Jean-Marc Pontroue is destroying the brand

[itsjknight]

Just watched "WatchAdvisor - PANERAI: Straight talk with CEO Jean-Marc Pontroue and I can't believe this guy.

So starting in 2023 all watch will be converted over to the stupid "esteel" with the transition complete by 2025. I don't understand the logic in a luxury product using recycled materials! I don't want a watch with any recycled materials in it.

I guess I'm done buying Panerai's I just don't like the direction the company has been going since this guy took over as CEO. They are also getting rid of the wood boxes and the watches will now come in a small cardboard box with travel case.

If anyone at Panerai is listening you need to get rid of this guy and get back to your roots of what made Panerai a success. It's certainly not esteel and feminine looking travel cases.

[roger.bolton]

Lots of steel is already previously used. What I have issue with is the cringe worth e-steel on the dial.

[thsiao]

Originally Posted by roger.bolton

Lots of steel is already previously used. What I have issue with is the cringe worth e-steel on the dial.

Once they transition fully to eSteel they will drop the special name.

I think the point here is sustainability. At the moment by having it on the dial, I do agree that is somehow devalues the watch. But once removed from the dial, I don’t mind that the steel is partially recycled. I just don’t need that reminder on the dial lol.

[jjvd21]

Originally Posted by roger.bolton

Lots of steel is already previously used. What I have issue with is the cringe worth e-steel on the dial.

Agree! Don’t put it on the dial and people won’t care.


PAM 177 / 438 / 643 / 1314 / 233 •

[GRabens]

I just got my first Panerai, PAM 233. I find myself drawn to the more vintage models. I wonder how the new direction of Panerai will affect the value of the previous models. I guess it really doesn't matter to me. I too am turned off on the eco-friendly cheap packaging being used by other firms (i.e. Breitling).

[watchnlaw]

I agree with everything you've said. The 233 is legendary, I have a 112 and I love it. I like a few other older base models but have been quite upset with the direction the brand has taken ever since they went to non screw in casebacks on several "diver" models. It's a real shame, I was a big fan previously. These are luxury items and completely wasteful, to act like these brands want to be sustainable is disingenuous.

[roger.bolton]

Clearly he did not consult anyone on this forum!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=olFIbXCiZxk

[madeindade]

Originally Posted by GRabens

I just got my first Panerai, PAM 233. I find myself drawn to the more vintage models. I wonder how the new direction of Panerai will affect the value of the previous models. I guess it really doesn't matter to me. I too am turned off on the eco-friendly cheap packaging being used by other firms (i.e. Breitling).

I agree with everything you said. I just recently added a PAM 904 to my "Watch Wishlist". I too am curious how these recent "progressions" will affect value. Not because I'm interested in resale, but because I'm curious if I should buy now or wait?

[Cru Jones]

Many luxury brands are going all-in with sustainability.

[Foxiness]

https://perezcope.com/2022/03/27/the...wngrading/amp/

[Andad]

Originally Posted by Foxiness

https://perezcope.com/2022/03/27/the...wngrading/amp/

This is becoming boring.

[TswaneNguni]

Panerai from the correct era .Thats what you buy .

[gmtobsessed]

Originally Posted by TswaneNguni

Panerai from the correct era .Thats what you buy .

This

[rajurama]

Its the way world is functioning whether we like it or not... V8 V6 engines are looked down upon and all major Car co.s are forced to electrify for the new world... The fact these dead electric batteries might actually do more damage to environment in future for disposal is to be seen... The extra electricity generation required will have more impact to environment... More fossil fuels burned , nuclear waste released etc etc

Also the e steel might actually be more energy consuming or even the cardbox ... Knowone knows but for sales and marketing people only have one target that is to please a certain mentality to achive more sales at the end of the day. Its all a gimmick no one really gives a damn about the planet in reality and thats the sad part of today's world. Most activists are just fame hungry rather than actual crusaders.

[Cru Jones]

Originally Posted by rajurama

Its the way world is functioning whether we like it or not... V8 V6 engines are looked down upon and all major Car co.s are forced to electrify for the new world... The fact these dead electric batteries might actually do more damage to environment in future for disposal is to be seen... The extra electricity generation required will have more impact to environment... More fossil fuels burned , nuclear waste released etc etc

Also the e steel might actually be more energy consuming or even the cardbox ... Knowone knows but for sales and marketing people only have one target that is to please a certain mentality to achive more sales at the end of the day. Its all a gimmick no one really gives a damn about the planet in reality and thats the sad part of today's world. Most activists are just fame hungry rather than actual crusaders.

