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watchuneedthemost · 25 October 2016, 02:13 AM

Hello forum members:

Need some quick advice. I have an opportunity to purchase a Rolex GMT master head only. It is authentic but not in working condition. No idea how much it would cost to fix it or whats wrong with it. There is no asking price on it, I have to make the offer. Now my question (if you have not already guessed it by now :D) is, how much should I (would you) offer for this piece in its current condition?

Thanks, any help will be much appreciated!

P.S. Something inside the case is loose/rattling.....any guesses on what that might be/mean would also be helpful :)

The GMT Master · 25 October 2016, 02:16 AM

Welcome

It would be impossible to put a figure based on what you've said. So much depends on which model reference, how many original parts are on it, what condition the movement is etc. A repair could potentially cost many, many thousands, and if the seller is not willing to disclose exactly what's wrong, I would steer clear

Chris

WAK4 · 25 October 2016, 02:18 AM

You won't be able to get an answer without a lot more info, starting with which model...and including pics.

Otherwise, offer $10 and go from there. I'd assume a full rebuild, new movement, etc at a minimum. Case, dial, hands TBD depending on their condition. Many variables to consider.

watchuneedthemost · 25 October 2016, 02:25 AM

Thank you, WAK4 and The GMT Master. Unfortunately, that is all the information I have. What I do have is a few pictures.....let me know what you think. Thanks again!

WAK4 · 25 October 2016, 02:31 AM

I was expecting something vintage. Short of taking it to an AD with a watchmaker in house or something similar to assess it, not sure what advice we can offer.

Any idea on history? What happened to the bracelet? How certain are you that it is not a fake?

watchuneedthemost · 25 October 2016, 02:34 AM

Pretty certain its not a fake, having owned a couple of Rolex's myself. However, seller bought it as part of a bunch of things on an estate sale......no more history available that that....I guess I have to (if I do at all) go into this one blind. Thanks for the input. Much appreciated!

Luap1976 · 25 October 2016, 02:37 AM

That gmt 2 is not real looking at the terrible out of focus photos.the hand stack is wrong hour hand should be on the bottom and everything else is wrong compared to the real watch

watchuneedthemost · 25 October 2016, 02:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luap1976

That gmt 2 is not real looking at the terrible out of focus photos

What makes you think that its not real? Just the "out of focus" aspect of the photos or something else that you see on there?

Luap1976 · 25 October 2016, 02:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by watchuneedthemost

What makes you think that its not real? Just the "out of focus" aspect of the photos or something else that you see on there?

I know it's not real.read what I posted above

watchuneedthemost · 25 October 2016, 02:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luap1976

I know it's not real.read what I posted above

Sorry missed it:). I will take a closer look at those things if I decide to go with it.....thanks for the input!

Valkyrie · 25 October 2016, 03:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luap1976

That gmt 2 is not real looking at the terrible out of focus photos.the hand stack is wrong hour hand should be on the bottom and everything else is wrong compared to the real watch

The hour hand is on the bottom as far as I can tell from the photos. If the 24 hour hand was on the bottom it would not pass over the hour markers. And as for "everything else" it looks just like mine which I purchased directly from an AD and is most certainly real.

It may well be a fake but I see nothing in the photos to suggest it is not real. Poor photography by itself is not evidence of a fake.

Luap1976 · 25 October 2016, 03:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Valkyrie

The hour hand is on the bottom as far as I can tell from the photos. If the 24 hour hand was on the bottom it would not pass over the hour markers. And as for "everything else" it looks just like mine which I purchased directly from an AD and is most certainly real.

It may well be a fake but I see nothing in the photos to suggest it is not real. Poor photography by itself is not evidence of a fake.

It's up to you what you belive my friend,but I can see its not a genuine gmt2

Valkyrie · 25 October 2016, 03:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luap1976

It's up to you what you belive my friend,but I can see its not a genuine gmt2

Indeed. We'll just have to agree to disagree. I don't really have a dog in this fight but I was just hoping to understand why some folks see this watch as clearly fake based on these photos with an explanation more than it's fake because I say so.

