Watchtrader & Co. - National crime agency post.

[huncho]

maybe they were stolen watches?

[Calatrava r]

I know the temptation is tough, but I would avoid the used watch market except for obviously used watches which are older and have been worn and then only buy from trusted sellers. The idea of buying used watches which in many cases are only weeks old for big premiums seems risky to me as this case now shows.

[shammad10]

I've just had a look at Companies House.

https://find-and-update.company-info...mpany/09709650

The company is in Liquidation. Does this mean they are in the process of closing down? They are certainly not telling anyone that, and they aren't giving that impression on YouTube.

[rambo99]

Originally Posted by shammad10

Either way, I guess it goes to show- no matter how 'trusted' these sellers are- you just never know.
Watchtrader & Co are one of the biggest UK greys who often supply footballers and celebs etc.

Rolex CPO programme launches, end of grey market dealers.

[huncho]

Originally Posted by rambo99

Rolex CPO programme launches, end of grey market dealers.

i don't think so, i assume rolex CPO prices will be higher so greys should still have their place in the market

[shammad10]

Originally Posted by Calatrava r

I know the temptation is tough, but I would avoid the used watch market except for obviously used watches which are older and have been worn and then only buy from trusted sellers. The idea of buying used watches which in many cases are only weeks old for big premiums seems risky to me as this case now shows.

What does 'trusted sellers' mean though. These would definitely have qualified as 'trusted' in many people's eyes in the UK.

[rambo99]

Originally Posted by shammad10

What does 'trusted sellers' mean though. These would definitely have qualified as 'trusted' in many people's eyes in the UK.

Thats what I thought. I follow their YouTube channel, they are very knowledgeable in watches and I thought they were nice guys!

[Mr Ben]

Originally Posted by shammad10

I've just had a look at Companies House.

https://find-and-update.company-info...mpany/09709650

The company is in Liquidation. Does this mean they are in the process of closing down? They are certainly not telling anyone that, and they aren't giving that impression on YouTube.

If you look on their website, they list a different trading name now which links to the company below. Looks like the liquidators of the previous company sold the company name/ goodwill etc for not a lot of cash - possibly back to a related party given the director surname.

https://find-and-update.company-info...mpany/12133403

If you start googling key staff and looking through paperwork, searching past discussions on this forum, it does raise a number of questions - will let you do your own research…

[knighty88]

Originally Posted by Etschell

money laundering.

this… given the involvement of the NCA, I’d say it highly likely to be an anti-money laundering operation.

[Goupax]

Originally Posted by Mr Ben

If you look on their website, they list a different trading name now which links to the company below. Looks like the liquidators of the previous company sold the company name/ goodwill etc for not a lot of cash - possibly back to a related party given the director surname.

https://find-and-update.company-info...mpany/12133403

If you start googling key staff and looking through paperwork, searching past discussions on this forum, it does raise a number of questions - will let you do your own research…

Why are they registered in Leeds when their business is in Newcastle upon Tyne?

[-Ally-]

Originally Posted by Goupax

Why are they registered in Leeds when their business is in Newcastle upon Tyne?

Registered address does not need to be the trading address, it will likely be their accountants.

[dannyp]

Originally Posted by Etschell

money laundering.

Doesn't explain why people are essentially being alerted that their watches may have been seized from the seller and (presumably) they can start the process of reclaiming them.

[inadeje]

Originally Posted by shammad10

I've just had a look at Companies House.

https://find-and-update.company-info...mpany/09709650

The company is in Liquidation. Does this mean they are in the process of closing down? They are certainly not telling anyone that, and they aren't giving that impression on YouTube.

Accounts overdue since 2019…huge red flad (since early 2020). Of course the liquidation is the biggest red flag. Now I’m (allegedly) leaning towards consignment pieces sold and owners unpaid, leading to criminal investigations.

[inadeje]

Originally Posted by Goupax

Why are they registered in Leeds when their business is in Newcastle upon Tyne?

Thats the liquidators address.

[RyanJ]

Hmmm Rolex announces a CPO program where they are allowing ADs to fleece customers for 3 yr old models. But hey, as your money gets stolen legally at least you will have a legit watch.

Then all of a sudden stories start to break on how the secondary market should not be trusted.

Coincidence or marketing at work here? Tinfoil hat time... I mean gee.. They even waited to release this big announcement until now... Great timing...

Course everything could be totally true as the world is a crazy place right now.. Also, consignment is not a new thing. It has been around for as long as I can remember in many different resale environments. Not saying it can't be used in a negative way just saying it is not a new thing.

Oh and as secondary market prices drop, Rolex ADs can put in orders and buy these watches even cheaper so they can mark them up even more and sell them CPO. Brilliant!

My post is mainly meant to be tongue in cheek. Please don't break out the pitch forks.