Not to sidetrack the thread, but electric car batteries have a lifespan of about 10 years followed by 10 years of use for energy storage. Furthermore, with today’s technology, 80% is recyclable. Who know what the percentage will be in 20 years.

It’s not marketing or making people feel good. It’s real science and facts.

As for needing energy, yes, one needs to generate power to move the car. The more renewable the source the better. And regardless of the source, the dramatic decreases in CO2 and local particle emissions have real impacts.

As for watches, apparently the younger generation (those who will be the majority of luxury buyers soon enough) expect sustainability. Companies need to cater to that. It’s just good business sense. And if sustainability happens to be better for the planet along the way, why not?

[shaunylw]

Originally Posted by Cru Jones

Not to sidetrack the thread, but electric car batteries have a lifespan of about 10 years followed by 10 years of use for energy storage. Furthermore, with today’s technology, 80% is recyclable. Who know what the percentage will be in 20 years.

It’s not marketing or making people feel good. It’s real science and facts.

As for needing energy, yes, one needs to generate power to move the car. The more renewable the source the better. And regardless of the source, the dramatic decreases in CO2 and local particle emissions have real impacts.

As for watches, apparently the younger generation (those who will be the majority of luxury buyers soon enough) expect sustainability. Companies need to cater to that. It’s just good business sense. And if sustainability happens to be better for the planet along the way, why not?

I’m in that generation, i could give two about sustainability in watches. I would never buy a brand because they are using sustainable resources in a watch. I want gold, or stainless steel, or whatever their version of stainless steel is. Panerai is going backwards.

The lack of finishing, the “in-house” movement they don’t really make but sort of take credit for. It’s a mess. They make some really cool watches but i wouldn’t pay anything near msrp for one. Their finishing is also pretty bad considering the price point. Different league but Nomos does a way better job of finishing in a the club that’s $8,000 less than most panerai.

I think they need to dig in more on finishes, making their own movement that’s decorated better, and create something that people want to stand in the imaginary line for. Omega does a far better job in their movements with a display back. Even Rolex does a better job without a display back.

If panerai throws a few more limited editions out there they can become the new Hublot.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Glidelock]

Originally Posted by shaunylw

I’m in that generation, i could give two about sustainability in watches. I would never buy a brand because they are using sustainable resources in a watch. I want gold, or stainless steel, or whatever their version of stainless steel is. Panerai is going backwards.

The lack of finishing, the “in-house” movement they don’t really make but sort of take credit for. It’s a mess. They make some really cool watches but i wouldn’t pay anything near msrp for one. Their finishing is also pretty bad considering the price point. Different league but Nomos does a way better job of finishing in a the club that’s $8,000 less than most panerai.

I think they need to dig in more on finishes, making their own movement that’s decorated better, and create something that people want to stand in the imaginary line for. Omega does a far better job in their movements with a display back. Even Rolex does a better job without a display back.

If panerai throws a few more limited editions out there they can become the new Hublot.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I have to agree! Panerai just keeps finding new and unique ways to Bastardize their brand! Which is really disheartening because they’ve had so much opportunity to do things right! And what’s up with the sneaky attempt to downgrade their movements, and keep the movement ref # the same?!

[emtee]

Originally Posted by Glidelock

I have to agree! Panerai just keeps finding new and unique ways to Bastardize their brand! Which is really disheartening because they’ve had so much opportunity to do things right! And what’s up with the sneaky attempt to downgrade their movements, and keep the movement ref # the same?!

Kinda how I feel. They remind me of that person who I’m sure many of us know who despite having many great qualities and opportunities, just can’t seem to help making bad choices and f***ing up

[michaelodonnell123]

Originally Posted by Cru Jones

Not to sidetrack the thread, but electric car batteries have a lifespan of about 10 years followed by 10 years of use for energy storage. Furthermore, with today’s technology, 80% is recyclable. Who know what the percentage will be in 20 years.

It’s not marketing or making people feel good. It’s real science and facts.

As for needing energy, yes, one needs to generate power to move the car. The more renewable the source the better. And regardless of the source, the dramatic decreases in CO2 and local particle emissions have real impacts.

As for watches, apparently the younger generation (those who will be the majority of luxury buyers soon enough) expect sustainability. Companies need to cater to that. It’s just good business sense. And if sustainability happens to be better for the planet along the way, why not?

Although 80% is recyclable, not even close to that is being recycled. Furthermore, the production of an electric car is very harmful to the environment. The environmental toll of electric car batteries begins before the product is even assembled, most notably in the mining of its active material, lithium. We are wrecking the environment in new ways which are actually worse than the old ways.

Additionally, scientists disagree on the "science and the facts" all the time. So which scientist are you to believe?