Chewbacca · 25 October 2016, 02:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by watchuneedthemost

Pretty certain its not a fake, having owned a couple of Rolex's myself. However, seller bought it as part of a bunch of things on an estate sale......no more history available that that....I guess I have to (if I do at all) go into this one blind. Thanks for the input. Much appreciated!

i think we can close this one up.

beshannon · 25 October 2016, 05:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by watchuneedthemost

Pretty certain its not a fake, having owned a couple of Rolex's myself. However, seller bought it as part of a bunch of things on an estate sale......no more history available that that....I guess I have to (if I do at all) go into this one blind. Thanks for the input. Much appreciated!

Hmm, lets see:

Who is the seller?
No box or papers?
No bracelet?
Non-working?
Estate sale where the owners of the estate did not know what they own?
Open the case to see what is loose?

Too many red flags here, I would walk away.

cdmorenot · 25 October 2016, 02:41 AM

I wouldn't pay more than around high 3's after proving that it is indeed authentic.

Give myself room for a service and a bracelet.

Valkyrie · 25 October 2016, 02:51 AM

ASSUMING this is not a fake, I would offer a few hundred dollars at most. If it were working and keeping good time I might offer $3K if I were in the market for a GMT Master 2 but since it not only isn't working but has something rattling around inside it could easily cost that much for you to get it running again. And a new bracelet will run about $1800 so as is it isn't worth very much unless you're a watchmaker and need parts.

sachal007 · 25 October 2016, 02:59 AM

the watch is a fake!

TempoKing · 26 October 2016, 01:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sachal007

the watch is a fake!

------->

Meme-Dweller · 25 October 2016, 03:19 AM

Ceramic bezel GMT numbers are supposed to be 3D-ish because of the platinum in the craters.... the first pic clearly proves it is fake. Crystal is also not supposed to be that thick. Just buy from an AD. No point in saving a few bucks from the guy in the alley with a trenchcoat when you can get scammed out of your entire payment.

Valkyrie · 25 October 2016, 03:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6R15

Ceramic bezel GMT numbers are supposed to be 3D-ish because of the platinum in the craters.... the first pic clearly proves it is fake. Crystal is also not supposed to be that thick.

You raise good points. The numerals in the bezel do indeed have depth in a real Rolex. I believe you can see that depth in the last photo in the "0" of the "10" where the light hits just right to highlight the depth. Of course you would want to check this in person or at least get higher quality photos to confirm this but based on the available photos I cannot conclude the bezel is fake.

The crystal on the GMT is virtually flush with the bezel as you say. The photos taken at an angle do seem to show a thicker crystal. But when I hold my GMT up at the same angle seen in the photos I see the same apparently thick crystal which is nothing more than the edge of the crystal peeking out from the small gap between the crystal and the bezel.

kdo2milger · 25 October 2016, 03:32 AM

Nice!
CHS?

breitlings · 25 October 2016, 03:34 AM

"You know how you can tell if a Rolex is fake? If it doesn't work." - Pawn Stars

slipperman · 25 October 2016, 04:43 AM

the last pic clearly shows the hour hand higher in the stack than the gmt hand. you can see the shadow underneath the hour hand on the dial. this watch is definitely a chinese fake, this is exactly how they are.

Valkyrie · 25 October 2016, 05:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slipperman

the last pic clearly shows the hour hand higher in the stack than the gmt hand. you can see the shadow underneath the hour hand on the dial. this watch is definitely a chinese fake, this is exactly how they are.

I'm not seeing it. The hour hand looks nearly flush with the dial to me. At best, I would agree the pics are inconclusive. To be clear, I am not arguing the watch is genuine but rather nothing in the pics is an obvious fake.

