Tudor Bb58 vs Rolex submariner no date

[trabjergknudsen]

Hi;)

I am considering buying a Tudor Bb58 and could any more tell pros/cons conpared to a sub no date(5 digit) before maxi case - what about size? - is it the same?

Br.
Mikkel

[sp3ak]

I found this past thread on it, perhaps it will help.

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=593966

My personal opinion is that the price difference makes it hard to choose the Sub. That is unless you really want the Rolex name on your wrist. A Tudor may be my next purchase as well.

[Jmbarrack]

Originally Posted by trabjergknudsen

Hi;)



I am considering buying a Tudor Bb58 and could any more tell pros/cons conpared to a sub no date(5 digit) before maxi case - what about size? - is it the same?



Br.

Mikkel

Hey there ... I owned both in the past year. Below is a little comparison.

Case:
Sizes are similar. BB58 wears a little flatter on the wrist because it’s only 200m water resistance. But they were very similar on the wrist if not almost identical.

Looks:
58 has the faux patina and the 14060 is monochrome black and white. Personally, I liked the look of the 58. It was different. The rose gold accents were a really nice touch and stood out in a sea of black and white watches.

Dial/hands:
The big difference is the snow flake vs Mercedes hands. The 58 has more lume on the hands, they’re also nice a big and well proportioned to the overall dial and case. Tudor did a great job. Also really like the matte dial that Tudor put on the 58. The Sub has a glossy dial, and white gold hands and indices. The Tudor does not use gold for the hands or markers.

Bracelet:
The 58 bracelet is comfortable and nicely constructed. It’s also got solid endlinks but with a pivoting first link, meaning there is not end link that sticks out like on other Rolex models. This helps it wear smaller. The 14060 has the old stamped hollow end-link bracelet which is super comfortable. Only downsize is it’s hard finding one in great condition with minimal stretch. Also to note that the 14060 has more micro-adjustments in the clasp than the 57. The 58 only has 3, sub 7.

Movement:
My 58 kept great time. I think it was +1 spd. My 14060 kept even better time at around +/-0. The difference is my 14060 was a 2011 and had just been serviced. That’s probably not the norm you’ll find for older model Subs. The 58 gives you a new Tudor in-house movement. Most 14060s you find will likely need servicing.

Attaching some photos. Don’t have a great head on one of the Tudor. Didn’t have it long.

Hope that helps.






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[Bluside]

Originally Posted by Jmbarrack

Hey there ... I owned both in the past year. Below is a little comparison.

Case:
Sizes are similar. BB58 wears a little flatter on the wrist because it’s only 200m water resistance. But they were very similar on the wrist if not almost identical.

Looks:
58 has the faux patina and the 14060 is monochrome black and white. Personally, I liked the look of the 58. It was different. The rose gold accents were a really nice touch and stood out in a sea of black and white watches.

Dial/hands:
The big difference is the snow flake vs Mercedes hands. The 58 has more lume on the hands, they’re also nice a big and well proportioned to the overall dial and case. Tudor did a great job. Also really like the matte dial that Tudor put on the 58. The Sub has a glossy dial, and white gold hands and indices. The Tudor does not use gold for the hands or markers.

Bracelet:
The 58 bracelet is comfortable and nicely constructed. It’s also got solid endlinks but with a pivoting first link, meaning there is not end link that sticks out like on other Rolex models. This helps it wear smaller. The 14060 has the old stamped hollow end-link bracelet which is super comfortable. Only downsize is it’s hard finding one in great condition with minimal stretch. Also to note that the 14060 has more micro-adjustments in the clasp than the 57. The 58 only has 3, sub 7.

Movement:
My 58 kept great time. I think it was +1 spd. My 14060 kept even better time at around +/-0. The difference is my 14060 was a 2011 and had just been serviced. That’s probably not the norm you’ll find for older model Subs. The 58 gives you a new Tudor in-house movement. Most 14060s you find will likely need servicing.

Attaching some photos. Don’t have a great head on one of the Tudor. Didn’t have it long.

Hope that helps.

Nice review. What didn't you like about the Tudor that you got rid of it?

[1William]

I like both watches but would go with the BB58 over the older five digit Submariner all day long. I prefer the design, look, bracelet and better movement of the Tudor. Not to mention the cost and the fact that the older five digit will need a service, if that has not been done recently. The Tudor is not settling in my opinion. Now if you were going to go with the modern 6 digit Submariner with the ceramic bezel, solid bracelet, glidelock clasp and updated case then I would tell you it is a superior watch, for me. The only thing then would be the money and personal preference. Good luck and let us know what you decide.

