The Rolex Forums   The Rolex Watch

ROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEX


Go Back   Rolex Forums - Rolex Forum > Rolex & Tudor Watch Topics > Rolex General Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 27 July 2016, 08:04 AM   #1
yourule40
"TRF" Member
 
yourule40's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: usa
Watch: Rolex
Posts: 51
Model Comparison

I'm deciding between getting the Oyster Perpetual GMT-Master II or the 114060 Submariner. What do you guys think?
yourule40 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 08:09 AM   #2
Kevin of Larchmont
2024 Pledge Member
 
Kevin of Larchmont's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: The Ice House
Watch: Ingersoll Mickey
Posts: 3,398
There's a lot of love for Submariners, lots of them out there, I hear it described as iconic a lot. That's one reason why I went GMT.
Kevin of Larchmont is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 08:10 AM   #3
Danny83
2024 ROLEX DATEJUST41 Pledge Member
 
Danny83's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Real Name: Danny
Location: Bay Area CA
Watch: Yellow Gold
Posts: 20,312
Gmt
Danny83 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 08:20 AM   #4
CRM114
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: HK & USA
Watch: GMTs,1803, 16610LV
Posts: 2,001
The GMT (unless you live your life underwater at depths greater than 100m).
CRM114 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 08:24 AM   #5
yourule40
"TRF" Member
 
yourule40's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: usa
Watch: Rolex
Posts: 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by CRM114 View Post
The GMT (unless you live your life underwater at depths greater than 100m).
Hahaha
yourule40 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 08:28 AM   #6
mailman
TRF Moderator & SubLV41 2024 Patron
 
mailman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: .
Watch: 126610LN
Posts: 35,510
Whichever one you like better.
__________________
JJ
mailman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28 July 2016, 03:37 AM   #7
masyv6
2024 Pledge Member
 
masyv6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Real Name: Mike
Location: 35000ft
Posts: 3,771
Quote:
Originally Posted by mailman View Post
Whichever one you like better.
I agree. Don't listen to what random guys on the internet say. You should go try them both on and decide which one you like more.

That being said, go with the Sub. I'm biased though... *checks time on no-date SubC*
masyv6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 08:30 AM   #8
brandrea
2024 SubLV41 Pledge Member
 
brandrea's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Real Name: Brian (TBone)
Location: canada
Watch: es make me smile
Posts: 78,120
Two very different references. The Submariner gives you an uncluttered dial and arguably superior aesthetics. The GMT give you a couple of added and very useful complications.

I'd go Sub if it were my first. Good luck deciding
brandrea is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 09:09 AM   #9
AK797
2024 Pledge Member
 
AK797's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Real Name: Neil
Location: UK
Watch: ing ships roll in
Posts: 59,369
Quote:
Originally Posted by brandrea View Post
Two very different references. The Submariner gives you an uncluttered dial and arguably superior aesthetics. The GMT give you a couple of added and very useful complications.

I'd go Sub if it were my first. Good luck deciding
AK797 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 08:33 AM   #10
Bobby Bushcraft
"TRF" Member
 
Bobby Bushcraft's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Real Name: Bobby
Location: Phoenix Area
Watch: Sea Dweller SD4K
Posts: 174
Your probably going to get 50/50 on the responses I would go with a GMT
Bobby Bushcraft is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 09:09 AM   #11
enjoythemusic
2024 Pledge Member
 
enjoythemusic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Real Name: Steven
Location: Glocal
Posts: 21,185
I vote yes.

Yes to the.....
__________________
__________________

----> Was Great Seeing Everyone At The TRF December 9 Tampa Meetup <----
https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=968133

Love timepieces and want to become a Watchmaker? Rolex has a sensational school.
www.RolexWatchmakingTrainingCenter.com/

Sent from my Etch A Sketch using String Theory.
enjoythemusic is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 09:28 AM   #12
mtgjr
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Real Name: Mike
Location: Tampa, Florida
Watch: Pepsi GMT
Posts: 2,926
5-digit GMT, yes. Otherwise, Sub. No PCLs for me.