While scratching my head as to why an undamaged GMT head with something rattling around inside and no bracelet is offered for sale it occurs to me that someone with the skill and tools might have swapped out the 3186 movement into a 16710 GMT, turning a $6K watch into a $15K watch and selling off the 116710 head and bracelet. They should be able to get $1500 for the bracelet and whatever they get for the head is gravy. They may not have taken the effort to make the head work since you could then tell it had the wrong movement. In any case, pure speculation on my part.

slipperman · 25 October 2016, 08:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Valkyrie

I'm not seeing it. The hour hand looks nearly flush with the dial to me. At best, I would agree the pics are inconclusive. To be clear, I am not arguing the watch is genuine but rather nothing in the pics is an obvious fake.

While scratching my head as to why an undamaged GMT head with something rattling around inside and no bracelet is offered for sale it occurs to me that someone with the skill and tools might have swapped out the 3186 movement into a 16710 GMT, turning a $6K watch into a $15K watch and selling off the 116710 head and bracelet. They should be able to get $1500 for the bracelet and whatever they get for the head is gravy. They may not have taken the effort to make the head work since you could then tell it had the wrong movement. In any case, pure speculation on my part.

open the last pic in a browser window by itself and zoom in; the shadow from the hour hand is plain as day.

SeaAndSky · 25 October 2016, 04:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by watchuneedthemost

Hello forum members:
P.S. Something inside the case is loose/rattling.....any guesses on what that might be/mean would also be helpful :)

That would probably be the non-Rolex movement.

watchuneedthemost · 25 October 2016, 05:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by seaandsky

that would probably be the non-rolex movement.

lol!!!

watchuneedthemost · 25 October 2016, 05:04 AM

Ok, update! I made an offer of a 100 bucks....guy said he already has people offering more than 2K....I said, take that and run (and don't look back). Overwhelming response BTW from this forum. Thank you all!

MVP · 25 October 2016, 06:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by watchuneedthemost

Ok, update! I made an offer of a 100 bucks....guy said he already has people offering more than 2K....I said, take that and run (and don't look back). Overwhelming response BTW from this forum. Thank you all!

If he has people offering over $2K then why can't he at least give you that as a starting price/ why isn't he taking those offers? How did you find this clown? Seems so sketchy

25 October 2016, 02:13 AM	#1
watchuneedthemost "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2016 Real Name: Ro Location: Chicago Watch: Aqua Terra 2503.33 Posts: 598	Buying Rolex GMT Master Head Only Hello forum members: Need some quick advice. I have an opportunity to purchase a Rolex GMT master head only. It is authentic but not in working condition. No idea how much it would cost to fix it or whats wrong with it. There is no asking price on it, I have to make the offer. Now my question (if you have not already guessed it by now :D) is, how much should I (would you) offer for this piece in its current condition? Thanks, any help will be much appreciated! P.S. Something inside the case is loose/rattling.....any guesses on what that might be/mean would also be helpful :) Last edited by watchuneedthemost; 25 October 2016 at 02:15 AM.. Reason: more information

25 October 2016, 02:25 AM	#4
watchuneedthemost "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2016 Real Name: Ro Location: Chicago Watch: Aqua Terra 2503.33 Posts: 598	Thank you, WAK4 and The GMT Master. Unfortunately, that is all the information I have. What I do have is a few pictures.....let me know what you think. Thanks again! Attached Images

25 October 2016, 02:41 AM	#16
cdmorenot 2024 SubLV41 Pledge Member Join Date: Jun 2015 Real Name: Carlos. Location: NNJ - MDE Watch: = Want them all. Posts: 3,700	I wouldn't pay more than around high 3's after proving that it is indeed authentic. Give myself room for a service and a bracelet. __________________ \| Breguet \| Cartier \| Casio \| Hublot \| IWC \| Omega \| Rolex \| Seiko \|