[Jmbarrack]

Originally Posted by Bluside

Nice review. What didn't you like about the Tudor that you got rid of it?

Thanks!

My only issue with the Tudor was the bracelet. It was comfortable, fit well and was good quality, but it was very clear that they used either a different mix of alloys or a different brushing technique on it and it didn’t match the case. I’ll attach photos so you can see. These are untouched photos.

Once I saw it, I just couldn’t unsee it and it drove me nuts. I see it so often in people’s photos when they post pictures of their 58s.

This was one of the first batch to come off the line, so I’m not sure if this was fixed in subsequent productions runs, but it was very obvious something wasn’t the same.






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[trabjergknudsen]

Originally Posted by Jmbarrack

Hey there ... I owned both in the past year. Below is a little comparison.

Case:
Sizes are similar. BB58 wears a little flatter on the wrist because it’s only 200m water resistance. But they were very similar on the wrist if not almost identical.

Looks:
58 has the faux patina and the 14060 is monochrome black and white. Personally, I liked the look of the 58. It was different. The rose gold accents were a really nice touch and stood out in a sea of black and white watches.

Dial/hands:
The big difference is the snow flake vs Mercedes hands. The 58 has more lume on the hands, they’re also nice a big and well proportioned to the overall dial and case. Tudor did a great job. Also really like the matte dial that Tudor put on the 58. The Sub has a glossy dial, and white gold hands and indices. The Tudor does not use gold for the hands or markers.

Bracelet:
The 58 bracelet is comfortable and nicely constructed. It’s also got solid endlinks but with a pivoting first link, meaning there is not end link that sticks out like on other Rolex models. This helps it wear smaller. The 14060 has the old stamped hollow end-link bracelet which is super comfortable. Only downsize is it’s hard finding one in great condition with minimal stretch. Also to note that the 14060 has more micro-adjustments in the clasp than the 57. The 58 only has 3, sub 7.

Movement:
My 58 kept great time. I think it was +1 spd. My 14060 kept even better time at around +/-0. The difference is my 14060 was a 2011 and had just been serviced. That’s probably not the norm you’ll find for older model Subs. The 58 gives you a new Tudor in-house movement. Most 14060s you find will likely need servicing.

Attaching some photos. Don’t have a great head on one of the Tudor. Didn’t have it long.

Hope that helps.






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thanks a lot for the comments. I think I try to go for the BB58 - I am not a familiar with buying tudors - where to sanity-check the watch. Looking at the grey market and have found a new one with all stickers, card, box... where are serial number placed on the watch - any other things to check.

br
Mikkel

[Nikrnic]

If you really want a 5 dgt. Sub I'd go for the latest 14060m you can find, (safest bet) Sels, random ser. no. cosc 4 liner, full set, you cant go wrong. That's what I did. I also have two Tudors, a BB41 Sub and a Ranger. The Tudor BB58 is a good and safe choice as well. You'll most likely love it but if your comparing the two now you may keep doing that everytime you see the Rolex. I'd go for the 14060 now, it's just on a different level anyway you look at it. Although we hate to talk about or buy for value and that's not been a mention by you (kudos for that) your going to get it anyway with the 14060
Feels great, very comfortable on the wrist. Happy Choosing! You really can't go wrong..

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[Jmbarrack]

Originally Posted by Nikrnic

If you really want a 5 dgt. Sub I'd go for the latest 14060m you can find, (safest bet) Sels, random ser. no. cosc 4 liner, full set, you cant go wrong.

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The 14060 never got upgraded to SELs. It retained the hollow end links and holes case until it was replaced by the 114060.

But I agree with everything else stated above. 4-liner, G or random serial, which puts it at 2010-2012 - so the last of the 5 digits for sale - is what I would look for if I was going for a 14060m.

The random serial ones also apparently have a parachrom hairspring. So you’re looking at a 5 digit reference with a 6 digit movement.




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[Brny11]

Originally Posted by trabjergknudsen

Hi;)



I am considering buying a Tudor Bb58 and could any more tell pros/cons conpared to a sub no date(5 digit) before maxi case - what about size? - is it the same?



Br.

Mikkel

If you want a Rolex, no other watch will scratch the itch. However, 58 has a more solid build quality, larger power reserve, vintage appeal, great proportions (same as 14060), and brand aside, is as good if not better (in nearly every way). Obviously there is more to watch collecting then actual quality. My friend had a choice between 214270, 114300, 14060 and bb58 and chose the 58 as a wedding gift from his now wife. He couldn’t be happier.

[mario1971]

No offense, but Tudor 58 will not replace Submariner with those who know what Rolex is.

