Rolex Deepsea, Submarriner or GMT Master II

[RealMac]

I currently have an Omega Seamaster 2262.50.00 and I like the design of the watch but I want something bigger as my arms are slightly large.

I'm considering a Rolex and the Deepsea, Submariner and GMT Master II are the three that have caught my eye.

My preference is in the order above but my questions are:

1. What's the difference between the three? Deepsea looks bigger in depth, are all of them the same size inc s/s strap?

2. I'm based in the UK, are these models readily available or are there waiting times

3. Is it worth considering buying new or pre-owned?

thanks

[TimeToGo]

Welcome to the Forum!

If your arms are large, you may want to go with your #1 choice.

You have to go to an AD to try them out!

[dandan]

Yeah try them on mate. From my experience they are all available in the UK but you prob wont get much of a discount.

[The GMT Master]

1. The three watches each have quite unique personalities. The Sub C and GMT IIc share a very similar case, but there are some notable differences. The Sub has a slightly thicker caseback (and therefore sits a little higher on the wrist), has slightly thicker lugs (barely noticable), has a diving bezel (unidirectional, 120 clicks), a differently finished bracelet (brushed centre links) and a different clasp (Glidelock - allows about an inch worth of fine adjustment on the fly, very clever system). The GMT IIc has a multiple time zone feature (can display up to three time zones at the same time) by having an independant hour hand and bidirectional 24 hour bezel (with 24 clicks). The bracelet has polished centre links for a slightly dressier look, and had a locking sports clasp with Easylink (an extra half link that can be deployed). Both very, very good everyday watches, extremely comfortable, and not too heavy. Very balanced, and you can dress them up or down. They both have 40mm case diameters, the Sub has 300m water resistance, and the GMT has 100m water resistance.

The Deepsea is very much a different beast, much taller and wider as well (44mm case diameter). It's one of the most extreme diving watches money can buy, and beautifully over engineered. It has a domed crystal (a thing of beauty), automatic helium escape valve and a titanium case back, allowing it to be waterproof to 3900m. It has a slightly different variant of Glidelock with an additional diver's extension link, and operation from the outside of the clasp (as opposed to the inside). It's a very impressive watch, but I (although others manage okay) think it isn't an everyday kind of watch, especially if you wear suits. It uses the same movement found in the Submariner

2. I work for an AD, and in terms of availability, the Sub Date is the only one that's proving difficult to get right now. Very high demand for it, even with an excellent supply from Rolex. Deepseas and GMTs crop up pretty regularly on allocations, although if an AD has sold one, you may have to wait a few weeks to get hold of one.

3. You'll struggle to find many pre-owned Sub Cs on the market right now, although I would expect it would be a bit better with Deepseas and GMTs. If you buy new, you have the satisfaction of having your name on the guarantee card and being the first to wear it. Might work out being a bit more expensive, but if you build up a relationship with a good AD, they'll look after you well for any problems you may have. Although I am biased, I would recommend going to an independent jewellers over the big chains (Ernest Jones/Goldsmiths) - you tend to find the people with real in-depth knowledge there

Hope this helps!

[bayerische]

If you want someting bigger, then I suggest the Deep Sea!

[RealMac]

Originally Posted by The GMT Master

1. The three watches each have quite unique personalities. The Sub C and GMT IIc share a very similar case, but there are some notable differences. The Sub has a slightly thicker caseback (and therefore sits a little higher on the wrist), has slightly thicker lugs (barely noticable), has a diving bezel (unidirectional, 120 clicks), a differently finished bracelet (brushed centre links) and a different clasp (Glidelock - allows about an inch worth of fine adjustment on the fly, very clever system). The GMT IIc has a multiple time zone feature (can display up to three time zones at the same time) by having an independant hour hand and bidirectional 24 hour bezel (with 24 clicks). The bracelet has polished centre links for a slightly dressier look, and had a locking sports clasp with Easylink (an extra half link that can be deployed). Both very, very good everyday watches, extremely comfortable, and not too heavy. Very balanced, and you can dress them up or down. They both have 40mm case diameters, the Sub has 300m water resistance, and the GMT has 100m water resistance.

