Info on this 5513 Milsub

[tkc324]

Experts, I found this posting and would like to learn more. Not necessarily saying I am going to just jump in and buy it, but figure this is a great learning experience. Do experts here think its genuine? One of the biggest worry that I would have is that this is a franken watch. Any opinion or thoughts welcome.

http://forums.timezone.com/index.php...=0#msg_6390506

[Mickey®]

I think its cool. Don't like the dirty hour markers and I'd never spend 24K on any Submariner...thats just me.

[htinez]

case looks to have seen (quite) a few polishes as well....just repeating what the advert says...

[Vincent65]

I'd pass, and the guy needs a manicure...

[htinez]

btw can anything be done about the grubby lume?

[etp095]

That hand in the picture sure needs a manicure&Lubriderm.

[tkc324]

haha... thats hilarious...

[Frogman4me]

Come on guys milsub for 24k! What a joke.

[Vincent65]

a bargain!

[Passionata]

Originally Posted by Vincent65

I'd pass, and the guy needs a manicure...

& a dermatologist


Best
George

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[964RS]

Can someone explain to me what is so funny?

Without seeing the engravings you can not make any further opinion of it other than being as described?

[ACM]

Bells ringing here.......

[964RS]

Ok as everyone wants to knock it without any justification whatsoever....do you not agree that.

1. Case looks correct but is over polished

2. Fixed bars look correct

3. Dial is correct but has had some obvious damage

4. Hands are correct mercedes but not original sword

5. 60 min insert is aftermarket and he says so.

Letter from Rolex looks authentic so if serial number, model number and inside caseback engravings are correct and match letter it is all correct?

At the end of the day its an over polished civilianised milsub with damaged dial and 15 min insert and mercedes hands.

Sounds about right?

I'm not sure how you can dismiss this as anything other than what it is described as without seeing it further...

[HL65]

Originally Posted by 964RS

Ok as everyone wants to knock it without any justification whatsoever....do you not agree that.

1. Case looks correct but is over polished

2. Fixed bars look correct

3. Dial is correct but has had some obvious damage

4. Hands are correct mercedes but not original sword

5. 60 min insert is aftermarket and he says so.

Letter from Rolex looks authentic so if serial number, model number and inside caseback engravings are correct and match letter it is all correct?

At the end of the day its an over polished civilianised milsub with damaged dial and 15 min insert and mercedes hands.

Sounds about right?

I'm not sure how you can dismiss this as anything other than what it is described as without seeing it further...

Good precise assessment Jason....

PS. I would never buy it!

[Vincent65]

looks like you've got it all buttoned up I'd pass, as I said before.

[financeman]

You guys weren't kidding. That guys hands looks like he has been playing in alligators mouth. Wow

Oh yeah, I think I would pass on the sub btw.

[ACM]

Looks like you are sold on this one, enjoy

[964RS]

It's not something I'd ever buy but there are too many threads these days which have people knocking something without actually ever saying why or what their reasons are...which is pointless imho, unless its just bandwagon jumping which also happens (NOT saying that is what is happening here)

The OP asked for some opinions and a desire to 'learn' but just got vague replies implying that it wasn't right. I think we can do better at actually replying to the OP's thread...that's all.

If you have knowledge of something share it I say :)

[Frogman4me]

Originally Posted by 964RS

It's not something I'd ever buy but there are too many threads these days which have people knocking something without actually ever saying why or what their reasons are...which is pointless imho, unless its just bandwagon jumping which also happens (NOT saying that is what is happening here)

The OP asked for some opinions and a desire to 'learn' but just got vague replies implying that it wasn't right. I think we can do better at actually replying to the OP's thread...that's all.

If you have knowledge of something share it I say :)

I agree Jason, I am at work so I couldn't reply to specifics but again this is a very poor example of a milsub and I wanted the OP to know before he may have made a decision on it but I'm sure he is not blind so all is well. Unless your extremely desperate to say you own a milsub then jump right in otherwise I would pass and buy a different reference sub in great condition or wait for a quality example milsub to come along.


