Crown up/crown down

[Boopie]

I know Rolex recommends crown up versus crown down for positioning a watch at night, if you want to affect the speed (and of course it applies to automatic watches in general).

My question is, does crown up or down really only come into play if you’re leaving the watch for hours at a time (eg at night), or is it cumulative throughout the day? I’ve never read anything about this, just advice on how to position your watch at night, when it’s resting for hours.

I ask because I’m left handed, and wear my watch on my right wrist. Obviously the Rolex movement is designed anticipating that it will be worn on the left wrist.

So, if most of you have your Rolex crown-down when your arm is down at your sides during the day, but my watch’s crown is up, does that make a difference? Obviously no one stands around for hours a day with hands down at their side, but it does occur many times throughout the day. So, assuming normal use, i.e. we are moving our arms throughout the day, is there any impact on timing of watches worn on the right wrist versus the left wrist?

[duquephart]

Groan.

[Oxfordian]

Just wear it and enjoy it, if the watch runs a bit fast or a bit slow just reset it periodically.

[padi56]

Originally Posted by Oxfordian

Just wear it and enjoy it, if the watch runs a bit fast or a bit slow just reset it periodically.

Have to agree I wonder how the millions upon millions of Rolex watch owners managed before things like loupes, timegraphers, phone timing apps, special cleaning cloths, worrying other a second or so etc. Perhaps back then they bought there Rolex watches to wear and enjoy for many years in good health which is far more important. Gravity is the main enemy of any mechanical movement no matter the make or calibre, when resting off wrist dial up or dial down the balance staff runs on the ends of it's pivots very little or no added friction. Thus the balance wheel has a slightly higher amplitude so will make movement run very very slightly faster. When watch is off wrist vertical crown up or down or the balance staff pivots runs on the sides of the balance pivot causing a tiny more added friction this slows the amplitude so will run very slightly slower. In wearing through the day these positions hopefully balance out if watch is regulated correctly.

All information supplied from my own 79 year old brain power, without the aid of loupes, nicknames, timegraphers, machine winders, investment £$€ stuff, alignment points, protective film, AD relationship stuff, special cleaning cloths, phone apps, and the rest of todays Rolex watch toys.

[RFC]

Dial up to speed up.
On the side crown down to slow it down.
On the other side crown up to slow it even more.

There use to be a Rolex instruction like this that came with the watch.

It works.

[sj24k]

Hmmm, yet another thing I’ve never once thought about. I take my watch off, I either put it in my nightstand or stick it in one of my watch rolls and have never once considered the position of the crown. Is this really something people care about?


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[Benzsiam]

To gain a few seconds.................Lay the watch flat with the dial uppermost

To lose a few seconds.................Lay the watch vertically with winding-button Downwards

To lose rather more seconds........Lay the watch vertically with winding-button Uppermost

[Xerxes77]

Originally Posted by Benzsiam

To gain a few seconds.................Lay he watch flat with the dial uppermost

To lose a few seconds.................Lay the watch vertically with winding-button Downwards

To lose rather more seconds........Lay the watch vertically with winding-button Uppermost

This

[djyolky]

Originally Posted by Benzsiam

To gain a few seconds.................Lay he watch flat with the dial uppermost

To lose a few seconds.................Lay the watch vertically with winding-button Downwards

To lose rather more seconds........Lay the watch vertically with winding-button Uppermost

I think this is what Rolex states. However I've found that I lose more seconds with crown down than crown up.

Sent from my SM-G991U1 using Tapatalk

[doboy007]

Originally Posted by Benzsiam

To gain a few seconds.................Lay he watch flat with the dial uppermost

To lose a few seconds.................Lay the watch vertically with winding-button Downwards

To lose rather more seconds........Lay the watch vertically with winding-button Uppermost

This is NOT always the case. People need to experiment with their own watches. Winding-button? Seriously?

