SS Daytona Lovers: The Myth is gone....???

[Micha]

I am pretty new to this forum, but this is really bugging me and I wanted to share it with you guys.
I bought my first Rolex (Seadweller) in the early 80ties and am hooked ever since. 18 years later came a coveted Daytona (Zenith) which I still treasure. It was very difficult to get at that time and that is my point.
Things are different today.
You can buy them all day long on ebay for basically the same price than your local AD will sell them for. Gone are the days when you had to spend a lot of money every year at your AD to finally get the call that you are the chosen one privileged to purchase. Or you had to spend a couple of grand OVER list price to snatch one on the internet.
I think Rolex flooded the market (out of greed?). May be a new short term thinking CEO, who is just looking to increase his bottom line...Bonus time will come around.
What do you think?

[The GMT Master]

Still as rare as hens' teeth over here, I think the situation has changed Stateside due to the complete collapse of the luxury market - things will revert to type again in the future.

[allanofcalifornia]

I think the reason is that people don't have money to buy new ones and that people are selling their Daytona because of the current economy. It is very likely that Daytonas will again become very difficult to obtain but only time will tell.


Allan

[Tools]

Daytonas have never been rare.......Just the SS models have been snapped up at first sight..

Right now, as said, the economy has kept many from dropping 10 grand on a wristwatch....

Rolex has seen a 40% reduction in sales worldwide in the past 2 years, so until their supply balances out, some models will be in surplus..but they might have stopped current production on others for a time too..

[Micha]

my headline reads: SS Daytona lovers....

[lobo58]

The missing element here is that, originally, SS Daytonas were rare because people didn't want them and Rolex made more making the model in precious metals. Rolex couldn't give 6263 and 6265s away, apparently, so few were made and those that survive are rare.

Manipulating the market to create a scarcity is a different matter entirely, more befitting Beanie Babies than Rolex. Rolex should make every effort to get a SS Daytona into the hands of every person who desires one. That's just sound business.

In thirty years or so we may well discover that the least popular models today are all the rage among vintage dealers, but that is by its very nature impossible to predict.

[RolexSoFla]

So now we know. They're all in Ontario. I've never walked into an AD anywhere I have traveled in the U.S. and seen a new SS Daytona waiting for a buyer at MSRP.

[allanofcalifornia]

Originally Posted by lobo58

In thirty years or so we may well discover that the least popular models today are all the rage among vintage dealers, but that is by its very nature impossible to predict.

This is why I buy what I like and not because a watch is rare or popular.


Allan

[Welshwatchman]

Originally Posted by Micha

my headline reads: SS Daytona lovers....

We can all read.

[cmr]

Originally Posted by Tools

Daytonas have never been rare.......Just the SS models have been snapped up at first sight..

Right now, as said, the economy has kept many from dropping 10 grand on a wristwatch....

Rolex has seen a 40% reduction in sales worldwide in the past 2 years, so until their supply balances out, some models will be in surplus..but they might have stopped current production on others for a time too..

agreed, for the last five years that i have been watching there have been at least 20-30 brand new ones at any given time on ebay for sale. anytime i can locate 20-30 within 45 minutes for sale they are not rare.

[Rudy1000]

Hi All,

It's clear that SS Daytonas have become more available recently.
I was offered one from my AD last week... and that store has never had even one for the past several years.

I also know of another person who was able to get one within a week
of asking, which tells me that they are available.

So, I think Rolex is either manufacturing more SS Daytonas (V-Series),
sending more to the U.S., or trying to sell off the lot before bringing out a larger case design.

[HDHNTER]

Originally Posted by allanofcalifornia

I think the reason is that people don't have money to buy new ones and that people are selling their Daytona because of the current economy. It is very likely that Daytonas will again become very difficult to obtain but only time will tell.


Allan

+1
Although I think it will be several years at a minimum before we see demand return enough to push the SS Daytona back into the highly sought, seldom found category (at least for the US market).

[Imtiaz]

The availability is not so much increased production - as people not buying.

Money is tight and people are losing jobs at every level. Imagine if GM goes down, the impact will be global. Opel in Germany, Volvo in Sweden, Holden in Australia, Vauxhall in UK and so on.

People are keeping cash for that proverbial rainy day. Can't blame them.

[DCGuy1965]

To me it was the thrill of the hunt in obtaining one. I got mine in Oct 2006 when my AD called me and felt like one of those VIPs going into some exclusive nightclub. The sad part is I've only worn it maybe 5 times as my LV gets the most wrist time. I concur I've NEVER seen a new one in the case but only used ones at Big T for 15K or so LOLOLOL!!!

