Newbie here and help needed HESS AUCTION

[Andygen]

Hi all, I just purchase this watch from Ebay, without reading the fine print I paid for a 16610 Z series Submariner, the watch actually comes with a aftermarket customs dial, although I think I got a deal at 5,000USD. Can guys here advise the following?

1) Is it possible to find a original factory black dial? New or Used (Yr 2004 above), and how much?
2) How much do you guys think this fake aftermarket dial cost?
3) How much will this watch worth with this fake dial?
4) Does this watch looks genuine?

Sorry for asking too much questions here. Any help will be appreciated!
Thanks

[jot_]

Sorry dude, it doesn't look genuine and it's not going to be worth a whole lot unless you can get a real dial back in there.

[Cc1966]

You have some work to do here....Sourcing a new dial is not a big deal. The aftermarket is going to bring what the market will bear (not a whole lot). Good luck...

[beshannon]

Not sure where the "deal" was?

You could probably have bought a real one with an original dial for less. Also without seeing the movement it is hard to say that is worth anything different than what you paid

[Andygen]

The watch is fake?

[beshannon]

Originally Posted by Andygen

The watch is fake?

I did not say that.

What I said was you bought a watch from a picture. And now you have questions?

I would want to see the movement and bracelet in detail. And I am not expert enough to know if that dial is a fake or a knockoff or something else. Or is it a real dial just not one that belongs on that wantch . . .

[MitchSteel]

My urgent advice is.......don't buy Rolex watches from Ebay.......ever
There are way too many fakes, and if not fakes , then ChopShop watches, put together from various non-matching parts.I don't know if your watch is fake, but its definitely ChopShop.Those hands don't look right to me either.

[katana]

If you do not have the original dial, I would never buy it. This should you ask before you buy .....On question 4. so looking watch fake.

[TAKUYA]

many trusted sellers are over here, why you have to buy on ebay? i just don't like ebay and paypal though.

[sigguy]

Look, Hess is a reputable company so the watch is most likely fine. From
the posted pictures nothing looks fake/suspect either.

The aftermarket dial is not particularly desirable so I wouldn't expect to
get much money out of it. Correct dial can be found.

Jack D.

[Andygen]

Jack,

Thanks. At last I see something positive. Any idea how much will a original black dial cost? new or used (2004 above)

[Frogdog]

Not my cup of tea but it obviously appealed to you, so that's what's important. I'm curious......what was stated in the fine print you mention? Was it marketed as authentic?

[Andygen]

Description: We are now offering for your condition a CLASSIC stainless steel men’s genuine Rolex submariner watch. The watch features a custom aftermarket mother of pearl dial with added aftermarket white diamonds. The stones on the custom aftermarket dial are not well matched (please see images). The dial displays a date window at the 3 o’clock position. The watch is equipped with a stainless steel oyster bracelet. The bracelet has mild surface scratches consistent with wear. We are now offering this watch to you at a very low starting price and with NO RESERVE! Good luck to all bidders.

[MitchSteel]

This description is Vague......yet, legal.Theres nothing in this description that tells you, that its a Genuine/Authentic item......Example:words like Custom.Oyster, is a Rolex trademark, it better be a genuine oyster bracelet, not oyster style/type.Not to be negative, bud, but those are the things to look out for when shopping on the Internet.Vague descriptions should be the first red flag.I sure hope it turns out well for you, good luck and research, research, and when in doubt, research more, then double it for good measure.

[Stevro]

Description isn't vague, unless you don't understand the word aftermarket.

Originally Posted by MitchSteel

This description is Vague......yet, legal.Theres nothing in this description that tells you, that its a Genuine/Authentic item......Example:words like Custom.Oyster, is a Rolex trademark, it better be a genuine oyster bracelet, not oyster style/type.Not to be negative, bud, but those are the things to look out for when shopping on the Internet.Vague descriptions should be the first red flag.I sure hope it turns out well for you, good luck and research, research, and when in doubt, research more, then double it for good measure.

[rmfnla]

Originally Posted by Andygen

Description: We are now offering for your condition a CLASSIC stainless steel men’s genuine Rolex submariner watch. The watch features a custom aftermarket mother of pearl dial with added aftermarket white diamonds. The stones on the custom aftermarket dial are not well matched (please see images). The dial displays a date window at the 3 o’clock position. The watch is equipped with a stainless steel oyster bracelet. The bracelet has mild surface scratches consistent with wear. We are now offering this watch to you at a very low starting price and with NO RESERVE! Good luck to all bidders.

I'd say they were very up front about the dial, and the rest of the watch looks OK.

Remember, the time to ask questions is before you buy...

[s14roller]

Originally Posted by rmfnla

I'd say they were very up front about the dial, and the rest of the watch looks OK.