The Deepsea is very much a different beast, much taller and wider as well (44mm case diameter). It's one of the most extreme diving watches money can buy, and beautifully over engineered. It has a domed crystal (a thing of beauty), automatic helium escape valve and a titanium case back, allowing it to be waterproof to 3900m. It has a slightly different variant of Glidelock with an additional diver's extension link, and operation from the outside of the clasp (as opposed to the inside). It's a very impressive watch, but I (although others manage okay) think it isn't an everyday kind of watch, especially if you wear suits. It uses the same movement found in the Submariner

2. I work for an AD, and in terms of availability, the Sub Date is the only one that's proving difficult to get right now. Very high demand for it, even with an excellent supply from Rolex. Deepseas and GMTs crop up pretty regularly on allocations, although if an AD has sold one, you may have to wait a few weeks to get hold of one.

3. You'll struggle to find many pre-owned Sub Cs on the market right now, although I would expect it would be a bit better with Deepseas and GMTs. If you buy new, you have the satisfaction of having your name on the guarantee card and being the first to wear it. Might work out being a bit more expensive, but if you build up a relationship with a good AD, they'll look after you well for any problems you may have. Although I am biased, I would recommend going to an independent jewellers over the big chains (Ernest Jones/Goldsmiths) - you tend to find the people with real in-depth knowledge there

Hope this helps!

this is exactly what I was after! Just need to find a decent independent rolex dealer on the south coast. I only know of goldsmiths and Ernest jones

[Saxon007]

Your Omega is a mid-size, a tad over 36mm. Any of the watches you are looking at are quite a bit larger, the DSSD especially so. If the Omega is just a bit small the Sub or GMT should hit your sweet spot. Don't overlook the 14060M (no date) Sub either, its what I would consider a perfectly sized watch.

[rolexsweep]

GMT!!!! because

[Riseman Weather]

Get a Rolex GMT Master 2, because you can do more with that watch than the other two Rolex watches.

[threemonkeys]

I like the versatility of the GMT. It's quite easy to dress up or down. It seems like the polished center link has been a big issue, though, with many when considering GMT vs. Sub. I like it (bling), but it does stress me out a little with the little scratches.

[Wiley]

I was going back and forth between the Sub and the GMT IIc for years and finally bought myself a GMT IIc 2 weeks ago.
Every time I picked up a Sub it felt somehow to light for me. The GMT has solid links and the fit of this watch is amazing. I am very happy I bought it and it hasn't left my arm since then

[globalmedia33]

GMT

[aboen]

...DSSD...best Modern Rolex period
Gook luck on your decision.

[TimeToGo]

Originally Posted by RealMac

this is exactly what I was after! Just need to find a decent independent rolex dealer on the south coast. I only know of goldsmiths and Ernest jones

You may want to try a WTB in our For Sale section or contact some of our great sellers, they are also known for international transactions!

[DCgator]

Go Deepsea!

[14060Perfection]

I went to an AD when I was in Bangkok and tried on the 3 you mention. The GMT II C took the prize for me. The DSSD was way too clunky and big, but gorgeous! The Sub C I LOVED but I have the 14060M so the GMT II C I would have gone with. Believe me, pics on this site do none of the watches justice. To see them in person is to truly appreciate them. But all 3 watches are big, the DSSD being the biggest, so Id go to an AD if I were you and try them on and also see how truly stunning these watches are. When you wear a Rolex for awhile and then put back on your Omega, youll put the Rolex back on...

[dalip]

Originally Posted by The GMT Master

1. The three watches each have quite unique personalities. The Sub C and GMT IIc share a very similar case, but there are some notable differences. The Sub has a slightly thicker caseback (and therefore sits a little higher on the wrist), has slightly thicker lugs (barely noticable), has a diving bezel (unidirectional, 120 clicks), a differently finished bracelet (brushed centre links) and a different clasp (Glidelock - allows about an inch worth of fine adjustment on the fly, very clever system). The GMT IIc has a multiple time zone feature (can display up to three time zones at the same time) by having an independant hour hand and bidirectional 24 hour bezel (with 24 clicks). The bracelet has polished centre links for a slightly dressier look, and had a locking sports clasp with Easylink (an extra half link that can be deployed). Both very, very good everyday watches, extremely comfortable, and not too heavy. Very balanced, and you can dress them up or down. They both have 40mm case diameters, the Sub has 300m water resistance, and the GMT has 100m water resistance.