[rambo99]

Originally Posted by RyanJ

Hmmm Rolex announces a CPO program where they are allowing ADs to fleece customers for 3 yr old models. But hey, as your money gets stolen legally at least you will have a legit watch.

Then all of a sudden stories start to break on how the secondary market should not be trusted.

Coincidence or marketing at work here? Tinfoil hat time... I mean gee.. They even waited to release this big announcement until now... Great timing...

Course everything could be totally true as the world is a crazy place right now.. Also, consignment is not a new thing. It has been around for as long as I can remember in many different resale environments. Not saying it can't be used in a negative way just saying it is not a new thing.

Oh and as secondary market prices drop, Rolex ADs can put in orders and buy these watches even cheaper so they can mark them up even more and sell them CPO. Brilliant!

My post is mainly meant to be tongue in cheek. Please don't break out the pitch forks.

you mean rolex are distributing propaganda to destroy the grey dealers? do you have any evidence?

[RyanJ]

Originally Posted by rambo99

you mean rolex are distributing propaganda to destroy the grey dealers? do you have any evidence?

No which is why my post was mostly tongue in cheek which I stated at the end.

[rambo99]

look forward to watching watchtrader's next youtube video, see if they can explain the liquidation of their company. may be it's just normal business practice and no existing customers shall be affected.

[shammad10]

Originally Posted by RyanJ

Hmmm Rolex announces a CPO program where they are allowing ADs to fleece customers for 3 yr old models. But hey, as your money gets stolen legally at least you will have a legit watch.

Then all of a sudden stories start to break on how the secondary market should not be trusted.

Coincidence or marketing at work here? Tinfoil hat time... I mean gee.. They even waited to release this big announcement until now... Great timing...

Course everything could be totally true as the world is a crazy place right now.. Also, consignment is not a new thing. It has been around for as long as I can remember in many different resale environments. Not saying it can't be used in a negative way just saying it is not a new thing.

Oh and as secondary market prices drop, Rolex ADs can put in orders and buy these watches even cheaper so they can mark them up even more and sell them CPO. Brilliant!

My post is mainly meant to be tongue in cheek. Please don't break out the pitch forks.

Not sure the point you’re making?
You’re saying that Rolex and the National Crime Agency are in collusion in order to destroy grey dealers?
Why would a massive governmental law enforcement agency have anything to do with ‘marketing’?
You can say it’s tongue in cheek- but it’s just obviously wrong.

[JAGDJ41]

I would doubt this is tax fraud related as HMRC has its own criminal powers to deal with such things.

To me NCA suggests anti money laundering or, sale of stolen goods.

A few eps back on their channel, a lady sold them an Omega, No Time To Die I think. I can’t remember specifics but she had no box or paperwork and was claiming something which didn’t fit the facts.

They offered her a low price which she took and the whole thing smelled off. I remember a number of YouTube comments saying it was an odd thing to put out on the channel.


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[RyanJ]

Originally Posted by shammad10

Not sure the point you’re making?
You’re saying that Rolex and the National Crime Agency are in collusion in order to destroy grey dealers?
Why would a massive governmental law enforcement agency have anything to do with ‘marketing’?
You can say it’s tongue in cheek- but it’s just obviously wrong.

Goodness me.. I stand down... I should know better than to make posts teasing about Rolex on this forum.

[Mr Ben]

Originally Posted by rambo99

look forward to watching watchtrader's next youtube video, see if they can explain the liquidation of their company. may be it's just normal business practice and no existing customers shall be affected.

Why on earth would they feel the need to explain it now? It went into liquidation nearly three years ago… it will be interesting to see if they explain the National Crime Agency’s posts.

[djtheot]

They are still posting watches for sale on instagram.


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[watchgeezer]

Would be interesting to find out what really is going on here…

[gyang333]

Interesting how this basically went away quietly. Didn't see any of the usual Youtubers try to get in on the drama with this one.

[pajkospeti]

If you guys look at companies house, WatchtraderUK ltd was a company of Stuart M's who you often see in the vids. Typical "lad" type with constant smarmy look on his face. After that went into liquidation his brother Jack's limited company Timepiece trading limited carried on with the business. It was incorporated 2019 aug 1st, not long before watchtraderuk went under.
If you look at the current watchtader website, the about us section, you'll see Stuart is not there. Even though he's constantly in the videos. Obviously for a reason. I'm still surprised he decided to appear in the vids.
Jack has also previous conviction for buying a stolen land rover for 1k in his younger days.

There was a review on trustpilot calling them out on the two limited companies, to which Jack gave a pretty poor answer, and the review disappeared a while after.

[djtheot]

Has anyone dealt with them on this forum?


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[Chewbacca]

Any business with a made up royal-esque coat of arms or crest is a legitimate business.

Facts.

[Mr Ben]

Originally Posted by djtheot

Has anyone dealt with them on this forum?


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https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=810554

[Explorer2polar]

In todays papers.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ing-probe.html