How do you feel about....

[City74]

In searching for my first Rolex I have come across something that bothers me. Why is it that many 2nd hand dealers on here and other sites charge more for using your credit card? No brick and mortar stores do this. It gives me the feeling that they are a “second rate” business. I’m not saying they are, as many have superb reputations and honestly I would buy from them and even pay the fees, although I wouldn’t be happy about it. It’s just the feeling it gives me having to pay more to use a credit card. Yes I know about margins and such but to me fees and that sort of thing are part of the cost of doing business.

How does everyone else feel about this?

BTW, please do not read this as an insult to sellers who do charge more for credit card use. I’m NOT saying they aren’t good sellers or junk businesses. I’m simply stating the feeling I personally get for paying more to use a credit card

[dmash]

You’re completely misunderstanding the price is your error. They’re not adding a premium to pay with a credit card. They’re simply discounting 3% if you pay via transfer and showcasing this price to begin with as everybody pays that way.

Most every good AD will do the exact same thing, as their bottom line remains the same.

[Abdullah71601]

Originally Posted by dmash

You’re completely misunderstanding the price is your error. They’re not adding a premium to pay with a credit card. They’re simply discounting 3% if you pay via transfer and showcasing this price to begin with as everybody pays that way.

Most every good AD will do the exact same thing, as their bottom line remains the same.

I disagree. Their price is posted. They charge back the credit card and paypal fees. It's not the customary way of doing business in most of the consumer world.

AD's may discount for paying cash. But you can't rely on that.

[dmash]

Originally Posted by Abdullah71601

I disagree. Their price is posted. They charge back the credit card and paypal fees. It's not the customary way of doing business in most of the consumer world.

AD's may discount for paying cash. But you can't rely on that.

There’s plenty of examples where this applies and ‘cash price’ is given. They are simply marketing the best price and giving you the option. They’re pocketing the same thing either way.

This is like arguing ‘id rather not have the option of BP giving me 2.50 cash and 2.57 credit card on my gas purchases, id simply rather them just charge me 2.57 for all purchases’.

It’s not like these retailers are trying to pull a fast one, it’s always explicitly detailed.

[Abdullah71601]

Originally Posted by dmash

There’s plenty of examples where this applies and ‘cash price’ is given. They are simply marketing the best price and giving you the option. They’re pocketing the same thing either way.

This is like arguing ‘id rather not have the option of BP giving me 2.50 cash and 2.57 credit card on my gas purchases, id simply rather them just charge me 2.57 for all purchases’.

It’s not like these retailers are trying to pull a fast one, it’s always explicitly detailed.

Most businesses build the fees into their price.

The watch pricing is more entrepreneurial than most places you would use a CC. These guys all started out small and the fees are a pretty big chunk of a luxury watch sale. They are simply breaking even on the fees. There's nothing wrong with it, it's just not customary in the consumer world.

[City74]

Originally Posted by dmash

There’s plenty of examples where this applies and ‘cash price’ is given. They are simply marketing the best price and giving you the option. They’re pocketing the same thing either way.

This is like arguing ‘id rather not have the option of BP giving me 2.50 cash and 2.57 credit card on my gas purchases, id simply rather them just charge me 2.57 for all purchases’.

It’s not like these retailers are trying to pull a fast one, it’s always explicitly detailed.

I’m fine with paying the $2.57 for gas with credit card, the thing is the cash price is the same. These dealers aren’t doing that

[dmash]

Originally Posted by City74

I’m fine with paying the $2.57 for gas with credit card, the thing is the cash price is the same. These dealers aren’t doing that

So you’re seriously saying, ‘id Rather not have an option to save money’.



Um, yeah, ok

[City74]

Originally Posted by Abdullah71601

I disagree. Their price is posted. They charge back the credit card and paypal fees. It's not the customary way of doing business in most of the consumer world.

AD's may discount for paying cash. But you can't rely on that.

Yep, I agree

[City74]

Originally Posted by dmash

You’re completely misunderstanding the price is your error. They’re not adding a premium to pay with a credit card. They’re simply discounting 3% if you pay via transfer and showcasing this price to begin with as everybody pays that way.

Most every good AD will do the exact same thing, as their bottom line remains the same.

I don’t agree. No other sort of business does it this way that I know of

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by City74

How does everyone else feel about this?