The Deepsea is very much a different beast, much taller and wider as well (44mm case diameter). It's one of the most extreme diving watches money can buy, and beautifully over engineered. It has a domed crystal (a thing of beauty), automatic helium escape valve and a titanium case back, allowing it to be waterproof to 3900m. It has a slightly different variant of Glidelock with an additional diver's extension link, and operation from the outside of the clasp (as opposed to the inside). It's a very impressive watch, but I (although others manage okay) think it isn't an everyday kind of watch, especially if you wear suits. It uses the same movement found in the Submariner

2. I work for an AD, and in terms of availability, the Sub Date is the only one that's proving difficult to get right now. Very high demand for it, even with an excellent supply from Rolex. Deepseas and GMTs crop up pretty regularly on allocations, although if an AD has sold one, you may have to wait a few weeks to get hold of one.

3. You'll struggle to find many pre-owned Sub Cs on the market right now, although I would expect it would be a bit better with Deepseas and GMTs. If you buy new, you have the satisfaction of having your name on the guarantee card and being the first to wear it. Might work out being a bit more expensive, but if you build up a relationship with a good AD, they'll look after you well for any problems you may have. Although I am biased, I would recommend going to an independent jewellers over the big chains (Ernest Jones/Goldsmiths) - you tend to find the people with real in-depth knowledge there

Hope this helps!

Absolutely superb feedback and advice Chris

@ the OP: I'd look at the trusted sellers here also....

[4 Ranges]

GMT Master, where does the DSSD stand from a sales perspective, compared to the GMT IIC and Sub C?

What has the feedback been, from your end, regarding all 3 watches? Lastly...have you noticed if there are certain characteristics of customers that purchase one over the others? For example, are DSSD customers younger? (i.e. fresh out of biz school). Is the DSSD their first Rolex? Are GMT IIC customers collectors? Or do they see the GMT IIC as their "one" Rolex?

I think that the "modern" Rolexes (GMT IIC, Sub C, DSSD, and Milgauss GV) have a potential to define the brand for an entirely new generation. Vintage models, IMHO, have their place with us Rolex lovers because they connect us to the coolness of a previous generation: Steve McQueen, Sean Connery, Paul Newman, Tom Selleck, etc. These newer, and dare I say, "in ya face" models have yet to place themselves in the pantheon of coolness of the previous models, if only because they haven't had the time to penetrate the mainstream the way the previous models have. So, I ask the above questions ultimately to gauge the potential place that these models will take in the next few years with its customers and the brand itself. Thanks!

[George Ab]

Originally Posted by The GMT Master

1. The three watches each have quite unique personalities. The Sub C and GMT IIc share a very similar case, but there are some notable differences. The Sub has a slightly thicker caseback (and therefore sits a little higher on the wrist), has slightly thicker lugs (barely noticable), has a diving bezel (unidirectional, 120 clicks), a differently finished bracelet (brushed centre links) and a different clasp (Glidelock - allows about an inch worth of fine adjustment on the fly, very clever system). The GMT IIc has a multiple time zone feature (can display up to three time zones at the same time) by having an independant hour hand and bidirectional 24 hour bezel (with 24 clicks). The bracelet has polished centre links for a slightly dressier look, and had a locking sports clasp with Easylink (an extra half link that can be deployed). Both very, very good everyday watches, extremely comfortable, and not too heavy. Very balanced, and you can dress them up or down. They both have 40mm case diameters, the Sub has 300m water resistance, and the GMT has 100m water resistance.

