Key Driver of Desirability - Rarity or Aesthetics?

[Uggi]

Is it just a coincidence that the hard-to-obtain watches are the ones people crave the most - Pepsi, Hulk, Daytona, SD, BLNR etc? Or is it their very desirability which creates the scarcity?

If the above watches were suddenly in every AD window would people crave them just as much because it is their aesthetic beauty which makes them desirable or do you think the "need" to have them would reduce?

I bought my Hulk for the looks, without really knowing or understanding anything about the watch or its rarity. It was definitely bought in blissful ignorance. I'd buy a Pepsi tomorrow even if every human on the planet was wearing one and they could be bought in the local supermarket - purely for the aesthetics. But a small internal Smeagol part of me is now starting to want some of the other watches on that list (which I don't find irresistibly beautiful at all) just because I know they are like hard to find treasure.

I personally find the Daytonas aesthetically fairly ugly to look at and the functionality is redundant - do you think the craving for these watches is mainly down to the fact people can't have them?

[tyler1980]

IMO its rarity which doesnt really apply to Rolex based on how many watches they do make, but there is a hard to get factor which is similar.

Plenty of people have the money for a watch but fewer can actually get one from an AD so getting one is more impressive than the money factor.

The aesthetics are fine as they are great watches but that alone isnt enough to get people in a frenzy.

[glamorama]

Originally Posted by tyler1980

IMO its rarity which doesnt really apply to Rolex based on how many watches they do make, but there is a hard to get factor which is similar.

Plenty of people have the money for a watch but fewer can actually get one from an AD so getting one is more impressive than the money factor.

The aesthetics are fine as they are great watches but that alone isnt enough to get people in a frenzy.

I don't really buy your argument that it is not a money factor.

Pretty much the only way to have an AD relationship is to buy watches that you desire in varying degrees before getting access to hard to get pieces. Sure you might be a nice/cool guy liked by the manager but in the end you need to buy stuff to have a so called relationship. If you are a celeb or hot shot that brings some glamour to the shop by buying from them that may not apply. This might also be different in small towns where people already know of each other.

So imao it is a money factor, you have spent enough to 'earn' the right to buy a desired watch at MSRP even if you are not their biggest spender.

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by glamorama

I don't really buy your argument that it is not a money factor.

Pretty much the only way to have an AD relationship is to buy watches that you desire in varying degrees before getting access to hard to get pieces. Sure you might be a nice/cool guy liked by the manager but in the end you need to buy stuff to have a so called relationship. If you are a celeb or hot shot that brings some glamour to the shop by buying from them that may not apply. This might also be different in small towns where people already know of each other.

So imao it is a money factor, you have spent enough to 'earn' the right to buy a desired watch at MSRP even if you are not their biggest spender.

my point was there are enough people with 10k to spend for a watch so that isnt impressive, but there are less who can spend that 10k to actually get one. Getting it is more impressive than the fact you have 10k. Its desirable because its hard to get not that it costs what it costs.

IMO that has changed as previously the big appeal to a lot of people was that it was an expensive thing to wear, but now its more about wearing something hard to get. Hard to get is more "exclusive" than expensive.

Im speaking to the casual watch buyer which is most people as they like the brand for entirely different reasons than WIS. Its social status signaling.

[guycord]

I would swap the word “rarity” with “Investment”. The investment side is driving the rarity.

I like my White 116500, not too fussed about having a black face. I would happily swap my 116500 for a 116519.

I love my YM 116622 because the dial brings me so much pleasure in a robust SS Professional setting. I have a 114060 which I now find so-so. The YM supersedes it in every way. And because of that I see no real reason to own a GMT of any flavour which I see as a dual-time Sub. I have plenty of other Dual-time watches I’d wear instead.

I can understand people wanting to collect every rare variant or buy new watches with stickers still attached but I just want to wear mine and have the most pleasurable wrist-time with what I have.

Having a different ceramic bezel colour or a fatter to depth case just because is not for me.

[thesharkfactor]

Rarity.
Take the green glass Milgauss as case in point. When it came out it went nuts and it was hard to get, prices were on the moon, until it was realised that you could buy one in any AD anytime. Then no one was interested.

I think it's crazy, who wants a green watch or a half blue watch.. or a blue and red watch. It's nonsense, desireability driven by greed and rarity.

[CRM114]

Originally Posted by thesharkfactor

Rarity.
Take the green glass Milgauss as case in point. When it came out it went nuts and it was hard to get, prices were on the moon, until it was realised that you could buy one in any AD anytime. Then no one was interested.

I think it's crazy, who wants a green watch or a half blue watch.. or a blue and red watch. It's nonsense, desireability driven by greed and rarity.

Apparently lots of people wanted blue and red BLROs, it's the signature color scheme of the GMT Master. They were in continuous production and popular from 1954 until 2007, and even had 2 BLRO refs (16700 & 16710) being manufactured from '88 to '99. Historically they were definitely not a rarity, one could find them easily at any AD. A BLNR is just a variation on the bi-colored bezel theme (not unlike the commonly found Coke or Root beer), which came out during the 10 year absence of BLRO production that lasted from 2008 until this year.

