PLEASE Help new to Rolexworld Just bought New GMT II"M"first addition new Movement.

[jtrader]

I just bought a new GMT II M series as an investment. I am brand new to the rolex world and have always loved the watches. But just haven't been able to purchase one until late. I originally went into the AD interested in either a Bond Seamaster or the Submariner.

But as soon as I said that I was interested in an investment/collectors item, she recommended that I would be better of spending a little more on a Rolex. Since they gain a lot more in value each year.

Anyways she took me over to the rolex case and sold me on what she called a "rare limited edition would be collectors item". Witch was a Coca Cola GMT II "M" (M349983) Series. She explained that this watch was apart of a collection that was originally made by rolex in the late 90's and was not released until this year. In addition this watch was a first addition of the Coca Cola GMT and has the new non stick movement. She also showed me how they test to see if the movement was actually new or not. Now anyone reading this might think that maybe this is a watch from the 90's used with a new movement put in it. But that's not the case. This Rolex was brand new and it had the bar code on the side that Rolex now puts on these watches strait from the factory.

So my question is, has Anyone out there heard of this? And is it possible that in my journey to buy an excellent timepiece stumbled across a true rare Jem. Or does this person really not know what she's talking about?
Because honestly I can't find any information about a first addition rolex from the 90's just now being released with the new M 2008 movement.

So PLEAZE, if anyone has any info or can possibly lead me in the right direction I would so Appreciate it!!!!

[jtrader]

I just bought a new GMT II M series as an investment. I am brand new to the rolex world and have always loved the watches. But just haven't been able to purchase one until late. I originally went into the AD interested in either a Bond Seamaster or the Submariner.

But as soon as I said that I was interested in an investment/collectors item, she recommended that I would be better of spending a little more on a Rolex. Since they gain a lot more in value each year.

Anyways she took me over to the rolex case and sold me on what she called a "rare limited edition would be collectors item". Witch was a Coca Cola GMT II "M" (M349983) Series. She explained that this watch was apart of a collection that was originally made by rolex in the late 90's and was not released until this year. In addition this watch was a first addition of the Coca Cola GMT and has the new non stick movement. She also showed me how they test to see if the movement was actually new or not. Now anyone reading this might think that maybe this is a watch from the 90's used with a new movement put in it. But that's not the case. This Rolex was brand new and it had the bar code on the side that Rolex now puts on these watches strait from the factory.

So my question is, has Anyone out there heard of this? And is it possible that in my journey to buy an excellent timepiece stumbled across a true rare Jem. Or does this person really not know what she's talking about?
Because honestly I can't find any information about a first addition rolex from the 90's just now being released with the new M 2008 movement.

So PLEAZE, if anyone has any info or can possibly lead me in the right direction I would so Appreciate it!!!!

[scottschoe]

Bit of a convoluted post, but yes, your 16710 probably has the new 3186 inside. Not rare at the moment, but in the future it could rise in value. Do you plan on wearing it?

[jtrader]

only on occasions. I'm sorry i am a little new to this stuff. what do you mean by
16710 | 1655 | 16523 | 14060M?

[scottschoe]

Originally Posted by jtrader

only on occasions. I'm sorry i am a little new to this stuff. what do you mean by
16710 | 1655 | 16523 | 14060M?

That's my signature - reference numbers of models that I own. 16710 = GMT II

Post up some scans of your new watch!

[jtrader]

Ok I see.
Actually the watch is on lay away. I was only able to pay for half of it up front being that my bank will only allow me to draw up to 3,000.00 in a day. I was actually going in tomorrow to put the rest of the money down on the watch. But now I'm kinda not sure if I wanna go with the GMT. I really like the SUBM, the SEAD and there's also a 50th anniversary that I saw today at the mall.

Out of all the ones you witch do you prefer the most.

[jtrader]

will do,

I'm actually thinking about returning it now and going with a SUBDATE, SEADWELLER, or the 50th anniversary.

out of all the ones you own witch do you like?

[jtrader]

so when you say 16710, is that just the version of the watch or is it the type of watch made in a certain time period?

[Thani]

its the refrence number of the model

like 116520 = SS daytona

116200 = SS Datejust

[jtrader]

Ok so I'm trying to understand this going back to what I was asking earlier. Is this lady, the one who sold me the watch really know what she's talking about and telling me the truth about the GMT II being a late 90's model with the new 3186 movement. Or do you think she just told me what I wanted to hear in order to sell me on the watch?