The Deepsea is very much a different beast, much taller and wider as well (44mm case diameter). It's one of the most extreme diving watches money can buy, and beautifully over engineered. It has a domed crystal (a thing of beauty), automatic helium escape valve and a titanium case back, allowing it to be waterproof to 3900m. It has a slightly different variant of Glidelock with an additional diver's extension link, and operation from the outside of the clasp (as opposed to the inside). It's a very impressive watch, but I (although others manage okay) think it isn't an everyday kind of watch, especially if you wear suits. It uses the same movement found in the Submariner

2. I work for an AD, and in terms of availability, the Sub Date is the only one that's proving difficult to get right now. Very high demand for it, even with an excellent supply from Rolex. Deepseas and GMTs crop up pretty regularly on allocations, although if an AD has sold one, you may have to wait a few weeks to get hold of one.

3. You'll struggle to find many pre-owned Sub Cs on the market right now, although I would expect it would be a bit better with Deepseas and GMTs. If you buy new, you have the satisfaction of having your name on the guarantee card and being the first to wear it. Might work out being a bit more expensive, but if you build up a relationship with a good AD, they'll look after you well for any problems you may have. Although I am biased, I would recommend going to an independent jewellers over the big chains (Ernest Jones/Goldsmiths) - you tend to find the people with real in-depth knowledge there

Hope this helps!

I nominate this for response of the week. Outstanding response Chris.

[George Ab]

Going from 36mm to 44mm is a big jump. If you are used to a mid-sized watch then a 40mm may make more sense. The Deepsea is quite high off of the wrist and at 200grams with the high center of gravity is something you won't wear long if you go for a spirited run.

[PHDX2]

Sub for me!

[pfg1]

You will find that the DSSD sits very high on the wrist and tends to snag your biz shirt and suitcoat. Also, you will accidentally bang and scratch the bezel on the DSSD more often due to its high profile. Of course, if you are a diver and only wear it underwater then none of this stuff matters.......

[Runnin' Rebel]

See sig

[dddrees]

Originally Posted by The GMT Master

1. The three watches each have quite unique personalities. The Sub C and GMT IIc share a very similar case, but there are some notable differences. The Sub has a slightly thicker caseback (and therefore sits a little higher on the wrist), has slightly thicker lugs (barely noticable), has a diving bezel (unidirectional, 120 clicks), a differently finished bracelet (brushed centre links) and a different clasp (Glidelock - allows about an inch worth of fine adjustment on the fly, very clever system). The GMT IIc has a multiple time zone feature (can display up to three time zones at the same time) by having an independant hour hand and bidirectional 24 hour bezel (with 24 clicks). The bracelet has polished centre links for a slightly dressier look, and had a locking sports clasp with Easylink (an extra half link that can be deployed). Both very, very good everyday watches, extremely comfortable, and not too heavy. Very balanced, and you can dress them up or down. They both have 40mm case diameters, the Sub has 300m water resistance, and the GMT has 100m water resistance.

The Deepsea is very much a different beast, much taller and wider as well (44mm case diameter). It's one of the most extreme diving watches money can buy, and beautifully over engineered. It has a domed crystal (a thing of beauty), automatic helium escape valve and a titanium case back, allowing it to be waterproof to 3900m. It has a slightly different variant of Glidelock with an additional diver's extension link, and operation from the outside of the clasp (as opposed to the inside). It's a very impressive watch, but I (although others manage okay) think it isn't an everyday kind of watch, especially if you wear suits. It uses the same movement found in the Submariner

2. I work for an AD, and in terms of availability, the Sub Date is the only one that's proving difficult to get right now. Very high demand for it, even with an excellent supply from Rolex. Deepseas and GMTs crop up pretty regularly on allocations, although if an AD has sold one, you may have to wait a few weeks to get hold of one.

3. You'll struggle to find many pre-owned Sub Cs on the market right now, although I would expect it would be a bit better with Deepseas and GMTs. If you buy new, you have the satisfaction of having your name on the guarantee card and being the first to wear it. Might work out being a bit more expensive, but if you build up a relationship with a good AD, they'll look after you well for any problems you may have. Although I am biased, I would recommend going to an independent jewellers over the big chains (Ernest Jones/Goldsmiths) - you tend to find the people with real in-depth knowledge there

Hope this helps!