100% fine by me. Any smart business person / buyer knows the situation is under the BUYERS control in how much 'discount' they are seeking and 'service' they desire on taking a CC payment

Said another way, CC fees matter not as it is the end-results that's the same. It is YOU who chooses how much 'discount' you want and if you want to pay your CC for their money lending services. No smart business person (or someone with 3rd grade knowledge of math) would expect the seller to offer both a super duper low price AND take CC as payment that costs the dealer ~3%.


Kinda related, here's food for thought.

Pick Any Two
1. High Quality Product
2. Low Price
3. Great Customer Service

[City74]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

100% fine by me. Any smart business person / buyer knows the situation is under the BUYERS control in how much 'discount' they are seeking and 'service' they desire on taking a CC payment

Said another way, CC fees matter not as it is the end-results that's the same. It is YOU who chooses how much 'discount' you want and if you want to pay your CC for their money lending services. No smart business person (or someone with 3rd grade knowledge of math) would expect the seller to offer both a super duper low price AND take CC as payment that costs the dealer ~3%.


Kinda related, here's food for thought.

Pick Any Two
1. High Quality Product
2. Low Price
3. Great Customer Service

So Sam Walton wasn’t a smart business person? Maybe it’s just me and my 2nd grade math knowledge

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by City74

So Sam Walton wasn’t a smart business person? Maybe it’s just me and my 2nd grade math knowledge

Perhaps my post did have a bit of oversimplification. Am sure you're incredibly smart and knew the overall sentiment of my previous post. Of course Sam had many 'moving parts' to make his plan work, yet you have a good idea! We need to do a group buy of 20 watches for that extra Sams Club discount. Let's buy Rolexs in bulk and cut out as many 'middlemen' as possible while squeezing the manufacturer as much as possible. Sweet idea, that'll work! :)

PS: Ever notice how the CC terminal default at Sams Club and WalMart is DEBIT and not credit (when you use a debit/Visa card). They know that having their POS terminal defaulting to DEBIT, if you use default DEBIT and enter your pin# they save CC fees versus you choosing credit.

[fskywalker]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

PS: Ever notice how the CC terminal default at Sams Club and WalMart is DEBIT and not credit (when you use a debit/Visa card). They know that having their POS terminal defaulting to DEBIT, if you use default DEBIT and enter your pin# they save CC fees versus you choosing credit.

Smart!


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[dmash]

So I ask you both the same thing. You’re really saying, you’d really not have a cheaper option to pay cash/bank transfer?

[City74]

Originally Posted by dmash

So I ask you both the same thing. You’re really saying, you’d really not have a cheaper option to pay cash/bank transfer?

Correct. First, I won’t send a bank transfer to anyone especially a “small business” that can’t even absorb CC fees. Next I pay with CC because in the end I save more money with cash back or points or the like

[c41006]

Originally Posted by City74

Correct. First, I won’t send a bank transfer to anyone especially a “small business” that can’t even absorb CC fees. Next I pay with CC because in the end I save more money with cash back or points or the like

So if a seller has a watch for sale for $10,000 cash or $10,300 credit you’d rather them just price the watch at $10,300 regardless of how you pay? Then you earn your points/cash back making the whole thing a wash. I don’t get it.

Maybe they should just increase all their prices by 3% and the customers can ask for a cash discount when in communication with the seller

Personally I have absolutely no issue with them posting cash prices and paying an extra 3% if I want to use a card. I can see where you are coming from though as it isn’t the way it’s usually done in other businesses.

[dmash]

Originally Posted by c41006

So if a seller has a watch for sale for $10,000 cash or $10,300 credit you’d rather them just price the watch at $10,300 regardless of how you pay? Then you earn your points/cash back making the whole thing a wash. I don’t get it.

Maybe they should just increase all their prices by 3% and the customers can ask for a cash discount when in communication with the seller

Personally I have absolutely no issue with them posting cash prices and paying an extra 3% if I want to use a card. I can see where you are coming from though as it isn’t the way it’s usually done in other businesses.

This makes too much sense I guess. I tried to convey this in multiple postings and OP just got upset.

Who cares if it’s cash price and +3% for credit card, or ‘normal price’ and 3% discount for cash. It’s the EXACT same thing. That’s quite petty if you’re going to get held up on the wording.

[Abdullah71601]

Originally Posted by dmash

This makes too much sense I guess. I tried to convey this in multiple postings and OP just got upset.

Who cares if it’s cash price or +3% for credit card, or ‘normal price’ then 3% discount for cash. It’s the EXACT same thing. That’s quite petty if you’re going to get held up on the wording.

No you ddn’t. You said the wire price was a discount. It isn’t. The CC price is an added fee. It’s not the customary way of doing business with a CC, and everybody knows it.

