Legit Check on this Ceramic Submariner

[Schafer94]

Can anyone tell from these pictures if this ceramic submariner is legit? I'll try and get box and paper pictures soon.

[aleeboy]

Lighting is very poor. Without better photos, I feel that the watch is suspect as the ceramic bezel has absolutely no glow to it.

You should work off higher resolution as the Rolex finishing is something only Rolex can do and it's all in the details.

[Schafer94]

Thanks Alee! I'll see if I can get him to send higher quality photos and pictures of the box and papers!

[123Blueface]

My two cents?
Lousy photos invariably equals a concern.
That bezel and date do not look right.

[Schafer94]

Originally Posted by 123Blueface

My two cents?
Lousy photos invariably equals a concern.
That bezel and date do not look right.

100% Agree with the bit about lousy photos. I asked for higher quality photos. I'm awaiting his reply.

[Schafer94]

Here are two more pictures. Waiting on the closeup of the dial picture.

[123Blueface]

Did he send you any other photos?
That could be a totally different watch for all we know.
I would ask for a photo showing a piece of paper with some information like today's date to ensure those photos weren't "borrowed".

[crowncollection]

It's fake


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[Schafer94]

Originally Posted by crowncollection

It's fake


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What makes you say that?

[tommy91]

Originally Posted by Schafer94

What makes you say that?

He's most defiantly correct it's fake.

[123Blueface]

Originally Posted by Schafer94

What makes you say that?

Lots. Won't be discussed here.
Your last photo gives it away even more but I suggested a photo with Date so we could have yet more to figure out if they even have this garbage.

[Schafer94]

Thanks! I appreciate all the help :)

[rolexkidd]

fake......do a little bit of research on the "tells" of a fake sub (especially ceramic) and you will be able to tell yourself. Fakes are too good now to make any decisions on low resolution photos. Plus, they come with "papers" anymore

[Kingface66]

Originally Posted by 123Blueface

Lots. Won't be discussed here.
Your last photo gives it away even more but I suggested a photo with Date so we could have yet more to figure out if they even have this garbage.

Originally Posted by rolexkidd

fake......do a little bit of research on the "tells" of a fake sub (especially ceramic) and you will be able to tell yourself. Fakes are too good now to make any decisions on low resolution photos. Plus, they come with "papers" anymore

With respect to my esteemed colleagues, honestly, why not discuss it here? I can't believe for a minute that some operation in the Far East producing fake Rolexes is really laboriously going through the WatchOut subforum here for tips on how to improve their wares. Plus, at the very least, they could do what you suggest by "doing a little bit of research."
They are past that.
And, as a result, helping buyers here know what to look for and what to avoid by arming them with the tools to do just that "won't be discussed"? This belief that we're protecting the brand is getting absurd. We should be arming each other with knowledge to prevent us from being ripped off.

[Chewbacca]

Originally Posted by Kingface66

With respect to my esteemed colleagues, honestly, why not discuss it here? I can't believe for a minute that some operation in the Far East producing fake Rolexes is really laboriously going through the WatchOut subforum here for tips on how to improve their wares. Plus, at the very least, they could do what you suggest by "doing a little bit of research."
They are past that.
And, as a result, helping buyers here know what to look for and what to avoid by arming them with the tools to do just that "won't be discussed"? This belief that we're protecting the brand is getting absurd. We should be arming each other with knowledge to prevent us from being ripped off.

with all due respect andy, i was burned in my earlier collecting days, and i was once also on your side of the discussion, i even mentioned where the 'tells' were on fakes -- but not any longer.

how many Register-Ask-Disappear, and casual members have ever openly said where they got their "Rolex" from; beyond the BS friend, dead relative, found its...? (i'll give you 5min)... nothing? same here. Or try asking for the email address of the sender of poor images or questionable provenance? ... still nothing.

for a fair, mutually beneficial experience, the people who ask also need to disclose the full W5H of the watch and image origin. until then, they should be satisfied with simple answers.

to be frank, thats all they need. close ended reply to a close end question. If they want an education, they need to reciprocate in order to protect the entire community. (And, we're not protecting the rolex brand, we're protecting our assets by doing so.).

so, go ahead, ask the OP to name the store, person or whatever that's trying to sell that to him/her. ask... you'll get nothing substantive or verifiable. and, that's not a judgement on the OP, its just the way the web works. its smoke and mirrors and we adapt. no harm, no foul.

now, as you being an owner of what appears to be a vintage rolex (nice btw), you should know better than anyone that there are people who modify junk to sell as vintage, and not just from the "far east". its everywhere, and its a problem.

again, no disrespect intended, and i get what you're getting at, its just the rationale thats wrong.

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by Chewbacca

with all due respect andy, i was burned in my earlier collecting days, and i was once also on your side of the discussion, i even mentioned where the 'tells' were on fakes -- but not any longer.

how many Register-Ask-Disappear, and casual members have ever openly said where they got their "Rolex" from; beyond the BS friend, dead relative, found its...? (i'll give you 5min)... nothing? same here. Or try asking for the email address of the sender of poor images or questionable provenance? ... still nothing.

for a fair, mutually beneficial experience, the people who ask also need to disclose the full W5H of the watch and image origin. until then, they should be satisfied with simple answers.

to be frank, thats all they need. close ended reply to a close end question. If they want an education, they need to reciprocate in order to protect the entire community. (And, we're not protecting the rolex brand, we're protecting our assets by doing so.).

so, go ahead, ask the OP to name the store, person or whatever that's trying to sell that to him/her. ask... you'll get nothing substantive or verifiable. and, that's not a judgement on the OP, its just the way the web works. its smoke and mirrors and we adapt. no harm, no foul.

now, as you being an owner of what appears to be a vintage rolex (nice btw), you should know better than anyone that there are people who modify junk to sell as vintage, and not just from the "far east". its everywhere, and its a problem.

again, no disrespect intended, and i get what you're getting at, its just the rationale thats wrong.

in torn on this. I am really interested in learning how to spot fakes better but get that discussing it helps the fakers.