Here is some information regarding milsubs for the OP:

http://doubleredseadweller.com/watch...ubmariner.html

http://www.hodinkee.com/blog/2010/5/...sub-exact.html


Best wishes of course

[SohAIS]

LOL. The poor guy does not even know you guys are making fun on his hand. Funny

[tkc324]

Originally Posted by 964RS

It's not something I'd ever buy but there are too many threads these days which have people knocking something without actually ever saying why or what their reasons are...which is pointless imho, unless its just bandwagon jumping which also happens (NOT saying that is what is happening here)

The OP asked for some opinions and a desire to 'learn' but just got vague replies implying that it wasn't right. I think we can do better at actually replying to the OP's thread...that's all.

If you have knowledge of something share it I say :)

Thanks mate. I appreciate your feedback. This is just a learning experience for me. I am years away from actually buying a milsub. Its never too early to start learning and reading about these beautiful pieces.

[kooltzar]

Jason's assessment is fully correct, just:

A civilianised 5513 milsub with mercedes hands and normal bezel is just not worth the extra premium asked for really. Or would you just pay 20,000 for a circled T on a dial?

[Pete17]

Genuine replacement hands and bezel insert will cost a bomb.....if you can find them.
Taking that into account and the crappy state of the dial then the price is probably not far off.

[jedly1]

it is what it is ...in full spec its a $100k watch but he isnt asking that .....it looks legit but has lost a lot of its originality and condition, there are plenty of folks who collect and enjoy mils at this kind of price level and this kind of civilianisation.....

different folks...different strokes....

[BaltimoreBrian]

I just love the fact we are hearing from Jason, Ken, and Jed all on this thread!

[BaltimoreBrian]

I am also suspecting that the milsubs are going to be increasingly harder and harder to find? And as the best specimens find homes in collections, civilianized ones, like this one, that might have been first looked past, will become more desirable, especially with their documentation.

[kooltzar]

Most of the milsubs are still with the people that got them at the service. I guess most of them do not know the value, but that does not matter as they will soon come to an age where they give their watch to their eldest son. So I think there are tons of milsubs around, just not for us.

[jedly1]

Originally Posted by kooltzar

Most of the milsubs are still with the people that got them at the service. I guess most of them do not know the value, but that does not matter as they will soon come to an age where they give their watch to their eldest son. So I think there are tons of milsubs around, just not for us.

sadly i don't think that is so true anymore.... we used to get at least a dozen or so a year surfacing 'fresh' from original owners...but the explosion in the internet and of prices from about 2006/7 i think sucked out most already and has really slowed that down to a trickle now , and many of the ones we have seen recently have been the 'more civiliansied , it would be easy not to realise what you have as they don't look that different' type ...

the cd ( clearance divers) and sbs and army air corp guys have all had a run around each other trying to buy and sell them and theres very few being held

other problem is now that HH has left and Rolex Uk wont confirm issue numbers etc , any that do surface can only at best be checked over by experts to 'fit' what we know....


1000 watches ish supplied, we know multiple hundreds were destroyed and put in concrete and sank to the bottom of the bay, we know many didnt survive service full stop...we can account for about 250-300 ish with collectors between our respective databases , (less than a third full spec....) after many years of cataloguing...watches in the wild...i think it'll be measured in tens not hundreds.....

[Mickey®]

Originally Posted by jedly1

sadly i don't think that is so true anymore.... we used to get at least a dozen or so a year surfacing 'fresh' from original owners...but the explosion in the internet and of prices from about 2006/7 i think sucked out most already and has really slowed that down to a trickle now , and many of the ones we have seen recently have been the 'more civiliansied , it would be easy not to realise what you have as they don't look that different' type ...

the cd ( clearance divers) and sbs and army air corp guys have all had a run around each other trying to buy and sell them and theres very few being held

other problem is now that HH has left and Rolex Uk wont confirm issue numbers etc , any that do surface can only at best be checked over by experts to 'fit' what we know....


1000 watches ish supplied, we know multiple hundreds were destroyed and put in concrete and sank to the bottom of the bay, we know many didnt survive service full stop...we can account for about 250-300 ish with collectors between our respective databases , (less than a third full spec....) after many years of cataloguing...watches in the wild...i think it'll be measured in tens not hundreds.....

Why were they destroyed and put in concrete and sank?

Thx

[jedly1]

none of the grunts who were involved in doing it know the exact reasons, but supposition is that it related to some of the tritium scares at the time and maybe the amount of tritium material that would be on a lot of pieces, i spoke to one ex quartermaster who thought maybe actually may also have been relation to the fact they'd done the same in the past with radium watches and someone just went down same path...same is supposed to have also happened here in oz with many mil watches.