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forgedblades · 17 April 2015, 07:37 AM

Hello all. Need some input on an 80's era 5513 that belongs to my Father-in-Law. This Sub has been his since the early 80's when he purchased it new from a local AD. It has seen it's fair share of wear and has never been serviced etc. He actually promised me this watch upon his passing so it means a lot to me. Well after years of wear the watch stopped the other day(broken main spring I suspect) and since I will inherit the watch one day I felt obliged to service the watch as he was just going to put it in a drawer and let it set until the day I got it.
The bracelet is in need of work as well and I am going to send that to Michael Young for a refurb but question...Instead of separating the bracelet and watch would it just be easier for Mr. Young to do the service as well? I have read rave reviews as to his work on bracelets but really nothing I can recall as to service of the movement. Guidance and input would be appreciated.
Also I opened the watch and while the model number on the case is 5513 the back case has 5512 stamped in it. Is this common or has it been replaced at some point do you think. He said he could not remember ever taking it in for anything.
One more thing I noticed was the dial. In the right light it appears that the paint is crazing. See picture below. Is this a concern for the long term "health" of the dial?
Again thanks in advance for all your input and advice.
Dave

jedly1 · 17 April 2015, 07:52 AM

back is perfectly common ...don't worry after that (presuming its a typo and you meant 5512)

'spider dial' is usual for the period and no big deal, whilst rolex will try to remove it by swapping the dial out , some people like it , and above all its original to the watch, theres really no need to change it out, I've never yet seem one where the spidering has caused actual damage to the dial its sort of under the laqeur.

mike · 17 April 2015, 07:59 AM

Do you mean 5512? If so I would not worry. Casebacks are the same on both references. Rolex used what ever was on hand at the time. They had no intention of future owners opening the watch as is common practice now. I doubt anyone saw the interest in vintage Rolex we have now back in the day.

You dial appears to be a latter WG surround dial used as the last variation of the 5513. Also known as the "spider dial" because of the cracking that sometimes occurs with this paint mixture. It isn't just the 5513 that had this, but other references as well. Many feel it was a flaw in the paint mixture used at the time and later corrected by Rolex.

Some feel it inhances the look of the watch, others view it as a flaw (to be honest I'm in the latter camp".

My first thought was to send it to Rolex for service and have the RSC paperwork with the watch. Given the diaL and the history however you might want to ask yourself how original you want to keep it. Rolex may want to change the dial because of the crazing.

If originality is important a good watchmaker with access to Rolex parts can do the job.

I'm not aware of Michael Youngs work via service. His bracelet work is outstanding. Perhaps the use of a NATO strap while the original is away would allow you to enjoy the watch after service. 5513s look great on NATOs.

mike · 17 April 2015, 08:06 AM

To the OP.

I see Jed posted while I was typing. Jed is a true expert on vintage Rolex. Take what he says to the bank.

Old Expat Beast · 17 April 2015, 08:18 AM

Don't send the whole watch out of the country. Getting it back in could be a problem.
http://www.crownandcaliber.com/watch...united-states/

forgedblades · 17 April 2015, 08:19 AM

Yes it was a typo. Thanks for the advice. While I have thought of the RSC solution and perhaps another watchmaker, the RSC paperwork is appealing to me as well. Will the RSC leave the dial alone if I request that nothing be changed? If indeed it is considered a flaw by Rolex wouldn't they "have" to or insist upon it being changed?

jedly1 · 17 April 2015, 08:28 AM

i would imagine you would have a hard time getting the dial through Rolex USA , the policy there has been draconianly anti vintage for at least a decade, mostly based around a fear of litigation/ liability and a realisation that the best way to avoid any issues is to avoid servicing old watches unless its totally on their terms

as a side note....right now the same policy is spreading heavily into the Uk service centre and i know of at least a couple spider dials they insisted on replacing last year ( or insisted on replacing to avoid having to service more like) and after a few serious mistakes in recent years are running scared on touching vintage.

though if you really wanted rsc paperwork and their high standards of service you could pick up another 5513 dial for not a lot ($200 area) swap your original out and then submit , re install your original later to keep the watch whole and original, resell the other dial etc....depends how strongly you feel about keeping it all original.

jdmi32 · 17 April 2015, 08:32 AM

I have an early 80's 5513 with a 5512 stamped case back also. Very common as already noted.

Even though I look at the craze on the dial as a defect, that dial is the same one that your dad looked at for all these years, so there is no way I would change it if the watch was mine. I would also send the head only to a reputable watch repairer and the bracelet to Mr. Young.

That's a great watch and a wonderful connection to your dad. I'm sure you will treasure it greatly once it's back on your wrist.

forgedblades · 19 April 2015, 10:45 AM

Well after much consideration I wound up sending the bracelet to Mr. Young in Hong and the 5513 head to Mr. Dietel yesterday. Looking forward to seeing the result and after talking to Rik I am sure this veteran of 30 plus years will be looking brand spanking new with the "flawed" spider still in place of course.
Thanks for all the input and advice!