[City74]

Originally Posted by c41006

So if a seller has a watch for sale for $10,000 cash or $10,300 credit you’d rather them just price the watch at $10,300 regardless of how you pay? Then you earn your points/cash back making the whole thing a wash. I don’t get it.

Maybe they should just increase all their prices by 3% and the customers can ask for a cash discount when in communication with the seller

Personally I have absolutely no issue with them posting cash prices and paying an extra 3% if I want to use a card. I can see where you are coming from though as it isn’t the way it’s usually done in other businesses.

I’d tell em 10k and I use my card or its a no go

[c41006]

Originally Posted by City74

I’d tell em 10k and I use my card or its a no go

The point is you’ll always get a better price if you pay cash. If you prefer to use your credit card that’s totally fine but you’ll have to pay for it one way or another.

[twitch54]

Originally Posted by dmash

So I ask you both the same thing. You’re really saying, you’d really not have a cheaper option to pay cash/bank transfer?

of course we would, we just don't want to be penalized and pay more when using a CC

[City74]

Originally Posted by twitch54

of course we would, we just don't want to be penalized and pay more when using a CC

Yep,exactly

[TheVTCGuy]

You asked “how do you feel...” To answer your question, I have no problem with it. The seller has to pay fees and probably has more hassle with a cc purchase, the prices are not secretive, they are stated up front, and I am given the choice. I believe CC fees are in the area of 3%, so why ask the seller to reduce his price by that much? Which effectively is what you are requesting. You are the buyer, if you do not accept that price, don’t buy.

[City74]

Originally Posted by TheVTCGuy

You asked “how do you feel...” To answer your question, I have no problem with it. The seller has to pay fees and probably has more hassle with a cc purchase, the prices are not secretive, they are stated up front, and I am given the choice. I believe CC fees are in the area of 3%, so why ask the seller to reduce his price by that much? Which effectively is what you are requesting. You are the buyer, if you do not accept that price, don’t buy.

I can see your point. I guess since having an option and the cash or credit prices are different it strikes me as odd. If I were to buy from any of them I would ask for the cash price even if paying by CC. If they couldn’t do that then I would most likely not buy. Again no knock on these sellers. It’s just my frame of mind I guess


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[brandrea]

I think what’s driving this is that the credit card fees and bank fees are shown as a separate line on the income statement. If the business owner sees 3% fees on say a million dollars in sales it’s not in significant.

My accountant approached me last year, showing what our business spent in Credit card feees and suggested we add the fees in a simsilar way. I told her I’d have nothing to do with it. Bottom line is, the customer is paying for the product and nowadays credit card is the preferred method of payment. I’d rather see it built into the price, than say to my customer ... “I want you want you to buy my product and by the way, if you use a credit card it’ll costyou extra.”

Bottom line, it’s always irked me when I see an extra charge added to cover credit card fee and IMO, the optics make it sound “cheap”.

So that’s how I feel irked

[City74]

Originally Posted by brandrea

I think what’s driving this is that the credit card fees and bank fees are shown as a separate line on the income statement. If the business owner sees 3% fees on say a million dollars in sales it’s not in significant.



My accountant approached me last year, showing what our business spent in Credit card feees and suggested we add the fees in a simsilar way. I told her I’d have nothing to do with it. Bottom line is, the customer is paying for the product and nowadays credit card is the preferred method of payment. I’d rather see it built into the price, than say to my customer ... “I want you want you to buy my product and by the way, if you use a credit card it’ll costyou extra.”



Bottom line, it’s always irked me when I see an extra charge added to cover credit card fee and IMO, the optics make it sound “cheap”.



So that’s how I feel irked

Very well put


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[Keadog]

Bank wires can't be reversed. Did no one mention that or did I miss it in my hurried reading of the thread?

[City74]

Originally Posted by Keadog

Bank wires can't be reversed. Did no one mention that or did I miss it in my hurried reading of the thread?

I stated that I would never bank wire a business money.

[donas]

This is not an uncommon practice, even for regular stores. Have you ever asked for a discount for paying cash? Many won't offer it but will give it if asked. The other thing to think about is the substantial mark up at ADs and other stores, 3% is in there somewhere! I just purchased a rather expensive dog and had to pay 3% to use a credit card.

In my opinion, why would the seller have to absorb the fee charged by the credit card company because the buyer wants to use that option?

[dkg1616]

I told my AD I’d come with 100 dollar bills for an additional discount...said nope... didn’t care