By the way, is there a non-Oyster Perpetual GMT?
mtgjr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 10:48 AM   #13
steve-az
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Scottsdale
Posts: 75
Save yourself the anxiety...get both.
steve-az is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 11:16 AM   #14
droptopman
"TRF" Member
 
droptopman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Real Name: Mark
Location: Washington State
Watch: SUBS and GMT's!
Posts: 9,664
^^^many do end up with both.
GMT wears a touch flatter. Both are great watches.
For a 6 digit I probably prefer the no date Sub.
__________________
Judge Smails: Ty, what did you shoot today?
Ty: Oh, Judge, I don't keep score.
Judge Smails: Then how do you measure yourself with other golfers?
Ty: By height.
droptopman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 11:24 AM   #15
B.B.B.
"TRF" Member
 
B.B.B.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Real Name: Emmanuel
Location: California, USA
Watch: submariner lv m
Posts: 764
Had both. 114060 all the way.
B.B.B. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 12:01 PM   #16
speedolex
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: NYC
Posts: 1,231
Quote:
Originally Posted by yourule40 View Post
I'm deciding between getting the Oyster Perpetual GMT-Master II or the 114060 Submariner. What do you guys think?
Unless you're a pilot or a diver, same watch, one is available in festive colors, one is not. Simple as that.
speedolex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 03:12 PM   #17
CRM114
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: HK & USA
Watch: GMTs,1803, 16610LV
Posts: 2,001
Quote:
Originally Posted by speedolex View Post
Unless you're a pilot or a diver, same watch, one is available in festive colors, one is not. Simple as that.
Different cases, different lugs, different movements, one has a date the other doesn't, one has a 24 hr hand the other doesn't, different bezel markings/operation/function, one can display 3 time zones at once the other can display only 1, different bracelets....

But yeah, apart from those obvious 6 or 8 functional and/or aesthetic differences, same watch.
CRM114 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 03:52 PM   #18
AzHadEnuf
"TRF" Member
 
AzHadEnuf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Real Name: Ralph
Location: Tucson, Arizona
Watch: 6263,DJ,SUB,BB,THR
Posts: 2,043
Quote:
Originally Posted by CRM114 View Post
Different cases, different lugs, different movements, one has a date the other doesn't, one has a 24 hr hand the other doesn't, different bezel markings/operation/function, one can display 3 time zones at once the other can display only 1, different bracelets....

But yeah, apart from those obvious 6 or 8 functional and/or aesthetic differences, same watch.
Too funny. But one does have festive colors & one doesn't.
__________________
"The only reason for time is so that everything doesn't happen at once." -A. Einstein
AzHadEnuf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28 July 2016, 12:09 AM   #19
speedolex
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: NYC
Posts: 1,231
Quote:
Originally Posted by CRM114 View Post
Different cases, different lugs, different movements, one has a date the other doesn't, one has a 24 hr hand the other doesn't, different bezel markings/operation/function, one can display 3 time zones at once the other can display only 1, different bracelets....

But yeah, apart from those obvious 6 or 8 functional and/or aesthetic differences, same watch.


Yeah, yeah, yeah, I get what's going on under the hood if one is a professional pilot or seafaring treasure hunter.

But no one uses them that way. They're male fashion jewelry. And as such, from 3 feet away either on a wrist or in a display case, to the average person it's the same look- one has a splash of color and one doesn't. Having both a Sub and a GMT in a collection is redundant, you pick the one that fits your fashion and your lifestyle the most.

I spend my days in boardrooms as an executive and my weekends in SUV's as a soccer dad, the Submariner works with a business suit or a t-shirt. The GMT and it's fanciful bezel colors doesn't work in the boardroom, can clash if I'm wearing the wrong color t-shirt. I need my watches to work with any and all attire; the GMT takes too much coordination to pull off each day.
speedolex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28 July 2016, 06:12 AM   #20
mtgjr
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Real Name: Mike
Location: Tampa, Florida
Watch: Pepsi GMT
Posts: 2,926
Quote:
Originally Posted by speedolex View Post


Yeah, yeah, yeah, I get what's going on under the hood if one is a professional pilot or seafaring treasure hunter.