Im not into used or vintage watches to buy at all, but am just interested in general to broaden my general knowledge about all things watches. This side of collecting, i am totally ignorant on. Some are easy and some are super hard to tell.

It seems also that someone can just say "fake" with no justification as to why, but with the same picture, i can't tell at all if its real or not. Because of that, i don't learn anything.

In all seriousness, what is the best way to learn?

[123Blueface]

Here is an example of why can't provide too much info.
Clearly this OP knew it was fake and came here to learn if he could pass this off.
https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=543795

[Chewbacca]

Originally Posted by tyler1980

in torn on this. I am really interested in learning how to spot fakes better but get that discussing it helps the fakers.

Im not into used or vintage watches to buy at all, but am just interested in general to broaden my general knowledge about all things watches. This side of collecting, i am totally ignorant on. Some are easy and some are super hard to tell.

It seems also that someone can just say "fake" with no justification as to why, but with the same picture, i can't tell at all if its real or not. Because of that, i don't learn anything.

In all seriousness, what is the best way to learn?

fwiw, all the info is out there. on the googles, here, on older threads (don't bump), other forums, and you can always PM TS' and mods for more info if you're ready to make a buying decision. the main thing is just trying to not contribute too much in open forum going further, as the fakes and scammers get more sophisticated.

[tommy91]

Originally Posted by Chewbacca

with all due respect andy, i was burned in my earlier collecting days, and i was once also on your side of the discussion, i even mentioned where the 'tells' were on fakes -- but not any longer.

how many Register-Ask-Disappear, and casual members have ever openly said where they got their "Rolex" from; beyond the BS friend, dead relative, found its...? (i'll give you 5min)... nothing? same here. Or try asking for the email address of the sender of poor images or questionable provenance? ... still nothing.

for a fair, mutually beneficial experience, the people who ask also need to disclose the full W5H of the watch and image origin. until then, they should be satisfied with simple answers.

to be frank, thats all they need. close ended reply to a close end question. If they want an education, they need to reciprocate in order to protect the entire community. (And, we're not protecting the rolex brand, we're protecting our assets by doing so.).

so, go ahead, ask the OP to name the store, person or whatever that's trying to sell that to him/her. ask... you'll get nothing substantive or verifiable. and, that's not a judgement on the OP, its just the way the web works. its smoke and mirrors and we adapt. no harm, no foul.

now, as you being an owner of what appears to be a vintage rolex (nice btw), you should know better than anyone that there are people who modify junk to sell as vintage, and not just from the "far east". its everywhere, and its a problem.

again, no disrespect intended, and i get what you're getting at, its just the rationale thats wrong.

Couldn't of said it better myself. If they ask a simple question they should get a simple answer

[mjclark32]

Originally Posted by Kingface66

With respect to my esteemed colleagues, honestly, why not discuss it here? I can't believe for a minute that some operation in the Far East producing fake Rolexes is really laboriously going through the WatchOut subforum here for tips on how to improve their wares. Plus, at the very least, they could do what you suggest by "doing a little bit of research."
They are past that.
And, as a result, helping buyers here know what to look for and what to avoid by arming them with the tools to do just that "won't be discussed"? This belief that we're protecting the brand is getting absurd. We should be arming each other with knowledge to prevent us from being ripped off.

If one does enough research they'll be able to spot the fakes themselves, especially in person.
We don't need to give the counterfeiters an edge of how we're spotting their POS's. Maybe they're combing through the forums, maybe they're not, but why give any, potential, help

OP, I agree with the consensus, walk away

[AK797]

No good

[superstarmar]

It's bad... run

[Gtecko]

I agree with the comment that this could be two different photo and the second (super zoomed) one doesn't tell much at all ... if those are the only pictures you were given, I wouldn't waste time.
a confident seller would give you anything you request and more... not a zoomed in bad quality paper warranty

[kauffee]

I'm trying to learn more too. From that first set of pictures, staring at them compared to the sub date on my wrist I can't see a bit of difference. Even the details of the glidelock look correct. Like someone mentioned above, I didn't think any SubCs came with "papers." I was under the impression that the SubC was after the switch to the warranty card. But that doesn't necessarily make the watch, itself, a fake.

[123Blueface]

Originally Posted by kauffee

I'm trying to learn more too. From that first set of pictures, staring at them compared to the sub date on my wrist I can't see a bit of difference. Even the details of the glidelock look correct. Like someone mentioned above, I didn't think any SubCs came with "papers." I was under the impression that the SubC was after the switch to the warranty card. But that doesn't necessarily make the watch, itself, a fake.

There are some incredibly real looking fakes out there.
Why would this watch need fake supporting paperwork?
That alone speaks volumes.

[kauffee]

Originally Posted by 123Blueface

There are some incredibly real looking fakes out there.
Why would this watch need fake supporting paperwork?
That alone speaks volumes.

True. Now that I look again, I agree with you on the date wheel. That doesn't look right at all.

[cda555]

Would someone be willing to PM me what is wrong with this one? I think I can see a couple of things, but not 100% certain. I am always curious to know more about these things. I think I have been around long enough here to ensure I am not going to start a counterfeit watch ring