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25 October 2016, 02:16 AM	#2
The GMT Master "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Real Name: Chris Location: England Posts: 8,150	Welcome It would be impossible to put a figure based on what you've said. So much depends on which model reference, how many original parts are on it, what condition the movement is etc. A repair could potentially cost many, many thousands, and if the seller is not willing to disclose exactly what's wrong, I would steer clear Chris

25 October 2016, 02:18 AM	#3
WAK4 2024 Pledge Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Real Name: Bill Location: NJ Watch: Always changing Posts: 4,172	You won't be able to get an answer without a lot more info, starting with which model...and including pics. Otherwise, offer $10 and go from there. I'd assume a full rebuild, new movement, etc at a minimum. Case, dial, hands TBD depending on their condition. Many variables to consider.

25 October 2016, 02:31 AM	#5
WAK4 2024 Pledge Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Real Name: Bill Location: NJ Watch: Always changing Posts: 4,172	I was expecting something vintage. Short of taking it to an AD with a watchmaker in house or something similar to assess it, not sure what advice we can offer. Any idea on history? What happened to the bracelet? How certain are you that it is not a fake?

25 October 2016, 02:34 AM	#6
watchuneedthemost "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2016 Real Name: Ro Location: Chicago Watch: Aqua Terra 2503.33 Posts: 598	Pretty certain its not a fake, having owned a couple of Rolex's myself. However, seller bought it as part of a bunch of things on an estate sale......no more history available that that....I guess I have to (if I do at all) go into this one blind. Thanks for the input. Much appreciated!

25 October 2016, 02:37 AM	#7
Luap1976 "TRF" Member Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: London Uk Watch: 116610lnBBetaBBhar Posts: 1,005	That gmt 2 is not real looking at the terrible out of focus photos.the hand stack is wrong hour hand should be on the bottom and everything else is wrong compared to the real watch

25 October 2016, 02:51 AM	#17
Valkyrie "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: USA Posts: 121	ASSUMING this is not a fake, I would offer a few hundred dollars at most. If it were working and keeping good time I might offer $3K if I were in the market for a GMT Master 2 but since it not only isn't working but has something rattling around inside it could easily cost that much for you to get it running again. And a new bracelet will run about $1800 so as is it isn't worth very much unless you're a watchmaker and need parts.

25 October 2016, 02:59 AM	#18
sachal007 Banned Join Date: Feb 2013 Real Name: Sachal Location: San Francisco, CA Watch: Hulk/BLNR/D-Sea Posts: 294	the watch is a fake!

25 October 2016, 03:19 AM	#20
Meme-Dweller Banned Join Date: May 2015 Location: TX Watch: Meme-Dweller Posts: 498	Ceramic bezel GMT numbers are supposed to be 3D-ish because of the platinum in the craters.... the first pic clearly proves it is fake. Crystal is also not supposed to be that thick. Just buy from an AD. No point in saving a few bucks from the guy in the alley with a trenchcoat when you can get scammed out of your entire payment.

25 October 2016, 03:32 AM	#22
kdo2milger "TRF" Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: USA Posts: 2	Nice! CHS?

25 October 2016, 03:34 AM	#23
breitlings Banned Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: Bethesda Watch: Apple TV Posts: 5,744	"You know how you can tell if a Rolex is fake? If it doesn't work." - Pawn Stars

25 October 2016, 04:43 AM	#24
slipperman "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: westcoast Posts: 134	the last pic clearly shows the hour hand higher in the stack than the gmt hand. you can see the shadow underneath the hour hand on the dial. this watch is definitely a chinese fake, this is exactly how they are.

25 October 2016, 05:04 AM	#29
watchuneedthemost "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2016 Real Name: Ro Location: Chicago Watch: Aqua Terra 2503.33 Posts: 598	Ok, update! I made an offer of a 100 bucks....guy said he already has people offering more than 2K....I said, take that and run (and don't look back). Overwhelming response BTW from this forum. Thank you all!

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