Young Guns of Watchmaking

[rockdrock]

These young men are on my purchasing horizon for years to come. Each have their own watchmaking vision and something very artistic to offer. Check this great vid. Anyone else following?




https://youtu.be/L2n2yOgI_Yo

[GB-man]

That was fun. I have been watching Auffret and Cools the last year or two as well as peterman bedat to an extent.

[eiesh]

Originally Posted by GB-man

That was fun. I have been watching Auffret and Cools the last year or two as well as peterman bedat to an extent.

Same here. Of the lot, Auffret is at the top of my list. The Tourbillon Grand Sport is more my style, was happy to hear a 3-hand version should be coming out in 2024 with the same theme.

Excited to see what Xhevdet will be coming out with in April, like he said because of his brother I'm sure all 100 pieces will be spoken for.

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[enjoythemusic]

Great vid, thx! These 'kids' are the future if horology... and I love it! New ideas with a fresh perspective.

[trichard3000]

I love this! Thanks for sharing.

[rockdrock]

Glad the few of you enjoyed it. Just realizing how super niche is this thread. But, it is well worth the research on some of these upcoming watchmakers.

[Ichiran]

Thanks for sharing. I like traditional and smallish watches with hand-finishing and many of these young men share the same philosophy. The handmade Vincent Deprez Tourbillon Classique is beyond sexy and priced reasonably, but alas sold out. The handmade Origine by Sylvain Pinaud is another lovely creation and I'm sure it will do very well. Those Raul Pages' hand-finished movements are Dufour-ish. Theo Auffret's hand-finshed movement and dial aesthetics are also superb. Petermann Bedat has a couple of pieces at my AD and I have handled them. I understand both of them worked at Lange and it shows in their finishing.

It's amazing all their watches have great finishing and inward angles. Would love to add them if available of course. The future of watches is alive and vibrant.

[77T]

I enjoyed it and wish each one will push the new creative direction in the same way bistronomy has for cuisine.

Reality tells me they need to eat; the essence of that means self-sustaining profitability. Hope each can find the balance to preserve the creativity.

Does anyone have a gallery of their recent releases?


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[chalkflewup]

Excellent video. Really interesting to hear their thoughts on speculative buyers yet also the experience that they're happy to be part of with the collectors.

[chet1022]

Originally Posted by chalkflewup

Excellent video. Really interesting to hear their thoughts on speculative buyers yet also the experience that they're happy to be part of with the collectors.

They are well aware of the speculative market and keep being humble. And it is great to see how they interacted with each other which reflected their personalities in a way.

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by chet1022

And it is great to see how they interacted with each other which reflected their personalities in a way.

100% agree. Imho it seems that they realize it's not a 'pure competition' where 'winner-takes-all', and by working together horology grows stronger.

This is one (of the many) reasons why i highly admire Max B and what he's accomplished with MB&F. He's very humbled to showcase the many people / companies that have assisted in creating an MB&F masterpiece. This is something i'd highly support.

The more one delves deeper, the more the need for a new publication that showcases these youthful watchmakers, new developments, and new possibilities that were not available just a handful or so of years ago. We need a publication that has 'fresh eyes' into the future of horology.

One thing we can all agree on (imho), horology is well past the 1960s Trilogy brands. Today's possibilities seem nearly endless and look forward to the years ahead.

[chet1022]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

One thing we can all agree on (imho), horology is well past the 1960s Trilogy brands. Today's possibilities seem nearly endless and look forward to the years ahead.

Interesting point you raised here. I kept wondering when I watched the video: is it a destined trend that independents become a sort of booming market with the undervalued days never coming back? What is the biggest risk the independents world might face? Will the community change tastes to another segment? I think I agree with you but it all just happened too fast in the past two to three years.

[enjoythemusic]

You make great points, yet independents have been around for a long, long time. Some, like George Daniels, did work for others. Perhaps the Internet has greatly helped to bring more light to these watchmakers.

As LOL as it sounds, back around 1996 I remember a 'fabled CD-R' with some of the most epic pics of timepieces from such smaller 'brands'. If you got a copy of the CD-R it felt like you were 'chosen' to see these mind-blowing mechanical creations. The handful of 'crazies' back then did not have a way to see these otherwise, let alone us finding one another (TimeZone was good, but seems we were not quite there 'yet' so to speak).

