Gentleman's agreement?

[wappinghigh]

When sourcing a vintage Rolex - is it an assumption around here that if a newbie to Vintage rolex like me puts up say an ebay link pre auction for verification of legitimate dial, lume and hands etc (and the watch does indeed prove genuine) that a whole bunch of cowboys aren't going to rain in on the Auction and oubid said newbie?

I mean how are unhelpful people policed around here ...or aren't they policed?

Are there gentleman around whom said newbie could PM? - with a link to check a listing before the bidding closes, who are honest on the record as helpers to a genuine collector like me, rather than shonkers or flippers, who end up outbidders?

Thanks

W

[bayerische]

*popcorn*

[Token74]

Originally Posted by bayerische

*popcorn*

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[Andad]

Originally Posted by wappinghigh

When sourcing a vintage Rolex - is it an assumption around here that if a newbie to Vintage rolex like me puts up say an ebay link pre auction for verification of legitimate dial, lume and hands etc (and the watch does indeed prove genuine) that a whole bunch of cowboys aren't going to rain in on the Auction and oubid said newbie?

I mean how are aresholes policed around here ...or aren't they policed?

Are there gentleman around whom said newbie could PM? - with a link to check a listing before the bidding closes, who are honest on the record as helpers to a genuine collector like me, rather than shonkers or flippers, who end up outbidders?

Thanks

W

Probably none with your class.

[wappinghigh]

Excuse me? I don't get it.

[oysterquartz17000]

Originally Posted by wappinghigh

When sourcing a vintage Rolex - is it an assumption around here that if a newbie to Vintage rolex like me puts up say an ebay link pre auction for verification of legitimate dial, lume and hands etc (and the watch does indeed prove genuine) that a whole bunch of cowboys aren't going to rain in on the Auction and oubid said newbie?

I mean how are aresholes policed around here ...or aren't they policed?

Are there gentleman around whom said newbie could PM? - with a link to check a listing before the bidding closes, who are honest on the record as helpers to a genuine collector like me, rather than shonkers or flippers, who end up outbidders?

Thanks

W

I think you need to figure out things on your own champ.

[stevedssd]

Originally Posted by oysterquartz17000

I think you need to figure out things on your own champ.

On a far more interesting note, I love that dial on your 16803

[oysterquartz17000]

Originally Posted by stevedssd

On a far more interesting note, I love that dial on your 16803

Thanks

[wappinghigh]

^ yeh Ok oysterq ol' sport...I'll do that

Nice one

Can't buy a new sub from an AD (there aren't any)
Can't buy a new or near knew sub unless I'm screwed over by a bunch of smart ar$e bravado cowboy grey flippers who think they know more than everyone else...
Can't get help around here about a vintage sub so can't buy a Vintage sub that doesn't cost less that a PP

So basically can't buy a simple classic SS Rolex at all without being totally done over....

I figured it out : a 5513 shouldn't have a 1560 movement so must be fake something...

Appreciate the help

Cheers

[Vincent65]

Originally Posted by wappinghigh

^ yeh Ok oysterq ol' sport...I'll do that

Nice one

Can't buy a new sub from an AD (there aren't any)
Can't buy a new or near knew sub unless I'm screwed over by a bunch of smart ar$e bravado cowboy grey flippers who think they know more than everyone else...
Can't get help around here about a vintage sub so can't buy a Vintage sub that doesn't cost less that a PP

So basically can't buy a simple classic SS Rolex at all without being totally done over....

I figured it out : a 5513 shouldn't have a 1560 movement so must be fake something...

Appreciate the help

Cheers

I think you've summed it up for yourself, really. Maybe try another brand. Or hobby...

[wappinghigh]

Originally Posted by Vincent65

I think you've summed it up for yourself, really. Maybe try another brand. Or hobby...

Why would I do that when Rolex is the best watch brand in the world, and collecting watches is my hobby?

I'm, just after fairness and transparency in the market..

As a watch collector, what's wrong in desiring that?

[zapokee]

Originally Posted by wappinghigh

Why would I do that when Rolex is the best watch brand in the world, and collecting watches is my hobby?