[Joearch]

Originally Posted by rajurama

Its the way world is functioning whether we like it or not... V8 V6 engines are looked down upon and all major Car co.s are forced to electrify for the new world... The fact these dead electric batteries might actually do more damage to environment in future for disposal is to be seen... The extra electricity generation required will have more impact to environment... More fossil fuels burned , nuclear waste released etc etc

Also the e steel might actually be more energy consuming or even the cardbox ... Knowone knows but for sales and marketing people only have one target that is to please a certain mentality to achive more sales at the end of the day. Its all a gimmick no one really gives a damn about the planet in reality and thats the sad part of today's world. Most activists are just fame hungry rather than actual crusaders.

Environmental concern is not a gimmick and many people do give a damn. For Panerai to show some consideration makes them forward thinking, at least IMHO.

[rootbeer7]

Originally Posted by itsjknight

Just watched "WatchAdvisor - PANERAI: Straight talk with CEO Jean-Marc Pontroue and I can't believe this guy.

So starting in 2023 all watch will be converted over to the stupid "esteel" with the transition complete by 2025. I don't understand the logic in a luxury product using recycled materials! I don't want a watch with any recycled materials in it.

I guess I'm done buying Panerai's I just don't like the direction the company has been going since this guy took over as CEO. They are also getting rid of the wood boxes and the watches will now come in a small cardboard box with travel case.

If anyone at Panerai is listening you need to get rid of this guy and get back to your roots of what made Panerai a success. It's certainly not esteel and feminine looking travel cases.

You’re stuck in the past. ‘Feminine boxes’??
Panerai are marketing to the new consumer, not dinosaurs like us on a watch forum. Do I buy into it? Absolutely not!!

[WalterE]

Originally Posted by Cru Jones

[...]
As for watches, apparently the younger generation (those who will be the majority of luxury buyers soon enough) expect sustainability. Companies need to cater to that. It’s just good business sense. And if sustainability happens to be better for the planet along the way, why not?

Originally Posted by rootbeer7

[...] Panerai are marketing to the new consumer, not dinosaurs like us on a watch forum. [...]

The CEO is doing his job to reposition the brand in the eyes of those who will make the consumers' landscape for luxury items 10 ys down the road. It is a long term strategy that does not focus on values and drivers of past consumers, but those of our children.

It is both normal that many current and old-time consumers don't feel connected to the new strategy, as well as that the CEO's strategy is considered a legitimate and smart business move by investors.

Only time will tell.

[jojosnr]

My view is that sustainability and luxury does not mix very well. Many chose Panerai for its unique design direction, history and for keeping its heritage, at least up till now. Many successful higher end brands remain successful because these are among the factors one choses a luxury item. Simply adjusting to fads and changing demographics is a very simplistic strategy atuned to mid level brands. (aside, using scraps from machining is not new nor unique as metal scraps has been for the longest time recycled).

[stockae92]

I am fine with eSteel, I just don't like the new box and packaging.

[Blunt Instrument]

Originally Posted by stockae92

I am fine with eSteel, I just don't like the new box and packaging.

I'm with you on the packaging, it's a real head scratcher. If a purchaser doesn't want a box, why not have the dealer keep it? If they standardize the packaging, the dealer can reuse and order more when they need them. That seems like a better eco solution than their new box. It would also cost Panerai less, since not everyone would take a box. Seems like an easy win win.

Aesthetics wise, the color looks like Breitling. Great branding is recognizable from across a room. Using your competitors colors in packaging is so baffling. Paneria could've kept their box experience by using young wood, which is also eco friendly, and kept their uniqueness.

This new solution looks like an attempt to cheapen their packaging cost and add a feature that other brands have started doing, namely the travel case (see Omega and Zenith). On that note, I'd say their competitors did it better. The Panerai's travel case, with the rotating lid, looks so bulky. When traveling, and space is a premium, why would one want to take a large travel case?

[rambo99]

Originally Posted by stockae92

I am fine with eSteel, I just don't like the new box and packaging.

what does the new carboard box look like?

[6XYBE63ST]

"PANERAI" welcome to the new swatch

[mobster600]

If your into collecting knives. Steel is a focal point. There are many blends of steel. Some for hardness, corrosion resistance, durability etc. Not sure what blend Panerai is using but I’d be curious to see the molecularity differences. Might squash some of the backlash

[VegasBaby]

Panerai has been a dumpster fire for years…….Limited Editions, Special Editions…… At the end of the day, other than to the Panerai enthusiasts, they all look the same.

[watchnlaw]

At some point you'd think the gimmick special editions would have to run their coarse. There are only so many that fans will buy before it's overkill.