. The luxury watch industry has successfully spent decades convincing today's luxury audience that inhouse = better. A bunch of nonsense in my view. A well designed, beautifully finished movement is what matters.

My $.02

[Time Exposure]

Originally Posted by iim7v7im7

There is far too much focus on whether a watch contains an AP movement or a movement made to AP's specifications by Frederic Piguet or Jaeger-LeCoultre with AP acting as the Etablisseur instead of as a Manufacture. The luxury watch industry has successfully spent decades convincing today's luxury audience that inhouse = better. A bunch of nonsense in my view. A well designed, beautifully finished movement is what matters.

My $.02

Agreed. However (not to ignite a flame), I was asking precisely because I wish to avoid the problematic in-house movement in favor of JLC's proven design.

I'm not looking for justification of the quality of new in-house movements, nor am I looking at the problems reported as a small percentage of issues compared to total production, etc. Yes folks like to point out weaknesses in products. But for all the problems reported, there are certainly more that are not reported. I, for one, have formulated an opinion re: in-house AP movements, and I will not be seeking them out.

Still, I love the Royal Oak design (Awfshore excluded).

[dsk28]

Great info there Mike!

[powerfunk]

Some great info here! I really like the 14790st, which is a 36mm RO model with a JLC movement.