Rolex 5512 and 5513 movements

[jlovda]

Back in 1970, there seems to have been three Submariner movements; the 17 jewel movement sold in the US, the 26 jewel, non-chronometer sold in Europe (meters first) and the 26 jewel, 5512 chronometer. What is the technical difference between the "meters first" non-chronometer and the 5512?

I bought my 5513 "meters first" in Zurich on 1970. In 1972, Sutter's in Chicago replaced the Twin-Lok crown with a Trip-Lok for $10. He also offered to change my 26 jewel movement to the "chronometer version" for $15 but I didn't have a lot of money in my wallet. Of course, he noted that it would not be certified or have the nomenclature on the dial. It seemed to be the addition of a few sliding weights somewhere in the movement.

[Dirt]

Interesting question.
It may be better answered on the vintage forum or watchmaking forum.

[Dr.Smellody]

I do not know the "technical difference" but have read there was a tariff on the number of jeweled movements in some countries at this time.

[mag]

The difference is the timing frequency required for the chronometer specs.
There is also a different Balance in the chronometer Caliber.

Ref. 5512 = cal. 1570 = Balance 8106 = frequency 19.800
Ref. 5513 = cal. 1530 = Balance 7855 = frequency 18.000

Greetings from germany.
MaG

[R.W.T.]

Originally Posted by mag

The difference is the timing frequency required for the chronometer specs.
There is also a different Balance in the chronometer Caliber.

Ref. 5512 = cal. 1570 = Balance 8106 = frequency 19.800
Ref. 5513 = cal. 1530 = Balance 7855 = frequency 18.000

Greetings from germany.
MaG

No. Not exactly.

The 1530 came in Chronometer grade as well as non.

The 5512 had 1530 Chronometer, 1560 Chronometer and 1570 chronometer depending on era of manufacture.

Meters first or second is irrelevant as well. It has nothing to do with what variant the movement inside is, but rather what era the watch was produced in.

1530 earliest is an overcoil hairspring utilizing a slide regulator with curb pins.

18000 bph

1560 is an overcoil hairspring that is free sprung and timed on the balance with screws.

18000 bph

1570 is an overcoil hairspring that is free sprung and timed on the balance with screws.

19800 bph.

The 1530 was not being used in the submariner in 1970. Both the 1530 and 1560 had been replaced.

The 5513 utilized the non chronometer 1520 which was a 19800 bph movement timed with a slide regulator with curb pins = flat hairspring.

The jewel count differences are found mainly in the autowind section.

1530 came 17 jewel as well as 26 jewel. The 17 jewel version used open jewels in the escape wheel position with cylindrical pivots as opposed to capped jewels with conical pivots.

The 17 jewel version is not the same configuration as a typical 17 jewel movement which uses the capped escape wheel jewels, but rather more like an open jewel 15 jewel movement, the extra 2 jewels being in the center wheel position on the train bridge and also on the lower pivot of the intermediate drive wheel on the autowind section.

[R.W.T.]

Be very thankful that you didn't upgrade the movement. It would have pretty much destroyed the value of your watch for collector purposes.

[jlovda]

Originally Posted by R.W.T.

Be very thankful that you didn't upgrade the movement. It would have pretty much destroyed the value of your watch for collector purposes.

Thanks for that terrific explanation. This watch is my treasure to pass on.