But no one uses them that way. They're male fashion jewelry. And as such, from 3 feet away either on a wrist or in a display case, to the average person it's the same look- one has a splash of color and one doesn't. Having both a Sub and a GMT in a collection is redundant, you pick the one that fits your fashion and your lifestyle the most.

I spend my days in boardrooms as an executive and my weekends in SUV's as a soccer dad, the Submariner works with a business suit or a t-shirt. The GMT and it's fanciful bezel colors doesn't work in the boardroom, can clash if I'm wearing the wrong color t-shirt. I need my watches to work with any and all attire; the GMT takes too much coordination to pull off each day.
If you own the 16710 pictured, you can simply pick up the black bezel insert for around $100, and a 2-minute DIY swap makes the point above moot. For this reason, I'd argue it's the GMT that is most versatile. Three watches in one, and all that. Don't get me wrong, I love the Sub too. I just wouldn't select it over the GMT for the reason of maximun versatility.
mtgjr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28 July 2016, 07:01 AM   #21
speedolex
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: NYC
Posts: 1,231
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtgjr View Post
If you own the 16710 pictured, you can simply pick up the black bezel insert for around $100, and a 2-minute DIY swap makes the point above moot. For this reason, I'd argue it's the GMT that is most versatile. Three watches in one, and all that. Don't get me wrong, I love the Sub too. I just wouldn't select it over the GMT for the reason of maximun versatility.
Not my watches pictured, but I was on the fence at one point about picking up a 16710 just as a Submariner changeup on weekends, would have gone Pepsi as it goes with jeans and casual attire nicely. But in the end, photos like this one punctuated just how identical the two watches are in appearance, it isn't a good use of my fun money to tie up six large in a redundant watch.

Even though I am a world-traveler, I never need to know more than what time it is back home, so multiple zones and the 24 hour hand don't really mean anything to me, they just clutter up the dial and bezel beyond my liking.

A Submariner can also function decently as a second timezone watch; by turning the noon triangle to the hour differential (ie if home is 6 hours behind move from 12 to 6 position) you can visualize the hour it is back home, the minute hand is read verbatim.
speedolex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28 July 2016, 02:02 PM   #22
CRM114
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: HK & USA
Watch: GMTs,1803, 16610LV
Posts: 2,001
Quote:
Originally Posted by speedolex View Post


Yeah, yeah, yeah, I get what's going on under the hood if one is a professional pilot or seafaring treasure hunter.

But no one uses them that way. They're male fashion jewelry. And as such, from 3 feet away either on a wrist or in a display case, to the average person it's the same look- one has a splash of color and one doesn't. Having both a Sub and a GMT in a collection is redundant, you pick the one that fits your fashion and your lifestyle the most.

I spend my days in boardrooms as an executive and my weekends in SUV's as a soccer dad, the Submariner works with a business suit or a t-shirt. The GMT and it's fanciful bezel colors doesn't work in the boardroom, can clash if I'm wearing the wrong color t-shirt. I need my watches to work with any and all attire; the GMT takes too much coordination to pull off each day.
The 16610 Sub Date you've pictured is not the modern Sub ref the OP's asked about, the 114060. If you're going bother to do a visual comparison and claim "same watch" at least find photos of the correct ref(s) for each.

The Sub the OP referred to (unlike the one you pictured) has no date function/cyclops. On the other hand, every GMT Master has a date/cyclops. The case/lug differences (thicker/blockier/fatter) of modern version Subs vs older versions, and vs GMTs old and new are not merely noticeable, but obvious.