The thing that bugs me to this day when I got mine was Rolex just implemented a price increase. I'm thinking my AD held out for a few days to make sure I paid 900 more but I'll never know. I do lovew the watch and think it will remain a cult classic for years to come.

[scottschoe]

I agree with ^^. The thrill of the hunt WAS fun, no doubt about it. However, once I actually bought one from an AD, it sorta just sat around. Never wore it....and instead chose to wear a TT Daytona daily. I ended up flipping the SS to fund something I actually enjoy wearing and never looked back. Maybe I should have worn it once or something.

[BigHat]

Originally Posted by scottschoe

I agree with ^^. The thrill of the hunt WAS fun, no doubt about it. However, once I actually bought one from an AD, it sorta just sat around. Never wore it....and instead chose to wear a TT Daytona daily. I ended up flipping the SS to fund something I actually enjoy wearing and never looked back. Maybe I should have worn it once or something.

X2.
Actually wore it a bit more often, but it was history after six months.

[RolexSoFla]

Originally Posted by BigHat

X2.
Actually wore it a bit more often, but it was history after six months.

So you really bought it to flip? I think most pursue the SS Daytona to have and keep unless their financial situation dictated otherwise.

[BigHat]

Originally Posted by RolexSoFla

So you really bought it to flip? I think most pursue the SS Daytona to have and keep unless their financial situation dictated otherwise.

Actually, I never thought I would sell it and I traded it in where I bought it. I got a call right around Thanksgiving '07. They said, "You and four other of our best customers are going to be put into a drawing for the right to buy a white SS Daytona, you want to be considered?" Turns out I "won" the chance to pay retail.
While buying it I actually had people offering to buy it from me while it was being fitted. I was excited initially, but shortly thereafter it started to bore my to tears. So no, I didn't buy it to flip and I while I got a great trade-in, the exchange of cash was all with the same AD.

As to what most people do. Who knows. The delta between gray market and retail now is almost nil, but trust me, it wasn't long ago that more AD SS Daytona stock ended up in grey market cases than on customer wrists.

[vh_bu98]

I love the look of the SS Daytona, but I don't think the market was intentionally flooded. It's still a popular piece, but the fact that it retails for almost $10k USD for a SS watch, the economy isn't doing great and it's no longer profitable for the flippers have made the availability more accessible.

[Timber Loftis]

Originally Posted by Micha

What do you think?

I think they're undersized, underuseful, and only vaguely attractive, certainly not enough to make up for their shortcomings.

And I think they have lost their Flavor of the Month feel and many willing purchasers out there like other new and improved models better these days.

[chu88y]

i'm with you,I've seen all the supposidly hard to get Rolex's in AD's around recently,so that SS Daytona,Deepsea,Milgauss is no longer a problem

[argee1977]

The same amount are being produced, it's just that every year they are in production adds several thousand to the market, add to that the financial situation and the lack of credit and money and you can see why they're not as hard to get.

It's the same with everything, look at the DSSD, going for 2-3k over list a year ago and now they're being bought for MRSP or under.

As for the hard to get bit, i've never really believed that, you pay a premium and you can get one tomorrow, which is the same today as it was 10/20/30 years ago. Other companies do limited runs and special editions and are genuinely hard to get, but i've never thought of that with the Daytona.

[Klokke]

For example, almost all the UK and European and Asian posters here describe the usual waiting list for the SS Daytona.

Availability in the US might be a bit better in SOME parts of the country (i.e. shorter waiting lists) but there are NO discounts at ADs.

A few people claiming (dubiously) to see them piling up in AD displays can't be extrapolated to the global market as a whole.

And Ebay is about the worst indicator you could use. You don't even know if that stuff is even real.

Hate to break it to you but your SS Daytona is still a grail watch - even without an in-house movement.

[Singslinger]

I think it's only since the late 1980s that the S/S Daytona developed its unique mystique (maybe that was the word the OP was looking for, instead of "myth''?) which made it highly desirable in the watch collecting world. I think that mystique was born out of scarcity and premium pricing; whatever the case, it led to desiirability which I think will continue for the forseeable future.

Yes, the watch is relatively easier to obtain nowadays, and yes, ADs in Singapore at least were selling it for MRSP (albeit with no discounts) earlier this year, but I believe the premium over MRSP has since started to creep back into the selling price (I checked with my AD a couple of weeks ago).

