Sales success does not equal style (Porsche)

[zama]

I was prompted to start this thread after reading the one about the Ferrari FF. Let me start by saying I am a big Porsche fan have owned 3 including my current 968CS and looking against my better judgement to buy my wife a 996 Targa 3.6L (I am trying to talk her into a quality Porsche a 993 Targa, i.e. one that does not go bang as the motor explodes). While we can debate for hours on whether Porsche lost its quality and mojo between 1997 and 2010, the purpose of this thread is about styling. And I realise it may offend some viewers if so look away NOW.

I fell in love with Porsche's not just because of their racing pedigree and robust quality but because they genuinely looked good. Link below is of an original 928, they are timeless, my 968CS last of the line I feel is the same. Haam Laggay and Tony Lapine designers of the time were amazing. Today we have the Cayenne, Cayman and Panamera, depending on your taste and I don't mean to offend 3 genuinely average external designs no matter how good the mechanicals are under the skin (nobody says about Lambo nice performance pity about the lid).

I think Porsche, at least in design have grown lazy off the runaway success of the Boxster. For me it is with real Irony, that in the years Porsche faced its lowest point and went close to going out the back door in a recession was when it made its single best products. I.e. Circa 1993-1996. The range included the mighty 993 911 in all its forms (base 2 wheel drive manual an amazing car through to the air cooled first Twin Turbo), not to mention my own beloved 968CS and late series 928's. All over the world these cars and climbing in value, as enthusiasts realise they were best of the breed, while Boxsters and modern 911's go backwards.

Even the once untouchable 911 in its latest incarnation with drive by wire steering recently was rolled in EVO magazine in the UK by the now 5??? year old base model Audi R8 (a great car no doubt) in a mega test.

Hopefully this thread pulls out some healthy comments from the Porsche fans. Remember the spirit of the thread is about design. So I do look forward to those who can share for me the design excellence of the Double ended ferry (known as the Cayman) or better still the Cayenne a car that i feel wears Hannibal Lector's face mask with pride, and as for the Panamera, well words fail me only to say the designer of it and the new Bentley SUV must have been close friends in crayon class. All of these cars no doubt are very fast and reliable (996's explosions aside).

If I appear bias and like a disco diva who believes music reached its peek in 1975, then so be it, I wish the Porsche world was 1994 all over again!!!!! at 41 I am now old enough to be a stick in the mud.

Before you ask, I think BMW also make ugly cars today vs the E34 M30 3 series etc, I don't care much for Ferrari after the 355, Merc is OK and Lambo / Maser still show how it should be done, Aston as well (all be it they put the same sketch through a xerox and hit shrink or grow to invent each new model). The success of each brand shows style no longer is that critical it seems in buying decisions as all are doing well.

OK I will be quiet now. Scanning to get my pic ran across my photos from the old Porsche Museum in Stuttgart, so tagged a favourite from there as well. I think if memory serves me correct this was the evolved 1974 RSR that dominated group 5 and even ran in top 10 at Le Mans, in the classic Martini colouring over silver. Can i have one please!!!

http://www.classicandperformancecar....re.php?id=2304

[zama]

Ok since I am at a loss on other things to do, nothing goes better than my old classic first year of production 1982 911SC cabriolet. Which I restored to concourse condition. Hopefully some others out there in this new fangled world like old school like me.

[crew]

Originally Posted by zama

Ok since I am at a loss on other things to do, nothing goes better than my old classic first year of production 1982 911SC cabriolet. Which I restored to concourse condition. Hopefully some others out there in this new fangled world like old school like me.

1982???
Those lines are classic. As timeless today as it was when it was built.
Beautiful restoration.

To the OP: I think you're on to something. The Boxster is a huge commercial hit. Heck, I even like them myself. Overall, however, it seems that Porsche has taken a turn from its heritage. I'd still love to own one though.

[Rsvrider]

Well let me say YOU ARE RIGHT!
I have owned several Porsches from the 928GTS, 930, 993, 986 (horrible car died from cam lifter failure), 996 (RMS issues). The last two with the lack of quality inside and out is what made look elsewhere. I am now an AMG fan.
Going back to design....Ferry is long gone and at one point (Panamera and Cayenne) I though things were gonna go south. But there is light at the end of the tunnel and the evolution of the roadster is alive and well. No, not the Boxster. I am talking the line from 550 thru 917 and NOW the 918 Spyder.

[zama]

I am glad I am not alone, the 918 shows massive potential, although the chase to make it hybrid is starting to compromise its weight by all accounts.

May you and your AMG's smoke happily for years to come, and may Michelin grow rich on your enjoyment. There is something special about a well made German button down suit company making a line of cars that does 60's Mopar proud.