[djyolky]

Originally Posted by doboy007

This is NOT always the case. People need to experiment with their own watches. Winding-button? Seriously?

Very true. Each watch is a bit different.

Sent from my SM-G991U1 using Tapatalk

[robinmgb]

Originally Posted by Benzsiam

To gain a few seconds.................Lay the watch flat with the dial uppermost

To lose a few seconds.................Lay the watch vertically with winding-button Downwards

To lose rather more seconds........Lay the watch vertically with winding-button Uppermost

This works well, used this method for years to self regulate and keep my watch accurate

[Normunds]

Originally Posted by Benzsiam

To gain a few seconds.................Lay the watch flat with the dial uppermost

To lose a few seconds.................Lay the watch vertically with winding-button Downwards

To lose rather more seconds........Lay the watch vertically with winding-button Uppermost

Why would watch lose less seconds crown down than crown up? And what about other vertical positions? Horizontal? Would it speed up more if left dial down?

So many questions, my head hurts.

[Jack F]

Originally Posted by Boopie

I know Rolex recommends crown up versus crown down for positioning a watch at night, if you want to affect the speed (and of course it applies to automatic watches in general).

My question is, does crown up or down really only come into play if you’re leaving the watch for hours at a time (eg at night), or is it cumulative throughout the day? I’ve never read anything about this, just advice on how to position your watch at night, when it’s resting for hours.

I ask because I’m left handed, and wear my watch on my right wrist. Obviously the Rolex movement is designed anticipating that it will be worn on the left wrist.

So, if most of you have your Rolex crown-down when your arm is down at your sides during the day, but my watch’s crown is up, does that make a difference? Obviously no one stands around for hours a day with hands down at their side, but it does occur many times throughout the day. So, assuming normal use, i.e. we are moving our arms throughout the day, is there any impact on timing of watches worn on the right wrist versus the left wrist?

Take some time measurements in various configurations and reports back. Thanks

[Boaters]

Another world crisis ..

[DonRickles]

Originally Posted by Boopie

Obviously the Rolex movement is designed anticipating that it will be worn on the left wrist.

Please, send me a copy of this? Did you find it in the Rolex operating instructions?

[Chiboy]

Originally Posted by DonRickles

Please, send me a copy of this? Did you find it in the Rolex operating instructions?

Here ya go.

Still waiting to hear how many seconds there are in a day...

[DonRickles]

Originally Posted by Chiboy

Here ya go.

Still waiting to hear how many seconds there are in a day...

Heres my question repeated for you?

"Obviously the Rolex movement is designed anticipating that it will be worn on the left wrist."


Where can I find this?

[Boopie]

Originally Posted by DonRickles

Heres my question repeated for you?

"Obviously the Rolex movement is designed anticipating that it will be worn on the left wrist."


Where can I find this?

On the right side of the case, at the crown.

Every Rolex has its winding crown on the right side of the case…as does every modern or vintage Omega, PP, VC, AP, Seiko, TAG, Cartier, Breitling, IWC, etc. posted on here in “wrist shots,” shown on internet videos, etc. No astronaut was sent into space wearing a watch with its winding crown on the left side of the case. Whether a watch was designed for diving, piloting an aircraft, or timing a car race or a yacht regatta, its winding crown (and pushers) are on the right side. There are few novelty exceptions (none of which I’ve owned, or have been manufactured by Rolex in my lifetime), but it’s not a coincidence that the wristwatch has evolved to have its winding crown and stem on the right side, not on the top stopwatch-style, nor on the left.

Many things that require turning, twisting, or moving, such as a doorknob or the way a door opens, or a tool such a manual can opener, are designed with right hand dominant user in mind. Even the orientation of writing on an ambidextrous implement such as a pen is designed for use in the right hand (i.e. the writing is right side up when the pen is in the right hand, but upside down in the left). These are just some of many, many examples of things that are ergonomically designed with a right hand dominant user in mind. If the world were 90+% left handed, I think it’s fair to assume that the standard, universal placement of a watch’s winding crown would be on the left side.