Today we have an abundance of ways to discover that one watchmaker within a small village who creates art. Agree the past few years have been a massive catalyst for many (in general, not just horology).

I'm excited to see where the passion in art, science, and 'mechanical/material technology' of horology goes 10 years from now... and 20 after that.

As for value, today, these more youthful watchmakers seem to realize they need to provide something special that showcases..... and each could have very different interpretations. Know I talk a lot about Max Busser, yet finding guys like Stephen McDonnell AND having the ability to see his ideas all the way to 'production' is no easy task. At the same time, Max is also a kind of 'Humble Whisperer' of where I personally hope we see horology go.

Of course it is up to (how many of) us appreciate and supports this, in a sense validating these passionate artistic creations via desired ownership.

[chalkflewup]

Based on a light search here, I was not able to find a direct answer to the following. Does anyone have experience to share when deciding on a purchase from an independent watchmaker such as the ones presented in the video? What to consider? What questions to ask? Assuming I've made the decision as to the type of complication I am seeking, as well as a budget range, what else should one be asking of the watchmaker when making such a commitment? Thanks in advance for sharing your experience.

[EEpro]

Originally Posted by chalkflewup

Based on a light search here, I was not able to find a direct answer to the following. Does anyone have experience to share when deciding on a purchase from an independent watchmaker such as the ones presented in the video? What to consider? What questions to ask? Assuming I've made the decision as to the type of complication I am seeking, as well as a budget range, what else should one be asking of the watchmaker when making such a commitment? Thanks in advance for sharing your experience.

My concerns would be about service. Who will service it if they go tango uniform ? What is the cost of service. It's easy to say it doesn't matter as a fraction of purchase price but we've seen Lange pushing $10,000 when the watch isn't even broken.

[Ichiran]

Originally Posted by chalkflewup

Based on a light search here, I was not able to find a direct answer to the following. Does anyone have experience to share when deciding on a purchase from an independent watchmaker such as the ones presented in the video? What to consider? What questions to ask? Assuming I've made the decision as to the type of complication I am seeking, as well as a budget range, what else should one be asking of the watchmaker when making such a commitment? Thanks in advance for sharing your experience.

I have bought from FP Journe, Kari and Romain Gauthier. Based on my own experience, they are very busy and won't be responsive immediately to questions. If you are going through AD, you can ask your AD these questions instead as they are supposed to know their watches. If your AD does not have the answers, they will contact the brands directly and these brands are very responsive to AD. If you are asking these watchmakers directly, some of those younger watchmakers are more responsive as they are trying to build their customer base and more engaging to would-be customers over emails. Also, they are not 100% comfortable with English so you have to be more patient during your communication.

In terms of questions, it really depends on what you are looking for in their watches. You can research many answers online and in YouTube (WatchesTV, Swiss Watch Gang, Revolution Watch interview them occasionally; Tim Mosso reviewed many such watches). For me I'm interested in hand-finishing so if I ever have direct questions for them, I will ask them how much time they take to do the finishing, anglage, etc and if they finish their watches themselves. I will also ask them if they are committed to service their own watches and what's the turnaround time (also ask them if they use any special/unique components that cannot be serviced by 3rd parties). Last but not least, I will ask which components of their watches are not made by them. I care about that aspect as well.

Have fun buying independents.

[eiesh]

Originally Posted by Ichiran

I have bought from FP Journe, Kari and Romain Gauthier. Based on my own experience, they are very busy and won't be responsive immediately to questions. If you are going through AD, you can ask your AD these questions instead as they are supposed to know their watches. If your AD does not have the answers, they will contact the brands directly and these brands are very responsive to AD. If you are asking these watchmakers directly, some of those younger watchmakers are more responsive as they are trying to build their customer base and more engaging to would-be customers over emails. Also, they are not 100% comfortable with English so you have to be more patient during your communication.

In terms of questions, it really depends on what you are looking for in their watches. You can research many answers online and in YouTube (WatchesTV, Swiss Watch Gang, Revolution Watch interview them occasionally; Tim Mosso reviewed many such watches). For me I'm interested in hand-finishing so if I ever have direct questions for them, I will ask them how much time they take to do the finishing, anglage, etc and if they finish their watches themselves. I will also ask them if they are committed to service their own watches and what's the turnaround time (also ask them if they use any special/unique components that cannot be serviced by 3rd parties). Last but not least, I will ask which components of their watches are not made by them. I care about that aspect as well.

Have fun buying independents.