[csaltphoto]

I went through exactly the same thing about a year ago and went with 2010 14060M. No regrets. In the end I wanted a Rolex and all the things that came with it. I also liked the more neutral color palette but appreciate that some folks prefer the color accents of the Tudor. Unfortunately the price on the 4-liners with B+P has gone through the roof. A year ago I paid around 6K for the sub and the 58 was going for a premium over retail so there wasn't much price difference. Now the same sub will cost at least twice a 58 and I'm not sure it's twice the watch.

They might be in the same family but are very different watches. I would try and see if you can find both to try on. I have since tried the 58 on and prefer the Rolex for daily wear.

[kieselguhr]

You already own a 6 digit Submariner. I personally would not be going for an older Submariner or its lookalike. In any case, the best thing to do would be to go and try them both on. Both 5 digit Submariner and BB58 should not be hard to find.

[trabjergknudsen]

To put in I already have a batman;) so have one Rolex


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[mario1971]

There are currently no 58 shelves in Poland, you have to wait about 6 months. There is a Tudor GMT, but it is a more massive watch. There are those for whom Tudor is generally a favorite brand because it is available in boutiques. Such a substitute on the way to Rolex, which you have to wait longer ...

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[Jmbarrack]

Originally Posted by trabjergknudsen

To put in I already have a batman;) so have one Rolex


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Here’s what the pair with the 58 would look like. About a year ago I had this pairing.

I actually sold both and got a 14060m and kept the cash. Long story, but I never cared for the BLNR proportions on my 6.75 inch wrist.

But the two make for a really nice pairing.




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[Nikrnic]

Originally Posted by Jmbarrack

The 14060 never got upgraded to SELs. It retained the hollow end links and holes case until it was replaced by the 114060.

But I agree with everything else stated above. 4-liner, G or random serial, which puts it at 2010-2012 - so the last of the 5 digits for sale - is what I would look for if I was going for a 14060m.

The random serial ones also apparently have a parachrom hairspring. So you’re looking at a 5 digit reference with a 6 digit movement.




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Copy that. I had an 02 K ser. and now the random, probably one of the last being it was first sold in june of '12. I thought (read) they started the switch to Sels on Subs during the '01 models, meaning the end and center link on both oyster and jubilee where it meets the case, not every single one.

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[Jmbarrack]

Originally Posted by Nikrnic

Copy that. I had an 02 K ser. and now the random, probably one of the last being it was first sold in june of '12. I thought (read) they started the switch to Sels on Subs during the '01 models, meaning the end and center link on both oyster and jubilee where it meets the case, not every single one.

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Yes, they did. But only on the Submariner Date. For some reason they left the Submariner alone and never transitioned it to SEL or No holes case.

That’s also part of the charm and I think overall mystique of the reference. It’s very out of place from the Rolex we know now to think they still sold a hollow link and holes case reference for part of the previous decade.

These random and G serial models I think are future classics and represent the last of the best.



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[kieselguhr]

Originally Posted by trabjergknudsen

To put in I already have a batman;) so have one Rolex


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In that case, if I had to make a choice between the two I would probably pick the BB58. Simply because I would prefer to get one new and I am not a fan of paying a ridiculous premium for a ~30 year old watch that is more than likely well worn.

[Jmbarrack]

Originally Posted by kieselguhr

In that case, if I had to make a choice between the two I would probably pick the BB58. Simply because I would prefer to get one new and I am not a fan of paying a ridiculous premium for a ~30 year old watch that is more than likely well worn.

+1 on this.

An excellent or new condition 58 will be a lot easier to her than a good condition 14060. The sub will also likely need a service soon.



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[Nikrnic]

Originally Posted by Jmbarrack

Yes, they did. But only on the Submariner Date. For some reason they left the Submariner alone and never transitioned it to SEL or No holes case.

That’s also part of the charm and I think overall mystique of the reference. It’s very out of place from the Rolex we know now to think they still sold a hollow link and holes case reference for part of the previous decade.

These random and G serial models I think are future classics and represent the last of the best.



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Ok thanks for the update, that pretty much clears it up for me as I've always heard yes an no, had no idea it was different for the Sub besides no holes.

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[mg Barcelona]

I went for a 14060 when deciding between the two. The BB58 is a better watch technically superior but I preferred the history of the Sub. It's was something intangible that could not be quantified. It could be age related, at 48 years old a 5 digit Sub is the Sub.

[trabjergknudsen]

Decided to buy the bb58




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[Jmbarrack]

Originally Posted by trabjergknudsen

Decided to buy the bb58




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Good choice. It looks great on your wrist. Congratulations!

[mario1971]

Congratulations! Let him wear well.

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