I’ve spent more than an hour each day this week in Los Angeles traffic. With my hands at the 10 and 2 position on the steering wheel, my watch had its crown down for prolonged periods of time. If I were right-handed, as 90+% percent of you are, my watch would have been on my left wrist, where it’s designed to be, and the crown would have been facing up on the steering wheel.

As other posters have noted, and as I know, Rolex itself has published recommendations that show that positioning a crown one way or the other does, actually, affect the movement. That is, crown up/down is not irrelevant. So, given that, and given that the watch movement was designed with a right hand dominant user in mind (as evidenced that there are no Rolex watches sold today with a winding mechanism on the left side), my question was prompted by my curiosity as to whether there is any effect on accuracy wearing a mechanical timepiece on the right wrist throughout the day. Perhaps there isn’t. But, there are a lot of really smart people here on TRF with engineering and science backgrounds, and although I’m not a technical-minded person, I do find the technical posts here to be interesting and educational, so I thought I’d ask.

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by Boopie

On the right side of the case, at the crown.

Every Rolex has its winding crown on the right side of the case…as does every modern or vintage Omega, PP, VC, AP, Seiko, TAG, Cartier, Breitling, IWC, etc. posted on here in “wrist shots,” shown on internet videos, etc. No astronaut was sent into space wearing a watch with its winding crown on the left side of the case. Whether a watch was designed for diving, piloting an aircraft, or timing a car race or a yacht regatta, its winding crown (and pushers) are on the right side. There are few novelty exceptions (none of which I’ve owned, or have been manufactured by Rolex in my lifetime), but it’s not a coincidence that the wristwatch has evolved to have its winding crown and stem on the right side, not on the top stopwatch-style, nor on the left.

Many things that require turning, twisting, or moving, such as a doorknob or the way a door opens, or a tool such a manual can opener, are designed with right hand dominant user in mind. Even the orientation of writing on an ambidextrous implement such as a pen is designed for use in the right hand (i.e. the writing is right side up when the pen is in the right hand, but upside down in the left). These are just some of many, many examples of things that are ergonomically designed with a right hand dominant user in mind. If the world were 90+% left handed, I think it’s fair to assume that the standard, universal placement of a watch’s winding crown would be on the left side.

I’ve spent more than an hour each day this week in Los Angeles traffic. With my hands at the 10 and 2 position on the steering wheel, my watch had its crown down for prolonged periods of time. If I were right-handed, as 90+% percent of you are, my watch would have been on my left wrist, where it’s designed to be, and the crown would have been facing up on the steering wheel.

As other posters have noted, and as I know, Rolex itself has published recommendations that show that positioning a crown one way or the other does, actually, affect the movement. That is, crown up/down is not irrelevant. So, given that, and given that the watch movement was designed with a right hand dominant user in mind (as evidenced that there are no Rolex watches sold today with a winding mechanism on the left side), my question was prompted by my curiosity as to whether there is any effect on accuracy wearing a mechanical timepiece on the right wrist throughout the day. Perhaps there isn’t. But, there are a lot of really smart people here on TRF with engineering and science backgrounds, and although I’m not a technical-minded person, I do find the technical posts here to be interesting and educational, so I thought I’d ask.

A wrist watch doesn't just sit in one position as It's constantly moving around.
Taking temperature variations out of it and setting it aside for discussion. Also setting aside Precision, as another matter which is crucial to achieving accuracy.

The reason why mechanical Wristwatch movements are typically adjusted in the 5 most common positions is to provide an average of rates which hopefully equate to one's watch running within an acceptable degree of accuracy when worn on the wrist.
Some Wristwatch manufacturers(like Grand Seiko) may opt to adjust their movements in the full 6 positions.

Gyroscopic forces which act on the pivots of the Balance play a significant roll in timekeeping as well. That's why Grand Seiko also like to have High beat movements to help minimise the gyroscopic effects that work on the Balance.