I'm, just after fairness and transparency in the market..

As a watch collector, what's wrong in desiring that?

Well, this is going smoothly.

[donq]

Originally Posted by wappinghigh

Why would I do that when Rolex is the best watch brand in the world, and collecting watches is my hobby?

I'm, just after fairness and transparency in the market..

As a watch collector, what's wrong in desiring that?

As a fisherman, all I desire is to be able to toss a hook in the water and pull out the exact fish I want.

What’s wrong with desiring that?

Nothing at all, but it’s not going to happen because that’s not how it works. It takes knowledge, experience, skill, and a certain investment of money and time to get anywhere close to that, and even then plenty of great fisherman go home empty handed sometimes.

If it was that easy, it wouldn’t be much of a hobby. It would just be watch shopping.

[Brew]

I think members use the "watch out" section to ask questions about pieces they're interested in; sort of like crowd sourcing for authenticity.

[wappinghigh]

Originally Posted by Brew

I think members use the "watch out" section to ask questions about pieces they're interested in; sort of like crowd sourcing for authenticity.

Ok thanks for that... cheers

[roh123]

Auctions normally work so items sell for market price. Hence no problems to share links for opinions on the forum. No one here is likely to pay above market just so you can’t win the auction.

If you are looking to buy under market price I think you will either have to take a risk or educate yourself on your own.

Best of luck!

[mountainjogger]

Originally Posted by roh123

Auctions normally work so items sell for market price. Hence no problems to share links for opinions on the forum. No one here is likely to pay above market just so you can’t win the auction.

If you are looking to buy under market price I think you will either have to take a risk or educate yourself on your own.

Best of luck!

Agree, and OP you might work on your tone, it does not exactly instill a desire to assist.

[Mark020]

What exactly would ebay verificate for you?

[statsman]

Gentleman’s agreement question- what you are describing is an adult version of “I call first dibs!”

I don’t think it works. You find bargains by:

1. Really, really knowing what you are looking for
2. Taking advantage of information gaps in the rest of the buying market. For example, an auction that is less trafficked (garage sales are least trafficked and eBay is most trafficked). Another example is an online listing where the seller makes typo errors that keep the item out of auto searches. Still another example is when the seller doesn’t realize his item is sought after and fails to highlight the key features.

Coming here and asking for info may be smart, but noting the auction isn’t. Most members regularly scan several auctions and do not feel constrained by your “dibs”.

I have a couple of friends that collect the same watches I do. When I saw a listing recently that a friend (with a much bigger and more complete collection than me) needed, I texted it to him. He did ask if I was planning to bid, and I told him, “No, I have that one. If I wanted to bid, I wouldn’t have told you. I’m not that nice.”

There are ways to talk around the subject obliquely, present a couple of pics and ask pointed questions, to get the desired info without expanding the pool of bidders. It takes more time, though.

[J.L.Aaron]

Originally Posted by statsman

Gentleman’s agreement question- what you are describing is an adult version of “I call first dibs!”

I don’t think it works. You find bargains by:

1. Really, really knowing what you are looking for
2. Taking advantage of information gaps in the rest of the buying market. For example, an auction that is less trafficked (garage sales are least trafficked and eBay is most trafficked). Another example is an online listing where the seller makes typo errors that keep the item out of auto searches. Still another example is when the seller doesn’t realize his item is sought after and fails to highlight the key features.

Coming here and asking for info may be smart, but noting the auction isn’t. Most members regularly scan several auctions and do not feel constrained by your “dibs”.

I have a couple of friends that collect the same watches I do. When I saw a listing recently that a friend (with a much bigger and more complete collection than me) needed, I texted it to him. He did ask if I was planning to bid, and I told him, “No, I have that one. If I wanted to bid, I wouldn’t have told you. I’m not that nice.”

There are ways to talk around the subject obliquely, present a couple of pics and ask pointed questions, to get the desired info without expanding the pool of bidders. It takes more time, though.

I was reading the threads responding to the "Newbie" and I commend you for your response in offering an informed opinion. I hope he takes your advice and continues searching for his desired watch using the Forum.