Remember, the time to ask questions is before you buy...

Agreed, we all want to help, but asking these questions afterwards makes for a difficult situation.

Would have been better off just getting one for around $5Kish with the original dial if you wanted that to begin with.

[Oryx]

Fake Alert

[sfnyc]

Interesting that they put the tritium marker on there too.

[Presa canary]

It says aftermarket 3 times in the description... Hess is reputable. Yes you can find a orig dial.

[mjclark32]

After all the advice above, I'd return it for a refund (hopefully you can) and put the $5,000 you paid towards a more educated purchase. Just my opinion.

[james1787]

It sounds to me like they were trying to be honest. They weren't hiding that it is an aftermarket dial, and that the stones aren't even a good match. They say that in their description. If your not sure on the authenticity of the movement, bracelet, etc.. take it to an Authorized Dealer and have them check it out. Lots of people do put aftermarket custom dials on their watches. It's not something that appeals to me but it does appeal to others. If you don't like the dial you can always change it. If you like it, keep it. Good luck!

[sigguy]

There are several different dials that were made for the 16610. The correct
dial for a Z-series 16610 will say 'Swiss Made' on the bottom edge. As an
example, see the ebay listing #390658898900. That one would be
correct, however I think if you're patient you should be able to find
the correct factory dial for less money.

Also, you will want to check with a local AD. Every country seems
to have different rules about selling Rolex parts. In the U.S. they
are very strict about not selling replacement dials unless you
exchange a dial. In other countries apparently it may be possible to
buy a dial without providing an exchange.

Assuming that you like the look of the watch with the current dial, then
wear and enjoy it and take your time to find a factory dial. It's a
simple/quick procedure for a competent watchmaker to switch dials so
you could change the look periodically.

If you were getting it thinking that you would immediately switch
to the factory dial and sell the aftermarket dial, then you most
likely will not save any money over getting the correct watch
from the start as the value of the aftermarket dial is minimal.

I would highly recommend that when you get the watch, take it to a
competent watchmaker and have it verified as authentic, just to be
sure.

I found the original listing; the seller states clearly that it is an authentic
rolex with the exception of the dial and you have three days to authenticate it.

Regards,

Jack D.

[wingku]

What have you done?!.......

[MonBK]

Of course it's not a fake, Jeff Hess would never sell that.

The watch has an aftermarket dial (which he repeated 3 times) that you obviously must have liked when you bid on it.

Enjoy your watch.

[springer]

Originally Posted by MonBK

Of course it's not a fake, Jeff Hess would never sell that.

The watch has an aftermarket dial (which he repeated 3 times) that you obviously must have liked when you bid on it.

Enjoy your watch.

MonBK, I have a little different perspective than you regarding this Hess ebay auction if the auction description is as it has been described here in other posts.

You might want to do a search on hessfineauctions who have been the subject of several threads here on TRF regarding misrepresented ebay auctions concerning Rolex watches!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! So yes, their auction company would and did sell a counterfeit, trademark-infringed dial on this watch. It doesn't matter that he said it was aftermarket, I don't believe that they have been authorized by Rolex to sell watches with dials containing trademarks that are aftermarket, non-Rolex, counterfeit or whatever phrase you choose to use in this case. Of course none of the other sellers on ebay have been authorized by Rolex to sell these non-genuine, trademark infringed parts either. It happens quite often on ebay, even though some ebayers list these dials as aftermarket instead of the the correct term of counterfeit. Regarding this auction by hessfineauctions, it was nice of them to at least alert the buying public that the dial was not genuine. Also, Oyster is trademarked by Rolex, so if the bracelet on the watch doesn't contain all the proper Rolex markings, and is just generic and plain, I believe that calling it an Oyster-style bracelet would be proper.

Personally, I would expect more from hessfineauctions and do not care to see them selling this counterfeit on ebay, but he has a track record here in previous threads so I am not surprised.

I would take the watch to a RSC and have them replace the dial. It will probably be less expensive there than buying one on the secondary market.

[rolepam312]

5K for that?? Sorry.. I don't think it's a deal.. It's not even the original serti dial as stated by the seller.. So what makes this an authentic case/ bracelet ? If it were, why couldn't they put the " real" serti dial?? Not sure about Hess but I certainly would not buy anything from them...good luck..

[kilyung]

Nothing wrong with the watch from your pics except dial and price IMO.

[Welshwatchman]

Personally, I'd not go for a Rolex with a fake dial.

An aftermarket dial would NOT have the Rolex crown or wording.

It's a fake dial, plain and simple.

To me, the watch is worth a complete example, less the cost of a genuine dial and fitting costs, less a "what else is wrong?" amount.

It would have to be so much cheaper than $5k, for me.

[crowncollection]

Fake dial


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