Harping about "festive colors" (and the supposed trouble of coordinating them with clothes or situation) as a big factor in decision-making is an error you've been informed about but seem to always forget; for the last 40+ years GMT Masters/Master IIs have been available with all-black, LN bezels. The modern, standard 116710 comes with an all-black LN bezel. The idea that one must buy a GMT Master II with a colored "festive" bezel is 100% wrong. It becomes a false premise and therefore a fallacy to ignore this easy and obvious availability when urging someone to make a decision based-on such undisputable wrongness.

As for "under the hood", the ability for a watch to DISPLAY 2 or 3 time zones simultaneously is precisely why the GMT Master was invented. To call a readily-visible display capability "under the hood" is utterly oxymoronic. You may as well say having the date feature is also "under the hood".

Contrary to your notion that your Sub is "fashion jewellery" because you've personally found it's inherent functional, dive watch forte' (superior WR rating) useless to your own life and therefore fashion is the only reason you wear one, not everyone else finds a date and/or extra time zone display features of a GMT Master useless to theirs.

It seems you're on a quest to assign everyone else your own superficial motivation for wearing a Sub in order to ignore the watches' different physical characteristics and capabilities. One certainly don't have to be a professional pilot to enjoy or find the forte' of the GMT Master useful on a day-to-day basis no matter how many times you repeatedly declare, with absolutely no authority, that "Nobody uses them that way". Belabour your idea of the "sameness" between GMT and Sub all you want in your effort to equate fashion motivation/wearing something that's tool aspect is useless to you with everyone else's, when the reality of differences in form, function, and usefulness of timekeeping display features for anyone not wearing flippers or outside your own head is much different.

The funny thing is, the one thing where they are the same (color of bezel due to LN bezel option for GMTs) is the one thing you keep insisting is the only difference worthy of supposedly being a great factor in decision-making between the two.
CRM114 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28 July 2016, 11:33 PM   #23
speedolex
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: NYC
Posts: 1,231
Quote:
Originally Posted by CRM114 View Post
The 16610 Sub Date you've pictured is not the modern Sub ref the OP's asked about, the 114060. If you're going bother to do a visual comparison and claim "same watch" at least find photos of the correct ref(s) for each.

The Sub the OP referred to (unlike the one you pictured) has no date function/cyclops. On the other hand, every GMT Master has a date/cyclops. The case/lug differences (thicker/blockier/fatter) of modern version Subs vs older versions, and vs GMTs old and new are not merely noticeable, but obvious.

Harping about "festive colors" (and the supposed trouble of coordinating them with clothes or situation) as a big factor in decision-making is an error you've been informed about but seem to always forget; for the last 40+ years GMT Masters/Master IIs have been available with all-black, LN bezels. The modern, standard 116710 comes with an all-black LN bezel. The idea that one must buy a GMT Master II with a colored "festive" bezel is 100% wrong. It becomes a false premise and therefore a fallacy to ignore this easy and obvious availability when urging someone to make a decision based-on such undisputable wrongness.

As for "under the hood", the ability for a watch to DISPLAY 2 or 3 time zones simultaneously is precisely why the GMT Master was invented. To call a readily-visible display capability "under the hood" is utterly oxymoronic. You may as well say having the date feature is also "under the hood".

Contrary to your notion that your Sub is "fashion jewellery" because you've personally found it's inherent functional, dive watch forte' (superior WR rating) useless to your own life and therefore fashion is the only reason you wear one, not everyone else finds a date and/or extra time zone display features of a GMT Master useless to theirs.

It seems you're on a quest to assign everyone else your own superficial motivation for wearing a Sub in order to ignore the watches' different physical characteristics and capabilities. One certainly don't have to be a professional pilot to enjoy or find the forte' of the GMT Master useful on a day-to-day basis no matter how many times you repeatedly declare, with absolutely no authority, that "Nobody uses them that way". Belabour your idea of the "sameness" between GMT and Sub all you want in your effort to equate fashion motivation/wearing something that's tool aspect is useless to you with everyone else's, when the reality of differences in form, function, and usefulness of timekeeping display features for anyone not wearing flippers or outside your own head is much different.