Wait a second.....we have seen the FPs & Pateks but hiding the Kari & Romain Gauthier, so not fair....

Please grace us with some pictures of your Kari & Romain Gauthier, plus this thread needs some pictures.

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[Ichiran]

Originally Posted by eiesh

Wait a second.....we have seen the FPs & Pateks but hiding the Kari & Romain Gauthier, so not fair....

Please grace us with some pictures of your Kari & Romain Gauthier, plus this thread needs some pictures.

I placed an order for a Vingt-8 last March and it is expected in 2026.
https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=845060

For RG, I will post a thread hopefully tomorrow.

I was sharing my purchase experience for these 2 only...

[eiesh]

Originally Posted by Ichiran

I placed an order for a Vingt-8 last March and it is expected in 2026.
https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=845060

For RG, I will post a thread hopefully tomorrow.

I was sharing my purchase experience for these 2 only...

Thanks for the response.
I'm sure you hear this all time but you're a true inspiration to many of us.
Glad you also gave your seal of approval for Theo Auffret in terms of his finishing, a boost of confidence for me.


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[rockdrock]

Originally Posted by eiesh

Please grace us with some pictures of your Kari & Romain Gauthier, plus this thread needs some pictures.

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yes, this post needs pics. Here is my 2022 Petermann Bedat Seconds Series in Titanium. Adore it and connecting with the watchmakers is truly special.

[Ichiran]

Originally Posted by rockdrock

yes, this post needs pics. Here is my 2022 Petermann Bedat Seconds Series in Titanium. Adore it and connecting with the watchmakers is truly special.

That's a brilliant hand-finished and traditonally sized watch. Congratulations for the acquisition and do post your watches more often.

[huydoan]

Originally Posted by rockdrock

yes, this post needs pics. Here is my 2022 Petermann Bedat Seconds Series in Titanium. Adore it and connecting with the watchmakers is truly special.

please post the backside. may I ask when did you order it and how long it was delivered? I have been also on the waiting list for this beautiful watch since Jan 2021, but it seems the AD may have skipped me

[chet1022]

Originally Posted by chalkflewup

Based on a light search here, I was not able to find a direct answer to the following. Does anyone have experience to share when deciding on a purchase from an independent watchmaker such as the ones presented in the video? What to consider? What questions to ask? Assuming I've made the decision as to the type of complication I am seeking, as well as a budget range, what else should one be asking of the watchmaker when making such a commitment? Thanks in advance for sharing your experience.

For the relatively established independents, like Romain Gauthier, Lang & Heyne, Haldimann, just check their websites and you will find ADs or partners. If you are interested in those in OP video, I believe you can directly email them or DM in social media.

[enjoythemusic]

The Lange service quote was outrageous, plus it included replacing bits not needing replacing imho as I recall. Who owns ALS, ah yes Richemont, there's your answer why.

PS: I read a guy damaged his MB&F, they fixed it gratis. But yes, a very valid question concerning servicing. I'm not worried about the Laine manual wind, an advantage of using a known base movement.

[enjoythemusic]

[rockdrock]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Attachment 1342999

Thanks ETM. Yes, I am also working a purple dial collection. ; )

[Incroyable12]

Do any young independents hand finish older highly regarded movements like the Valjoux 13 Ligne, Omega 30T2s, etc. and recase them?

Patek and Audemars both used highly modified Valjouxs in their precision pre-WWII wristwatches so it'd be keeping in spirit to produce such watches today.

[rockdrock]

Originally Posted by Incroyable12

Do any young independents hand finish older highly regarded movements like the Valjoux 13 Ligne, Omega 30T2s, etc. and recase them?

Patek and Audemars both used highly modified Valjouxs in their precision pre-WWII wristwatches so it'd be keeping in spirit to produce such watches today.

Ohhh, great question. The only brand that I am aware is Atelier de Chronometrie Barcelona. They have great classical style watches.

[Incroyable12]

Originally Posted by rockdrock

Ohhh, great question. The only brand that I am aware is Atelier de Chronometrie Barcelona. They have great classical style watches.

Oh I wasn't previously aware of them, some good looking watches.

There's also Naoya Hida and Kikuchi Nakagawa in Japan.

Since uncased precision vintage Omega and Valjoux movements are relatively easy to find, I'm surprised there aren't more people doing this.

[enjoythemusic]

Hmmm, he's on Linkedin. DM him there I guess.