Thank you
Jana Aaron
Watchmakers International
Arlington, TX

PS, Both Bob Ridley and I chuckled at your example where you described yourself as "not that nice!"

[roh123]

Why is it important to do bargains? Isn’t it more important getting something great? It’s like paying market price is something bad around here. Very odd imho.

Great watches are much harder to find than making more money.

[statsman]

Originally Posted by roh123

Why is it important to do bargains? Isn’t it more important getting something great? It’s like paying market price is something bad around here. Very odd imho.

Great watches are much harder to find than making more money.

Sure. Winning auctions is easy. All you have to do is bid more than everybody else.

I can’t do that. I have a budget. I have to seek out opportunities and reclamation projects.

(Also, I collect bowl game watches. Their rarity comes from so few being issued, not their horological quality, and you cannot count on good examples being out there. If one of the 80-100 issued 1944 Gold Cotton Bowl Classic Bulovas becomes available, pickiness about quality goes out the window. Sure, I’ll pay more for one in good condition, but I’ll also make an offer on one that is broken, with the second hand missing from the sub dial. That’s just how my niche is).

[roh123]

Originally Posted by statsman

Sure. Winning auctions is easy. All you have to do is bid more than everybody else.

I can’t do that. I have a budget. I have to seek out opportunities and reclamation projects.

Well.. Is it a hobby or a business? I am guessing you are selling for market price anyway. No?

[statsman]

It is a hobby. My expenses come out of my household budget. Nothing will be recouped until I die or become incapacitated.

My team is the Texas Longhorns. Unlike Alabama fans, we don’t have multiple post season road playoff games to spend money on. All I have are my old bowl game watches and old programs to muse over, as I reflect on the glory of the past.

[roh123]

Originally Posted by statsman

It is a hobby. My expenses come out of my household budget. Nothing will be recouped until I die or become incapacitated.

My team is the Texas Longhorns. Unlike Alabama fans, we don’t have multiple post season road playoff games to spend money on. All I have are my old bowl game watches and old programs to muse over, as I reflect on the glory of the past.

Well.. Why do you then need to look for bargains? Just look for something in your price range instead.

I just don’t get the often reoccuring discussions where focus seems to be on doing a great deal rather than finding a great watch. Personally I always focus on quality and if my budget aint enough I look for something more in my price range. Still in great condition.

Each to their own but I have more pleasure owning something great rather than whatever I just got ”cheap”.

[statsman]

I have a great 1949 Cotton Bowl Hamilton. It looks great, and keeps great time. It looked like hell when I bought it from Goodwill. There is a neat community of vintage US watch enthusiasts, and VintageHamilton is one of the suppliers/service providers. They repaired it, cleaned it up and replaced the scarred crystal with an authentic NOS crystal.

It looks great. There are no “great” versions for sale. There may never be “great” versions for sale (until I die). While reclaiming this watch to greatness, I came into contact with some really neat people. It was, for lack of a better term, “fun”.

[Dan S]

Auctions are free-for-alls, and every Rolex on eBay is seen by many members of this forum. It's unrealistic to think that you're the only one seeing it. There is no way, as a self-proclaimed newbie, for you to take advantage of the collective knowledge of the forum for your own benefit. Why would there be? A watch forum is a community like any other, and you need to give in order to get. If you participate for a few months, develop relationships, get to know people, then you may make some "friends" who you feel comfortable asking about a watch in a PM. Or just ask your questions and take your chances, which will mean that you will pay a fair price to win the auction, as mentioned many times above.

You may have noticed that you are getting some push-back regarding the tone of your initial post. Put yourself in the shoes of a typical forum member who has spent years studying and learning details about various vintage models. They are generally happy to welcome new members to the hobby and help teach them, as long as the newbies are polite and willing to learn. However, the forum is not a drive-through service where people provide their hard-won knowledge so that a stranger can benefit financially.

[zengineer]

You ask too much. It's that simple.



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[zapokee]

Just buy from a trusted dealer and avoid Flea-Bay. You'll pay a bit more but sleep well at night.

[stmoore]

Why don’t you close out your prior thread on the 60s era sub?