This kind of feedback is what makes this forum so great.

Can't go wrong with either of the 3 really, but you just need to try them all on for size.

[The GMT Master]

Originally Posted by 4 Ranges

GMT Master, where does the DSSD stand from a sales perspective, compared to the GMT IIC and Sub C?

What has the feedback been, from your end, regarding all 3 watches? Lastly...have you noticed if there are certain characteristics of customers that purchase one over the others? For example, are DSSD customers younger? (i.e. fresh out of biz school). Is the DSSD their first Rolex? Are GMT IIC customers collectors? Or do they see the GMT IIC as their "one" Rolex?

I think that the "modern" Rolexes (GMT IIC, Sub C, DSSD, and Milgauss GV) have a potential to define the brand for an entirely new generation. Vintage models, IMHO, have their place with us Rolex lovers because they connect us to the coolness of a previous generation: Steve McQueen, Sean Connery, Paul Newman, Tom Selleck, etc. These newer, and dare I say, "in ya face" models have yet to place themselves in the pantheon of coolness of the previous models, if only because they haven't had the time to penetrate the mainstream the way the previous models have. So, I ask the above questions ultimately to gauge the potential place that these models will take in the next few years with its customers and the brand itself. Thanks!

Well, we probably sell 5 or 6 Deepseas a year compared to about 10 Subs and GMTs. It's a little bit more niche, but hardly a slow seller by any stretch of the imagination. Feedback has generally been very positive, people love the look, feel and finish of all of them - the Deepsea is probably the only one that gets negative remarks, and that's just because of its weight and size. People can't fault the engineering on it.

If anything, I've found that chaps in their 30s and 40s tend to go for the Deepsea, people who've owned Rolex in the past, maybe been led astray by brands like Breitling, and want something a bit more substantial. We seem to sell more Subs and GMTs to younger guys, oddly enough. The encouraging thing is that we get a real cross-section of people buying them, there's definitely a universal appeal there. I think, however, we have been getting a lot more interest in the watches with a younger demographic since the redesigns. I would completely agree with you about the new models defining the next generation of Rolexes, it's a very bold design move that really seems to be paying off. Rolex have stepped slightly out of their comfort zone and have been rewarded by creating some real excitement

[SC11]

Originally Posted by RealMac

this is exactly what I was after! Just need to find a decent independent rolex dealer on the south coast. I only know of goldsmiths and Ernest jones

If Chris (The GMT Master) place of work have all three instock I would say pop up and see him, it's going to be a 3 hour drive but well worth it.

I did :-)

Sam

[BH13GMT]

Originally Posted by RealMac

this is exactly what I was after! Just need to find a decent independent rolex dealer on the south coast. I only know of goldsmiths and Ernest jones

Charles Fox in Bournemouth are very good, also watches of distinction in Lymington have a big inventory on Sports models

[brettpaul]

IMO DSSD - if you've got bigger wrists and like the look of a big watch, then this is probably the way to go....the GMT IIc and Sub are VERY similar watches (really PCL and the 24-hour arrow on the GMT).....plus you don't see the DSSD in the wild too much and I like the idea of wearing a watch you CAN'T just walk in and buy almost any day of the week at an AD.

Also, for me, the DSSD is just an engineering marvel - from the depth rating to the glidelock clasp....a true work of art, while the GMT II and Sub are just larger versions of the previous models (ceramic bezels and blue parachrom hairsprings excluded).

Definitely try both on and let us know which way you go with a posted pic!

[Speed]

Originally Posted by The GMT Master

Hope this helps!

Chris, Rolex should hire you to trot round the globe and TRAIN SALES PEOPLE. Good lord man. I truly wonder if Rolex could be even more successful by breeding talented, knowledgeable blokes such as yourself?

Well, I suppose the answer is no as there seems to be such little effort in the AD world.

You are such an asset to this forum Chris!

You have also made me want a GMT IIC even more. Darn you!

[dicin]

Deep Sea for a larger watch.