[Rsvrider]

Well, I have high hopes that Porsche -one day- decides to release a heritage line. I am only 35 but old enough to remember when cars were mechanic. No paddles, no anti lock, PSM etc: no disconect from the driving experience. Going back to design: Porsche appealed to me because it was simple and light. Today's 911 (although beautiful to my eye) seems HUGE! Even the RSRs of the '70 with the huge rear quarters and massive whale tails look small. Here's my goal (just like yours) in a couple of years ill be buying a 70's 911 (if lucky the one with the oil filler on the side quarter) and transforming it to a RS (webers and all). THAT to me was the best looking road going Porsche and cleanest on design! The hard part will be the color scheme: Mex Blue, Green, Silver or full out Martini&Rossi?

[East Bay Rider]

Originally Posted by zama

Ok since I am at a loss on other things to do, nothing goes better than my old classic first year of production 1982 911SC cabriolet. Which I restored to concourse condition. Hopefully some others out there in this new fangled world like old school like me.

You are not alone.

When I dream of Porsche I dream in 1987.


Pic stolen from Internet.

[collegeparkrolex]

I like Porsche's, but I also like bang for the buck and Porsche doesn't offer anything that can hang with my baby. Here she is:


If money were not a consideration I would buy this goregous 911 Twin Turbo with the Vorsteiner Package:


Cheers!

[lavaman]

oh wah! you guys with your Porsches whining because the new ones arent pretty enough?

C'mon, man, I agree that the 968 is an awesome, do anything vehicle. I love that they didnt change the 911 door for 30 some years. I love the 911 SC model. I like the 917, and the slow-flying Lear Jet that was the 928 GTs4

But seriously, I like the damn Boxster S. It reminds me of the old 550. I love the Cayenne, reminds me of the 904 Carrera. Yes, I think Porsche should have never made an SUV, and I think the Panamera looks like a 930 that's been left at the bottom of a lake for some weeks.

But I would love to own any of those cars. I find it odd that you guys like the 944/928 line. Do you remember how damn controverial they were when they first came out? Oh no, shades of the VoPo all over again (914). What do you mean ze engine es ein ze front? No bumpers? They called it the nicest Corvette Zuffenhausen ever made. (Source: Porsche: Excellence was Expected // Porsche: The Great Cars)

As the designer said at the time, "Do we not evolve?" I agree, I like the 911s as long as they were air cooled.

Look, I came within an inch of buying a used Boxster S. But being a single parent new attorney, I decided to chuck it. I havent let go. (I have am m3 convertible instead).

But whining on and and a bit when the rest of us "normal" folks would love to have the time, let alone the income to restore a 911 SC.

Look, if any of you get so fed up with your latest Porsche in your fleet, feel free to toss the offending chariot my way :-)

[Launch Mini]

I've not yet owned a Porsche but admire them. A 1984 911 Rec with a big whale tail is one Image that sticks with me. Also the 928. However the RX7 kinda if ruined the 928 style for me. It IMO was a cheaper look a like.
A Cayman would be nice, not a Boxster fan though.
Ideally a new black GT3 would do me well. There is one down the street from me. Just gorgeous.

[kareemthedream33]

Still love Porsche, but I agree that the sedan is hideous, especially from behind.

Also agree with you on BMW. The current 7 series is a GREAT car, but the exterior just doesn't do it for me. I could never call it beautiful. Now the previous 7 series, which ended in 2001, was a gorgeous car. That thing reeked of style and class.

[turbodiver]

Originally Posted by zama

Ok since I am at a loss on other things to do, nothing goes better than my old classic first year of production 1982 911SC cabriolet. Which I restored to concourse condition. Hopefully some others out there in this new fangled world like old school like me.

Absolutly beautiful!!!!

[lavaman]

agree, the current 7 looks like the box the old one came in.

oddly, I LOVE the new 5,and that same funky styiling that TKO'd the 7 for me works on the 3.

oh well.

[QueueCumber]

I could have bought a 911 TT for the price of my car with all its mods. Considering all the headaches that come with a heavily modded car (rebuilt engine, transmission, intake, exhaust system, etc., etc.), I wishing I did lately... Or perhaps I should have bought a new Ferrari instead for a few extra 10K.

[SiSiSenor]

Very nice rides.

Craig, maybe you'd like to check out my thread I made a little while back? Might be of interest to you, or at least eye-candy.

http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=235611

[Rsvrider]

Originally Posted by lavaman

oh wah! you guys with your Porsches whining because the new ones arent pretty enough?

But seriously, I like the damn Boxster S. It reminds me of the old 550. I love the Cayenne, reminds me of the 904 Carrera. Yes, I think Porsche should have never made an SUV, and I think the Panamera looks like a 930 that's been left at the bottom of a lake for some weeks.