It's the 10 year absence of the BLRO in the GMT Master line-up since they went ceramic that has those who've always liked them trying to get their hands on them, not some "rarity" aspect. It already had a huge following, had never been a poor seller (like the Daytona), and was never rare.

[padi56]

Originally Posted by Uggi

Is it just a coincidence that the hard-to-obtain watches are the ones people crave the most - Pepsi, Hulk, Daytona, SD, BLNR etc? Or is it their very desirability which creates the scarcity?

If the above watches were suddenly in every AD window would people crave them just as much because it is their aesthetic beauty which makes them desirable or do you think the "need" to have them would reduce?

I bought my Hulk for the looks, without really knowing or understanding anything about the watch or its rarity. It was definitely bought in blissful ignorance. I'd buy a Pepsi tomorrow even if every human on the planet was wearing one and they could be bought in the local supermarket - purely for the aesthetics. But a small internal Smeagol part of me is now starting to want some of the other watches on that list (which I don't find irresistibly beautiful at all) just because I know they are like hard to find treasure.

I personally find the Daytonas aesthetically fairly ugly to look at and the functionality is redundant - do you think the craving for these watches is mainly down to the fact people can't have them?

Today many just wear the brand and if they get a watch that's difficult to get at retail but hundreds on the grey market. By getting one of these watches,some think it make them into something special.But in the real world only depriving those who really want to own that particular watch because that's the one they want to wear in good health for many years to come.Today many see Rolex watches as little more than £££££$$$$$ and in many ways todays WIS is to blame.I often see this word rare now on forum with Rolex watches,fact no Rolex watch is rare, yes some made in smaller numbers but rare no.

[Rocket launcher]

It's the fact that you can buy one today and make £1500+ it's driven by greed

If they were available in every AD then the market would be flat and other watches would be most people's choice
In the real world a steel Daytona should never cost more than a gold 2 tone yet it does and the initial buyer..if you could get one makes a very tidy profit....a market driven by greed..

Can't wait for rolex to change or stop making the current airking one the land speed record is broke...I will make a fortune..my ugly duckling of a watch will become a swan

[Spence4]

For me it is all about the aesthetic. I respectfully disagree with the OP as I think the Daytona is the best looking watch out there at any price point. I realize that is completely subjective. I think that is why I only recently purchased my second watch - because my Daytona is in for its first service (10 years) - otherwise I would wear that Daytona everyday. Suit, jeans and a t-shirt, tux.... it goes with them all. I also do not think all Daytona’s are created equal. I love my 116520, but am not crazy about the 116500. I do like the aesthetics of the Zenith model, but I think the hours indices and hands are a little too skinny. I also do not prefer the Newman Daytona. I am sure that last sentence will earn me a chorus of “boo”s but like I said, for me it is not rarity- I just really like the way the 116520 looks.

[thesharkfactor]

The Daytona model is another good case in point, when they were in every AD's display case they could not be given away! Make them hard to get and now they are a phenomenon that everyone wants (not me, I can see past that). It is very interesting how Rolex took their worst seller and turned it into the most desirable and requested watch that you can only get if you spend $$$$$$$!..they probably still physically 'sell' as many as they did in the past too!

[SilverFoxUK]

I think it’s a bit of both. I bought my Hulk sub before they were hard to get as I really fell for the green dial colour. I admit I get a sense of satisfaction knowing it has risen in value. Would I sell it for a £2,000 profit now? No. I have a bond with it and love it. More so because I don’t see it often on other people’s wrists. I do think human psychology gears most of us to crave that which is hard to get. Manufacturers know this and we get hooked in, maybe buying some more obtainable watches while we wait to get the call about the Daytona.

[Muxi]

I think it is also the reputation for reliability. Many times I have thought of trying other brands but end up choosing another Rolex instead.

[JohnnyMack]

For me, it is function and appearance with a touch of I never seen anyone else with one.

I use my D-Blue as intended.... but definitely not to the depths it was designed and never has seen an enriched helium environment outside a circus balloon.

[kauffee]

I think we are forgetting that the “rarity” situation (in the US, anyway) is just about a year old. Daytona excepted, you could walk into most ADs and find Subs and GMTs. I would see plenty of LVs and BLNRs in cases, too. So the demand for Rolex professional models has always been there, even when you could usually walk into an AD and buy one when you wanted.

[AK797]

For WIS it is more the aesthetics and practicalities of wearing the watch as we scratch below the surface when we buy, but for the more normal buyer then rarity plays into the human nature of wanting something others can't get or very few have, so that exclusivity is attractive, plus rarity often means higher prices so flippers are also attracted.

I would buy a watch if my first condition is met, but the ideal purchase now fulfils both criteria of aesthetics and rarity/exclusivity, and I'm sure many people are now holding out for both when making a buy rather than just the first, so that has changed.