[Thani]

i dont know what your case is, but if your model is an M series GMT then most likely it does have the 3186 movt. and the model of your watch has been discontinued aswell

and i did forget to add when i was giving examples of ref numbers that earlier models had shorter number for example the SS daytona today is 1165200 but in the past it was a 16520

[jtrader]

AH I see,

Well the model number on the green tag attached to the watch says it's an M349983. Witch it also says that on the receipt that i got when I bought the watch.

So what do you think? Should I stay with the GMT given that it may be rare and sought after in the future? Or should I go with Sub mariner or dweller that I tend to favor a little more?

[2careless]

The big number on the green tag says Mxxxxxx, there should be another number there saying 16710 or some other 5 digit code.
If not, your warranty card should say something like:
Style # 16710B
Serial # Mxxxxxx
Bracelet # 78790
Dial- Black Index
etc

[superdelsol]

It seems as though the salesperson is not explaining the watch correctly. The 16710 GMT Master II with either black bezel, red/black "coke" bezel, or red/blue "Pepsi" bezel was manufactured from 1989-2007. Some of the last models made have a newer caliber movement, as used in the 116710 GMT Master II. The legacy movement for the 16710 is 3185, and the new movement in the 116710 is a 3186. The "M" serial number indicates that the watch was manufactured in 2007, not in the 90's as the salesperson stated. There has been much discussion and speculation as to the future value of 16710's with the 3186 movement, but like many things it depends on what the future holds. In the 60's and 70's no one could have predicted that Rolex Daytona models in stainless steel were going to be highly sought after, and worth more than other models in gold. I wouldn't consider a watch as an investment. Certainly the Rolex brand holds more of it's original value than other watches or material possessions, and isn't likely to plummet in value the way some investments do. That being said, there are certainly people who buy and sell watches, and make money doing it. Buy the watch that you want to wear, and enjoy it. Although I am probably biased as a 16710 owner, I think that 16710 with "Coke" bezel is one of the best looking, most versatile watches Rolex has ever made. I was in the store last week, and the sub no date was looking good, but I essentially have that look and much more in the GMT Master II. The bezel can always be swapped if you tire of the original color. I would keep the GMT Master II, it's a classic.

Here is a link to GMT Master history:

http://gmtmasterhistory.com/gmt-master_ref_16710.html

[jtrader]

Yes thank you, this is a very big help.

Don't get me wrong I like both the GMT an the submariner I've just always loved that classic bond look. So with buying a new watch like this is a dream come true for me I just like the fact that the watch she sold me on has the potential to have a high re-sale value in the future.

And it's kinda funny that when I was in the store looking at these watches I kinda kept going to the more expensive sea dweller and she kept telling me that the less expensive GMT was a better buy in the long run.

[patsee]

One of the things you should take into consideration regarding the story you were told is how much you paid for this watch. The recommended retail price by Rolex for the "old style" GMT #16710 is $5750. Some of the "M" series GMTs containing the 3186 movement have been advertised by speculators for prices as high as $6650 on EBAY. However I don't know if they sold for that price. One poster on The Timezone Modern Rolex forum (WCHIANG) stated that in Japan these watches fetch $7,000 to $9,000 dollars. According to various posts I have read on the Rolex Forum and Timezone Rolex Forum the 3186 movement is only found in late Z series and M series of the GMT#16710 prior to it's introduction in the updated GMT #11670 and Rolex M series Explorer II. As for their future value once the novelty aspect wears off, I don't think that can be predicted.

[jdc]

Superdelsol has given an excellent response to your question

I would echo buy the watch you like, watches as an investment can be really difficult to predict and you probably would have to wait a long time to see any real return.
The seadweller is also being discounted.

Love the watch for what it is and not the value!

[Trurolexer]

WELCOME TO TRF, Man!!! Hope you enjoy your stay here!!!
And Congrats for your new Coke 16710 M serial. NICE CHOICE!!!

[mike]

Originally Posted by jtrader

Ok so I'm trying to understand this going back to what I was asking earlier. Is this lady, the one who sold me the watch really know what she's talking about and telling me the truth about the GMT II being a late 90's model with the new 3186 movement. Or do you think she just told me what I wanted to hear in order to sell me on the watch?

With the greatest respect...that's just plain false. There were no "special" GMTs from the 90s with the 3186 movement...and I bet your salesperson knows it.

Certainly late models 16710s do have the 3186 movement, but an example from the 90s will be equipped with the 3185.