I think you meant Cayman instead of Cayenne. When I posted the line-up of Porsches I have owned I skipped the Cayman bc it was short lived.
My impressions: the design is very sexy (Jeremy Clarkson would kill me for saying so) the interior a vast improvement in design and quality vs the 996 it replaced and the powertrain was adequate (zippy and balanced).
I had the car for 6-8 months and it was just not visceral, thats when I tried AMG and my world spun!
Here's a pic, pardon the garage. Its a mess. I dream one day Ill have one of those garages that resemble F1 pits

[lavaman]

yea im no so good with the names thing. the 996 ended the 911 line for me.

oh well.

[Esexx]

I have always loved Porsche's, but never thought I would have one. Never happened sooner than I thought and I got a 996. I know there is a lot of 996 hatred, but I am replacing IMS/RMS and a few other things that will relieve some stress.

I do have to say, nothing (IMHO) beats driving a Porsche and I smile every time I get in the P-car and drive off. My boys love to car too. I wish I would have filmed them when I loaded them up in the rear seats, put the top down and took them up the coast for a quick ride. They were excited and laughed all the way!

I compare my 996 with my 11660. Both are iconic for their brands, timeless and classic. Not the "best" or most expensive, but perfect for my taste.

My older son and I were watching a infomercial on "On Demand" for the 991. He was wide eyed and glued to the screen. He kept on asking questions and I told him, "When you start driving in 10 years, I could get that same exact car for you." Hopefully by then, I will have bought a cherry 993!!!!

** Sorry for the dirty car photo, it was all I had.

[lavaman]

Yea it's filthy and I'm offended :-)

[floater156]

I can't even fit in a porsche, i'm 6'6" lol

[Esexx]

LOL...the reason I only have 1 photo is because of dust everywhere. So I drove the speed limit to a Starbucks to kill time before work.

Originally Posted by lavaman

Yea it's filthy and I'm offended :-)

You just have to do like Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, remove the front seats and sit in the back. (Forgot which movie and I think it was a Honda)

Originally Posted by floater156

I can't even fit in a porsche, i'm 6'6" lol

[SiSiSenor]

Originally Posted by floater156

I can't even fit in a porsche, i'm 6'6" lol

Solution: Buy a convertible.

[77T]

Originally Posted by zama

I fell in love with Porsche's not just because of their racing pedigree and robust quality but because they genuinely looked good.

Design follows function IMHO. "Looks" were not the point of the cars. The cars have become bigger, fatter, heavier but still they are great grin generators. We started racing them in the '70s and didn't much care what the girls thought they looked like.

If you aren't driving the 911 then you're driving a lesser Porsche by choice. The other models are made for niches to capture some market share - so understandable if they don't follow the "original Porsche style sheet".

[DS_Obsessed]

http://www.magnuswalker911.com/

[77T]

Originally Posted by Esexx

I do have to say, nothing (IMHO) beats driving a Porsche and I smile every time I get in the P-car and drive off.

This is why they make them!

[iLLGT2]

Shame on me for owning such an 'ugly' car, YUCK :p ..... 6 years on the track in my RUF GT2, no issues.. Most rock solid car i've ever owned, and that goes for it being a daily/weekend car/track car, etc.. I've done it all :)

[zeuloa]

Originally Posted by collegeparkrolex

I like Porsche's, but I also like bang for the buck and Porsche doesn't offer anything that can hang with my baby. Here she is:

The joy of driving isn't necessarily who goes the fastest in a straight road. Nothing like a good twisty road, and not many cars like a Porsche 911 for this.

[Kingkaiser]

I'm inclined to agree with the OP up to some extent. The majority of new designs from the house of Porsche look like things a marginally talented 5 year old would put together if asked to draw a car. The cayenne is perhaps the ugliest SUV in existence; the Hannibal lector comparison seemed very apt. As for the panemera: beautiful exterior, but looks the product of a drunken rendezvous between a 911 and a Bentley continental.

However, i think the new Carreras are exactly what the evolved ones should look like. A little beefy but true to their heritage and in line with prior demands.

Don't get me started on BMW. Bangle created some stylistic nightmares in his time, and is finally going the right way. If it wasn't for a growing middle/upper class in the early 2000s driving BMW sales, he would have lost his job a long time back

[Cru Jones]

i have to respectfully disagree with respect to the new 911, boxster and cayman. all three models are both beautiful and beastly in my eyes, and represent great progress from the late 90s and early-to-mid 2000s, when, in my opinion, the 911 seemed bloated and the boxster looked a little wimpy.

and don't forget the interiors, which have made tremendous progress from where they used to be.

the classics are great, but, that's what they are, classics. things evolve, and i think that, at least with respect to these three models, porsche (under VW) is going in the right direction.

[zama]

Since I started the controversy I should say I think the new 911 and Boxster look great as well and would love one, jury for me is still out on the new Cayman, for me while it is mechanically terrific it still does not look as consistent as the Boxster, and is starting to look a little like an Exige in these photos. That still leaves the Cayenne and Panamera as shockers!!!!!!

I am a little worried about the move to different steering, I dont see what is wrong with what we have all loved for so long.