Pocket watch movements are typically adjusted to only 3 positions because the most common positions they are left in(as they sit in a pocket) is Crown left, Crown up and Crown right.

To address your question directly.
Only the positions for adjustment which are prevalent for right wristed wearing are going to be more important. So Crown up will be factored in where it normally wouldn't for a movement that's adjusted in 5 positions, and Crown down would more or less become irrelevant. A watchmaker can adjust accordingly for right wristed wearing.
Hense a movement that's adjusted to 6 positions, theoretically has right and left wristed wearing covered completely.

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by DonRickles

Heres my question repeated for you?

Where can I find this?

It's reflected in the "typical" 5 different positions the Rolex movements are adjusted to

[MJZRolex]

This is interesting information, but I'm not sure it really matters. Enjoy the watch and simply reset the time when you feel it is appropriate. I really don't look at the seconds when I need to know the time.

[Sgooter]

I read on the internet that it all depends on how far you are above or below the equator...has something to do with Earth's rotation speed and the Coriolis effect at your location...and on whether the month has an "R" in it.

[Old Expat Beast]

Originally Posted by Sgooter

I read on the internet that it all depends on how far you are above or below the equator...has something to do with Earth's rotation speed and the Coriolis effect at your location...and on whether the month has an "R" in it.

When Seiko flew its watches from Japan to the Swiss chronometer competitions in the 1960s, it supposedly avoided the transpolar route in favour of routes closer to the equator, to avoid the polar magnetic field. I'm not sure if this was necessary, but they ended up beating all the Swiss movements (except Omega's quartz), and causing the Chronometer competitions to be shut down, then later opened only to the Swiss watch companies.

[avera]

I have a 5508 Submariner (1958) that came with the resting position instructions and I found it to work as described. I also have a 2021 BLRO and I am wondering whether this remains true for modern Rolex movements. My BLRO definitely runs a little faster when left dial up overnight.

[Roddypeepa]

My experience of modern calibers
Is : doesn’t work.

I think if you’re that bothered fully wind then leave for 24 h and check.

Repeat for all 6 positions:

Dial up
Dial down
crown up
Crown down
6 up
6 down

Note the tone variance each day.

Vow that life is too short and just get on so the wearing it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by Boopie

I know Rolex recommends crown up versus crown down for positioning a watch at night, if you want to affect the speed (and of course it applies to automatic watches in general).

My question is, does crown up or down really only come into play if you’re leaving the watch for hours at a time (eg at night), or is it cumulative throughout the day? I’ve never read anything about this, just advice on how to position your watch at night, when it’s resting for hours.

I ask because I’m left handed, and wear my watch on my right wrist. Obviously the Rolex movement is designed anticipating that it will be worn on the left wrist.

So, if most of you have your Rolex crown-down when your arm is down at your sides during the day, but my watch’s crown is up, does that make a difference? Obviously no one stands around for hours a day with hands down at their side, but it does occur many times throughout the day. So, assuming normal use, i.e. we are moving our arms throughout the day, is there any impact on timing of watches worn on the right wrist versus the left wrist?

The movement in the watch is not necessarily designed to primarily be worn on the left wrist.
It's simply that it's only tested for and adjusted in 5 out of the 6 potential positions which favour a left wrist scenario.
GS include all 6 positions in their testing and adjustments.

To add further context, Pocket watches traditionally used to be tested and adjusted in the 3 most likely positions that they will reside in whilst sitting in a pocket. They are crown left, crown up and crown right.

Everything affects accuracy and it's not limited to resting position with temperature being another main factor(especially when off the wrist and not influenced by body temp).
Whilst a major factor, anecdotal evidence suggests resting position is less significant in modern times with the most significant resting position variations remaining dial up and dial down because the Balance staff is in the vertical plane.
When positional change occurs, it takes a little while for the Balance to settle into a consistent rhythm.