As to future investment....certain references have indeed proven to be excellent in this regard, however the 16710 is way to new to make any predictions (and to be honest they don't go up in value every year). There have been a boat load of 16710s made since it's introduction.

Rather buy the watch for what it is---a strong reliable piece with versatility like no other. Wear it and enjoy it.

[DSJ]

Bump.

I'm not a GMT expert, but there is strong evidence to show that late 16710's had the 5186 movement, which has the parachrom spring. Can anyone else help out our new friend?

[Tools]

I'll agree with Mike.

If you already feel that you may want to get the Submariner because you prefer the "Bond look", then you might be disappointed with your GMT purchase..

Both the GMT and the Sub have rich histories that date back to their introduction in the mid 1950's, and both are collected throughout the world. I expect both to continue to be collected for many decades. This will keep the potential value staable for either watch..

Get the one you want to wear...

[ZROLEX]

Interestingly how old GMT II could have serial M349983 and new GMT IIC is M161XXX? So it means new GMTC is older than that GMTII you were offered? Just curious

[jtrader]

Yes well I guess it's possible. I'm still new at all this so I'm sure your probably right.

[Tools]

Originally Posted by ZROLEX

Interestingly how old GMT II could have serial M349983 and new GMT IIC is M161XXX? So it means new GMTC is older than that GMTII you were offered? Just curious

For several years now, numbers are generated (or built) randomly at production.

There is no relationship with the number sequence and it's assembly sequence.

For that matter, they are probably still producing "Z" models in conjunction with "M" models for some references as each letter seems to have about a 2 year run....

[Magik]

I agree with just about everything that was written here. That specific M series watch did not come out of the '90s. If anything it is probably a mid 2007-2008 vintage.

On another note, I believe the stick (ll) dial GMT-ll are more rare than the roman numeral (II) dial GMT-II when it comes to the late Z and M series GMT watches.

[GoldenBear]

Sounds like she is over-selling the whole thing. The Coke and Pepsi have been discontinued but you can still find them. Most people don't think the II vs. the ll will make any $$$ difference in the long run. The old SD will be discontinued, so that could become tough to find, if that floats your boat. A Rolex will hold it's value or appreciate but it isn't (or shouldn't be) considered an "investment". They are all great watches and will bring you lots of enjoyment. Find the one YOU like and get it. Forget all the other stuff.

[sheldonsmith]

I have been keeping a compendium of 3186 info ant the 16710 GMT's at http://www.minus4plus6.com/paracromblu16710.htm

-Sheldon

[Mandrake]

Originally Posted by sheldonsmith

I have been keeping a compendium of 3186 info ant the 16710 GMT's at http://www.minus4plus6.com/paracromblu16710.htm

-Sheldon

Hi Sheldon, I can see one picture of my watch there, is that one where the blue hairspring can be seen, but not the movement number ("This picture from another source shows the Paracrome hairspring, but look closely, the baseplate appears to show 3185.")

No problem at all, just to let you know, you are doing a great job putting together all the info.

Regards
Carlos

[pwrslider]

Originally Posted by GoldenBear

A Rolex will hold it's value or appreciate but it isn't (or shouldn't be) considered an "investment". They are all great watches and will bring you lots of enjoyment. Find the one YOU like and get it. Forget all the other stuff.

This is the best advice!!! Sounds like the salesperson was trying to tell you that it LOOKS like the 90's model..but with the newer movement. The M series would put your watch in the 2007-2008 range.

Get the watch you want. The only investment you should be concerned about is how the watch will look on your wrist...and how much you'll enjoy it in the years to come.

It's kind of like buying your wife a wedding ring with a flawless diamond....the sales people talk about investment and future value. Like....it's ever going to be re-sold??

[jasper]

I'm a GMT guy so I am biased....but I'd go for a GMT II with the 3186 movement. I think it will be collectable, but not for quite a few years. In the meantime though, I'd wear the watch carfully and keep the box and all the paperwork in mint condition. I think this watch has a real rarity to it, and an interesting story, which will make it valuable in the future.

If you prefer the Bond look, then replace the coke bezel insert with a black one....or rather get an additional black bezel insert and put the coke bezel away with the B&P.

That all said, if you can find an old style SD brand new, and if you prefer that, then I think you'll do as wel from a collectbility point of view.

The point is..if you're buying for investment:

1) Don't overpay now.
2) Keep the box and papers safe and in good condition.
3) Wear it carefully.
4) Take a long view.