[pigman08]

I was consumed with the Daytona hype when I was fortunate enough to walk in off of the street and get lucky enough to buy a 116520 as a first time customer at my local AD. At the time, I truly thought that it was something special and wore it proudly. But I slowly came to the realization that it just wasn’t the watch for me: It’s a bit flashy for my tastes with the PCL’s, and the most basic functionality of a watch (telling time) became overshadowed by the distraction of the sub-dials. Don’t get me wrong: I still view it as a collectible piece and felt a bit privileged to own it, but for me it just wasn’t a wearable or practical piece. That said, I traded it yesterday for the latest iteration of the Explorer and a wad of cash that I hope to use towards the purchase of a 16710B in the not too distant future. I may very well have regrets for making the trade when it comes time to buy my son his first car in 11 years and realize that by then the Daytona could pay for it (along with the Explorer and GMT) but there is no doubt in my mind that I will get much more use from and have a greater appreciation for the Explorer on a daily basis than I would ever get from the Daytona.


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[Sarosh]

Originally Posted by pigman08

I was consumed with the Daytona hype when I was fortunate enough to walk in off of the street and get lucky enough to buy a 116520 as a first time customer at my local AD. At the time, I truly thought that it was something special and wore it proudly. But I slowly came to the realization that it just wasn’t the watch for me: It’s a bit flashy for my tastes with the PCL’s, and the most basic functionality of a watch (telling time) became overshadowed by the distraction of the sub-dials. Don’t get me wrong: I still view it as a collectible piece and felt a bit privileged to own it, but for me it just wasn’t a wearable or practical piece. That said, I traded it yesterday for the latest iteration of the Explorer and a wad of cash that I hope to use towards the purchase of a 16710B in the not too distant future. I may very well have regrets for making the trade when it comes time to buy my son his first car in 11 years and realize that by then the Daytona could pay for it (along with the Explorer and GMT) but there is no doubt in my mind that I will get much more use from and have a greater appreciation for the Explorer on a daily basis than I would ever get from the Daytona.


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I completely agree with your rationale for the daily usage versus the rarity. Some people will buy the in demand watch and baby it to within an inch of its life. Whereas I believe if you’ve spent the money on the watch, enjoy it and don’t just let it gather dust. What was the point of buying it in the first place? As many say there are better ‘investments’ out there.

[Devildog]

People want what they can’t have.

Desire drives demand which creates scarcity which creates want which drives demand and so on and so on.

Is human nature

[brandrea]

Originally Posted by Devildog

People want what they can’t have.

Desire drives demand which creates scarcity which creates want which drives demand and so on and so on.

Is human nature

Pretty much sums it up

[Etschell]

rarity.

vintage milgauss go for 60k plus plus.

[Spence4]

Mine was a wedding gift from the wife. Spends no time in a safe or anything. It is on my wrist all the time getting scratches and dings and the like. Definitely an every day watch that I would never sell no matter how much the market increases.

[aleeboy]

Exclusivity and the feeling of 'being in the club' are strong motivating factors inherent in people. It's just human nature.

Obviously it's not purely down to looks

[AK797]

Originally Posted by aleeboy

Exclusivity and the feeling of 'being in the club' are strong motivating factors inherent in people. It's just human nature.

Obviously it's not purely down to looks

The thing with Rolex is that they are objectively speaking good-looking and standardly attractive, whereas AP and PP sports have far more unusual designs that are polarising, so it is interesting to see how rarity/exclusivity and high resales of those models have coerced people into buying who might still not be convinced of their design language.

[GB-man]

Originally Posted by AK797

The thing with Rolex is that they are objectively speaking good-looking and standardly attractive, whereas AP and PP sports have far more unusual designs that are polarising, so it is interesting to see how rarity/exclusivity and high resales of those models have coerced people into buying who might still not be convinced of their design language.

Indeed. It’s funny because I would think John public would prefer the classic aesthetic of a calatrava vs the somewhat odd design of the 5711. But no.

[beshannon]

Originally Posted by Uggi

I bought my Hulk for the looks, without really knowing or understanding anything about the watch or its rarity. It was definitely bought in blissful ignorance. I'd buy a Pepsi tomorrow even if every human on the planet was wearing one and they could be bought in the local supermarket - purely for the aesthetics. But a small internal Smeagol part of me is now starting to want some of the other watches on that list (which I don't find irresistibly beautiful at all) just because I know they are like hard to find treasure.

I believe you answered your own question.

[HL65]

Originally Posted by beshannon

I believe you answered your own question.

Yes he did. Me I simply have always bought watches I really liked. I really don't care what anyone else thinks of my watches as I bought for myself not anyone else.

[hodie9]

Originally Posted by HL65

Yes he did. Me I simply have always bought watches I really liked. I really don't care what anyone else thinks of my watches as I bought for myself not anyone else.

Agree 100%

[TimeOnHand]

Originally Posted by HL65

Yes he did. Me I simply have always bought watches I really liked. I really don't care what anyone else thinks of my watches as I bought for myself not anyone else.

But it just so happens that all the watches you buy are sought after, hard to get and highly desirable

You have an amazing collection mate

[beshannon]

Originally Posted by HL65

Yes he did. Me I simply have always bought watches I really liked. I really don't care what anyone else thinks of my watches as I bought for myself not anyone else.

Agreed. No other reason to buy anything except for yourself.