17 April 2015, 07:37 AM	#1
forgedblades "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2014 Real Name: Dave Location: Memphis Watch: 16610LV/CokeGMT II Posts: 396	80's Era 5513 Hello all. Need some input on an 80's era 5513 that belongs to my Father-in-Law. This Sub has been his since the early 80's when he purchased it new from a local AD. It has seen it's fair share of wear and has never been serviced etc. He actually promised me this watch upon his passing so it means a lot to me. Well after years of wear the watch stopped the other day(broken main spring I suspect) and since I will inherit the watch one day I felt obliged to service the watch as he was just going to put it in a drawer and let it set until the day I got it. The bracelet is in need of work as well and I am going to send that to Michael Young for a refurb but question...Instead of separating the bracelet and watch would it just be easier for Mr. Young to do the service as well? I have read rave reviews as to his work on bracelets but really nothing I can recall as to service of the movement. Guidance and input would be appreciated. Also I opened the watch and while the model number on the case is 5513 the back case has 5512 stamped in it. Is this common or has it been replaced at some point do you think. He said he could not remember ever taking it in for anything. One more thing I noticed was the dial. In the right light it appears that the paint is crazing. See picture below. Is this a concern for the long term "health" of the dial? Again thanks in advance for all your input and advice. Dave Attached Images Last edited by forgedblades; 17 April 2015 at 08:16 AM.. Reason: typo

17 April 2015, 07:52 AM	#2
jedly1 "TRF" Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: mel(oz)/Yorks(uk) Posts: 1,929	back is perfectly common ...don't worry after that (presuming its a typo and you meant 5512) 'spider dial' is usual for the period and no big deal, whilst rolex will try to remove it by swapping the dial out , some people like it , and above all its original to the watch, theres really no need to change it out, I've never yet seem one where the spidering has caused actual damage to the dial its sort of under the laqeur.

17 April 2015, 07:59 AM	#3
mike "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 22,683	Do you mean 5512? If so I would not worry. Casebacks are the same on both references. Rolex used what ever was on hand at the time. They had no intention of future owners opening the watch as is common practice now. I doubt anyone saw the interest in vintage Rolex we have now back in the day. You dial appears to be a latter WG surround dial used as the last variation of the 5513. Also known as the "spider dial" because of the cracking that sometimes occurs with this paint mixture. It isn't just the 5513 that had this, but other references as well. Many feel it was a flaw in the paint mixture used at the time and later corrected by Rolex. Some feel it inhances the look of the watch, others view it as a flaw (to be honest I'm in the latter camp". My first thought was to send it to Rolex for service and have the RSC paperwork with the watch. Given the diaL and the history however you might want to ask yourself how original you want to keep it. Rolex may want to change the dial because of the crazing. If originality is important a good watchmaker with access to Rolex parts can do the job. I'm not aware of Michael Youngs work via service. His bracelet work is outstanding. Perhaps the use of a NATO strap while the original is away would allow you to enjoy the watch after service. 5513s look great on NATOs.

17 April 2015, 08:06 AM	#4
mike "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 22,683	To the OP. I see Jed posted while I was typing. Jed is a true expert on vintage Rolex. Take what he says to the bank.

17 April 2015, 08:18 AM	#5
Old Expat Beast TRF Moderator & 2024 SubLV41 Patron Join Date: Jul 2013 Real Name: Adam Location: Far East Watch: Golden Tuna Posts: 28,826	Don't send the whole watch out of the country. Getting it back in could be a problem. http://www.crownandcaliber.com/watch...united-states/

17 April 2015, 08:19 AM	#6
forgedblades "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2014 Real Name: Dave Location: Memphis Watch: 16610LV/CokeGMT II Posts: 396	Yes it was a typo. Thanks for the advice. While I have thought of the RSC solution and perhaps another watchmaker, the RSC paperwork is appealing to me as well. Will the RSC leave the dial alone if I request that nothing be changed? If indeed it is considered a flaw by Rolex wouldn't they "have" to or insist upon it being changed?

17 April 2015, 08:28 AM	#7
jedly1 "TRF" Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: mel(oz)/Yorks(uk) Posts: 1,929	i would imagine you would have a hard time getting the dial through Rolex USA , the policy there has been draconianly anti vintage for at least a decade, mostly based around a fear of litigation/ liability and a realisation that the best way to avoid any issues is to avoid servicing old watches unless its totally on their terms as a side note....right now the same policy is spreading heavily into the Uk service centre and i know of at least a couple spider dials they insisted on replacing last year ( or insisted on replacing to avoid having to service more like) and after a few serious mistakes in recent years are running scared on touching vintage. though if you really wanted rsc paperwork and their high standards of service you could pick up another 5513 dial for not a lot ($200 area) swap your original out and then submit , re install your original later to keep the watch whole and original, resell the other dial etc....depends how strongly you feel about keeping it all original.

17 April 2015, 08:32 AM	#8
jdmi32 "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Real Name: Ky Location: Bay Area, CA Watch: 16570 Posts: 2,362	I have an early 80's 5513 with a 5512 stamped case back also. Very common as already noted. Even though I look at the craze on the dial as a defect, that dial is the same one that your dad looked at for all these years, so there is no way I would change it if the watch was mine. I would also send the head only to a reputable watch repairer and the bracelet to Mr. Young. That's a great watch and a wonderful connection to your dad. I'm sure you will treasure it greatly once it's back on your wrist.

19 April 2015, 10:45 AM	#9
forgedblades "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2014 Real Name: Dave Location: Memphis Watch: 16610LV/CokeGMT II Posts: 396	Well after much consideration I wound up sending the bracelet to Mr. Young in Hong and the 5513 head to Mr. Dietel yesterday. Looking forward to seeing the result and after talking to Rik I am sure this veteran of 30 plus years will be looking brand spanking new with the "flawed" spider still in place of course. Thanks for all the input and advice!

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