Any Ideas on authenticating a Rolex??

[Wisher]

Cruious to know if an authentication paper instead of the Rolex Guarantee with serial number would be worth anything as far as "genuine papers" are concerned when it came to selling a watch?
If not, then, is the authentication only for one's own peace of mind?

[ohlins]

i think it's the next best thing if the original warranty cert is lost.....

[timebroker]

Originally Posted by mike

If I may add one more thing to the mix here. In dealing with vintage pieces, I think it's important to understand a particular watch may be judged authentic and still NOT be original. By that I mean service replacement parts will certainly be real Rolex parts but, depending on reference, rarity, etc.... can have a major impact on the value of the piece.
Not something that's a big problem with contemporary references,but for certain older watches can really affect the value.
Knowledge and study in this arena are the major weapons.

So start teaching Mike!
I for one could read all day about this sorta things.

[mike]

Originally Posted by Wisher

Cruious to know if an authentication paper instead of the Rolex Guarantee with serial number would be worth anything as far as "genuine papers" are concerned when it came to selling a watch?
If not, then, is the authentication only for one's own peace of mind?

Hey Wisher,

I don't know how RSCs in other parts of the world operate, but in the U.S. RSCs do not issue authentication papers. What you will get is a service estimate which indicates your watch is real as Rolex won't work on anything else.
Should you refuse the service you may be charged a fee ( I thought this was 60 or 70 dollars but I'm not sure). In any event you will have some assurance the piece is genuine.

As sheldon indicated if you walk in you may not even get that.

[maverick]

Originally Posted by sheldonsmith

I purchased gray a Z series sub. I took the watch, complete with the stickers still on the side to Beverly RSC. Apparently the do not "authenticate" watches. What the counter lady did recommend was to get an estimate for a watch overhaul and to determine of the watch required one.

The verification took about 20 minutes. She brought the watch out, indicated that it was genuine, and I declined the watch overhaul. The only problem is that you get no paperwork this way, but it is no charge. I knew they opened the watch as the caseback had the telltale scratches of the springbars being removed.

I did have a Sub 14060 "pressure tested" as I purchased it used. This cost $60, and I was able to have paperwork. Knowing that Rolex only works on genuine pieces, this was another method for authentication.

Good luck,

-Sheldon

BTW, love the clear caseback.... and it pressure tested okay?

In the USA Rolex will NOT authenticate a watch at least any rare or expensive ones. Also, depending on how old, they will not service any more. =) maverick

[maverick]

Originally Posted by Alcan

John, it doesn't get any more cool than that!

Very nice, don't see many COMEX Subs. =) maverick

[mike]

Originally Posted by maverick

In the USA Rolex will NOT authenticate a watch at least any rare or expensive ones. Also, depending on how old, they will not service any more. =) maverick

Spot on Mav! Nor will they service "exotic" dials.

[maverick]

Originally Posted by mike

Hey Wisher,

I don't know how RSCs in other parts of the world operate, but in the U.S. RSCs do not issue authentication papers. What you will get is a service estimate which indicates your watch is real as Rolex won't work on anything else.
Should you refuse the service you may be charged a fee ( I thought this was 60 or 70 dollars but I'm not sure). In any event you will have some assurance the piece is genuine.

As sheldon indicated if you walk in you may not even get that.

Hi Mike, I tried that with my 1680 but it did not work. They just sent it back w/o any real proof of anything. Paperwork stated. "Not Serviced".

They are too afraid of messing up a dial which they cannot replace. =) maverick
BTW, they might be more accommodating with other models.

[mike]

Originally Posted by maverick

Hi Mike, I tried that with my 1680 but it did not work. They just sent it back w/o any real proof of anything. Paperwork stated. "Not Serviced".

They are too afraid of messing up a dial which they cannot replace. =) maverick
BTW, they might be more accommodating with other models.

I remember that Mav. I had a 1680 white serviced by NY and a week later was told on my RED "We don't do those anymore" Dallas took it in, but that was before the crackdown. RUSA is just amazing.

[Alcan]

Originally Posted by sheldonsmith

BTW, love the clear caseback.... and it pressure tested okay?

Yep.

[mike]

Originally Posted by timebroker

So start teaching Mike!
I for one could read all day about this sorta things.

Filip,

Here's an example of two authentic 1680s. One has it's original tritium dial and hands,



While this one has a service replacement luminova dial and hands,



Both watches carry full RSC service paperwork, but to a collector the orginal trit. dial is worth much more.

While many take a contemporary watch to an AD or trained watchmaker for "verification" it's important to remember not all ADs are well versed in vintage pieces.--That is NOT a derogatory comment on ADs!!-- simply their thrust is in the selling and dealing with modern watches.

Buying vintage is a bit more involved. Time and research are necessary tools in the understanding of the variations of vintage pieces. Stories abound on the net of buyers taking vintage pieces here and there for verification and after being told their watches were "real" find out later that yes the watch has all Rolex parts, but the wrong parts for the period.

If I recall this happened to a member of this forum a while back. I believe he bought what was thought to be a RED 1680 only to find out the dial was a real Rolex dial but did not belong in the watch due to the serial number being to high. Dial and parts swapping sadly is a fact we in the vintage community must be on guard for.

When "on the hunt" I try to do as much research as I possibly can on the targeted reference. Here is where the collective wisdom of the experts in the vintage arena is IMHO more valuable than an AD telling me I have a real movement.

Here's another small example. Look closely at the white 1680s in this photo,



Both are my watches. I purchased the one on the left knowing there was a slight issue, but one easily fixed. (And since has been through an RSC service)

Hint: Look closely at the bezel insert pearl. Yep! it's got a metal ring! Incorrect for the 1680 (and for that matter any diver before the debut of the reference 16800).

Easily fixed, but not correct for the reference though everything else was perfect on the watch, and to be fair the seller,a fine gentleman, told me as much--full discolsure.

I certainly don't mean to scare off anyone from the wonderfull satisfaction a fine vintage piece brings, in fact understanding and owning a fine vintage piece IMO gives one a wonderfull understanding of the great history Rolex has.

[timebroker]

This is what I am talking about
So many replacements which are not epoque.
Think I have an Omega movements explanation like this somewhere, I will look for it, get back to ye soon.
Thx

[timebroker]

Because the online file is a pdf and some people maybe cannot open it, I converted it to smaller size jpegs.
If anybody want the original in better quality ...
http://users.tpg.com.au/mondodec/Colourvariations.pdf
For the website (more information on for instance recognizing repainted dials) ... http://omega-constellation-collectors.blogspot.com/
Examples are Omega Constellations. Hope somebody can do something with it.

[mike]

Wonderfull information Filip!!

Indeed the information on refinished dials is fantastic! Thanks for posting such a great resource!