The funny thing is, the one thing where they are the same (color of bezel due to LN bezel option for GMTs) is the one thing you keep insisting is the only difference worthy of supposedly being a great factor in decision-making between the two.
Again, you're noodling in the deep-details and that wasn't my point.

My point is that if the OP is simply looking for a nice Rolex sport model and is not a diver or a pilot and merely wants a nice looking wristwatch, from 5 feet away the difference between the Submariner and the GMT is that the GMT offers colorful bezels if one is inclined to find them a good differentiator. My Lord, the amount of time you GMT people spend debating blue vs. burgundy bezels, yellowed vs. white markers, Oyster vs. Jubilee bracelets, "Coke" vs. "Batman". If 90% of your time is spent discussing styling, well, there's the reason the GMT has that perception as the "colorful stylish Submariner".

If one ignores the feature differences it's a matter of styling, no different than comparing a Pepsi GMT to a Coke GMT. For those who just want a colorless bezel, the bonus of a black Submariner over a black GMT is a far less busy bezel and a far less busy dial.
speedolex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 01:34 PM   #24
WS9D
"TRF" Member
 
WS9D's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Real Name: Steve
Location: Shasta
Watch: es..More Watches!
Posts: 2,415
gmt
WS9D is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 01:39 PM   #25
GMT Fan 23
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: California
Posts: 17
GMT all black
GMT Fan 23 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 01:38 PM   #26
BNA/LION
2024 SubLV41 Pledge Member
 
BNA/LION's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Real Name: Larry
Location: San Diego, CA
Watch: ROLEX
Posts: 25,654
You will probably have both eventually if you hang out here long enough so, the one you like best right now.
__________________

✦ 28238 President DD 18K/YG ✦ 16610LN SS Sub ✦ 16613 18K/SS Serti ✦ 16550 Exp II Non-Rail Cream Dial ✦ Daytona C 116500 ✦ 126710 BLRO GMT-Master II ✦ NEXT-->?
Hole In One! 10/3/19 DMCC 5th hole, par 3, 168 yards w/ 4-Iron.
BNA/LION is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 01:49 PM   #27
Chadridv
2024 Pledge Member
 
Chadridv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Real Name: Chadri
Location: LI, NY
Watch: 116610LV
Posts: 11,357
Will this be your one and only? What else do you have and do you plan to collect more down the road? These answers will help get you the best advice.
Chadridv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 01:51 PM   #28
Hairdude1
"TRF" Member
 
Hairdude1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Real Name: Alex
Location: Chicago
Watch: AP,PP, Rolex
Posts: 37,156
Gmt
__________________
Instagram: @Hairdude
Watches in Collection 5070R, 5522A, 214270 MK1, 228238

16750, 26401, 5711, 116718, 116710LN, 116300, 16710"Coke", 372, 15300, 15703 (All Flipped)
Official Member "Perpetual 30" Las Vegas GTG 2016
Official Member "WIS-CON" Las Vegas International GTG 2017
Official Member 'WIS-CON' Las Vegas Int'l GTG 2018
Hairdude1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 02:39 PM   #29
silverbullet818
"TRF" Member
 
silverbullet818's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Canada
Posts: 839
GMT first.... sub second acquisition.

Then you keep going til you have them all!!!!
silverbullet818 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 July 2016, 03:59 PM   #30
PatrickJ
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: England
Posts: 456
Get both. If it was me I would get Submariner if I could only have one. You can't go wrong either way.
PatrickJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Wrist Aficionado

My Watch LLC

WatchesOff5th

DavidSW Watches

Takuya Watches

OCWatches


*Banners Of The Month*
This space is provided to horological resources.





Copyright ©2004-2024, The Rolex Forums. All Rights Reserved.

ROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEX

Rolex is a registered trademark of ROLEX USA. The Rolex Forums is not affiliated with ROLEX USA in any way.