Whether or not people are buying it because they want to wear it (as they should, IMO) or simply to stockpile it because the price had fallen is a moot point because the bounce in price suggests to me that the watch is still very desirable and, possibly (if you accept that mystique = desirability) that the mystique is still intact.

PS The highly-sought after Milgauss GV's price also collapsed to MRSP earlier this year but unlike the Daytona, it has remained at MRSP at ADs while grey market dealers are offering it, brand new, for a marginal discount.

[bodybump]

I guess one of the reason why it is avaiable in the market its because nobody's buying it...probably the people that has been waiting for it for so long dont have the money anymore...This why you see it more often and being offered to people who just have extra cash..Economy is a big factor...People would rather use 10k for something more important than buying a watch...

[Gaijin]

Another effect of this is that a member here who was a SS Daytona flipper dissapeared off the forum once the SS Daytonas that he combed all over for could not be re-sold here for a handsome profit to other TRF members.

Frankly I am happy about that as his motivation for being a member here was clearly evident. He even called my AD during the SS heyday dropping my name telling them I was his friend and that I told him that they would sell him a SS Daytona. They told him to pound sand and then questioned me about it. I didn't even know the guy personally. So I am glad the flippers are gone.

[Mr. K]

Originally Posted by KansaiVet

Another effect of this is that a member here who was a SS Daytona flipper dissapeared off the forum once the SS Daytonas that he combed all over for could not be re-sold here for a handsome profit to other TRF members.

Frankly I am happy about that as his motivation for being a member here was clearly evident. He even called my AD during the SS heyday dropping my name telling them I was his friend and that I told him that they would sell him a SS Daytona. They told him to pound sand and then questioned me about it. I didn't even know the guy personally. So I am glad the flippers are gone.

Agree with this. It is nice if the people, SS Daytona lovers, can can get the watch without getting gouged. We here truly appreciate our watches. If a TRF members wants a SS Daytona to enjoy for themselves, I hope they can finally get it!

[scottschoe]

Originally Posted by KansaiVet

Another effect of this is that a member here who was a SS Daytona flipper dissapeared off the forum once the SS Daytonas that he combed all over for could not be re-sold here for a handsome profit to other TRF members.

Frankly I am happy about that as his motivation for being a member here was clearly evident. He even called my AD during the SS heyday dropping my name telling them I was his friend and that I told him that they would sell him a SS Daytona. They told him to pound sand and then questioned me about it. I didn't even know the guy personally. So I am glad the flippers are gone.

Funny...I was wondering what happened to that guy.

[Gaijin]

Originally Posted by scottschoe

Funny...I was wondering what happened to that guy.

Yea, so you know who I am talking about Scott....

[007Willster]

Hello all,

I'm new to the forum as I just purchased my first Rolex. I already have Omega, Breitling, Panerai and Sinn. I waited for the right watch to come along, one that I wanted to wear.

I was offered a black dial SS Daytona in 2007 by my regular AD for what was MSRP in 2007 because I was on the list. I turned it down at the time because I wanted a white dial SS Daytona and was not interested in the whole "flipping" thing. I would rather that it went to someone who wanted to wear it. Ignorant, I know...

Anyway, a couple of weeks ago I happened to be at my AD just at opening time. He was excited because they had just received a white dial SS Daytona the night before. I joked that I was afraid that this would happen because now I had to make a decision!

I went ahead and purchased it, but before I finished my transaction there were two other customers behind me ready to take it if I didn't.

- I paid current MSRP for a V serial with the new GMTII clasp.
- There are still waiting lists in my area.
- Most of the waiting list people want Black Dials (already have WDs).
- This is the first SSD I have seen in my area this year.
- It was in the safe, not on display.
- I bought it to wear...

As far as the prices of the Daytona coming down - the one I just bought at MSRP was $2000 more than than MSRP for the one in 2007! People on lists in the past were paying significantly less at the AD than today. The price coming down is just the "flipper" and grey markets.

I think that the combination of:
1) the Rolex price increases making it less affordable,
2) the lousy economy causing less disposable income,
3) along with current MSRP being approximately the same as the typical "Flip" price, therefore eliminating the flipper buyers (as was pointed out above)
have put the Daytona in the current situation.

BTW, I liked the Daytona before I knew that it was hard to get and I love mine - next up is the classic 14060M!

Sorry so long, I'll do better next time...

Mike