Production vs. Manufacturing Date Charts

[Dmatley]

Does anyone know the difference between these two charts for dating a Rolex?

This website shows both charts and there seems to be a 5-6 year difference when looking up the serial number.

I trying to date a 1005 with serial number 142XXXX. Depending on which chart you use, the watch is a vintage 1960 or 1966 date.

I am assuming the earlier date is the case production and the later date is the manufacturing of the complete watch. The watch was listed by a very reputable dealer as 1961.

Which of the charts is standard for dating a vintage watch for sale?

[springer]

The dating charts are all over the place as you have found out. I have no idea what criteria was used in compiling many of these charts but they are confusing.

For the 1972 and older watches, I date them by the case back date.

Based on a chart that I have put together from actual watches, a 1.42XXXX Rolex would be circa late 1965 to 1966. (It definitely is not 1960.)

[Tools]

Originally Posted by Dmatley

. . .
I am assuming the earlier date is the case production and the later date is the manufacturing of the complete watch. The watch was listed by a very reputable dealer as 1961.

Which of the charts is standard for dating a vintage watch for sale?

No, you cannot make this assumption.

Internet charts are not made up of Rolex production data. They are enthusiasts who have compiled purchase dates with known numbers, and use the 1955 through 1972 case back stamps to compile a database.

Nobody actually knows what the caseback stamps indicate, either production or last minute warehousing data.

So, charts will only get you to within a couple of years on either side of a target date.

[cswjames]

Hi, I have an oysterdate which is 162xxxx and which I have always understood is 1968 or thereabout. I can't post photos yet but I have a photo of a 172xxxx that was definitely sold in 1969. Rolex seem to have been producing about a hundred thousand watches a year at that time which would place your serial, rather neatly, at about 1966.

I know this is all very anecdotal (and the chaps who point out there is no way to know for sure are right) but I would wager your serial is much closer to 1966 rather than 60.

[offrdmania]

Originally Posted by cswjames

Hi, I have an oysterdate which is 162xxxx and which I have always understood is 1968 or thereabout. I can't post photos yet but I have a photo of a 172xxxx that was definitely sold in 1969. Rolex seem to have been producing about a million watches a year at that time which would place your serial, rather neatly, at about 1966.

I know this is all very anecdotal (and the chaps who point out there is no way to know for sure are right) but I would wager your serial is much closer to 1966 rather than 60.

You cant use sale dates for this info since watches that sit on the shelf, sometimes for years will distort the list greatly.

[Swaye]

I recently purchased a Kermit and took it to my AD for them to take the bracelet off and make sure the numbers matched the papers. It is a very early F09XXXX serial, that was sold on Feb 7, 2004. I of course wondered if it was made in late 2003 and sold a couple months later by the time it made it to the States and made it to a display case, or if it was a super early 2004 manufacture and just made it to a case quickly and was sold immediately.

So anyway, my AD is a nice fella and he writes the number down, goes to the safe room in the back and comes out and tells me "my serial book in back says this is a 2003 watch." He was definitive, but I didn't press, because I guess it wasn't that big of a deal to me, just an interesting tidbit I had wondered.

It did make me wonder after I left if AD's (this one has been with Rolex since 1947) get books or manuals or something that actually show production dates much more closely than our internet resources. I assumed not, as surely these lists would have leaked onto the net by now, but he seemed 100% sure that he could date that watches production based on a serial book?

Just interesting to me.

[cswjames]

Originally Posted by Swaye

I recently purchased a Kermit and took it to my AD for them to take the bracelet off and make sure the numbers matched the papers. It is a very early F09XXXX serial, that was sold on Feb 7, 2004. I of course wondered if it was made in late 2003 and sold a couple months later by the time it made it to the States and made it to a display case, or if it was a super early 2004 manufacture and just made it to a case quickly and was sold immediately.

So anyway, my AD is a nice fella and he writes the number down, goes to the safe room in the back and comes out and tells me "my serial book in back says this is a 2003 watch." He was definitive, but I didn't press, because I guess it wasn't that big of a deal to me, just an interesting tidbit I had wondered.

It did make me wonder after I left if AD's (this one has been with Rolex since 1947) get books or manuals or something that actually show production dates much more closely than our internet resources. I assumed not, as surely these lists would have leaked onto the net by now, but he seemed 100% sure that he could date that watches production based on a serial book?

Just interesting to me.

Interesting to me too, thanks for sharing. I could see how a book would be practical up to when they changed to random serials (around 2010?). It wouldn't work thereafter and I guess that's why Rolex did it!😂

[Dmatley]

Thanks for the responses. I am still curious why the website on the link I posted shows two very different serial number dating charts. Most websites post one or the other. Just wondering what the difference is between the two.

Taking in this week for service and am curious what date is stamped on the inside of the case back...if there is a date stamped there. Why the jeweler identified this as a 1961 vintage is beyond me.

[Old Expat Beast]

The first chart is just wrong on the earlier dates (to 1960s), and has been misleading visitors to this forum for years.

[Dmatley]

Thanks for all of the replies. I spoke with the AD today and they stood by their claim that it was a vintage 1961 and that they use their own in house chart compiled over many years of buying and selling vintage Rolex.

So, I took it to a local watch master today and they were kind enough to open the case for me for a small fee. Turns out the case back is clearly stamped "III 66" with a 1570 mechanism. I forwarded the picture back to the AD and have yet to hear back.

The watch was purchased as a birth year watch so it will be going back. I guess it just proves Reagan's old line in negotiating with Gorbachev, "Trust, but verify."

[cswjames]

I didn't realise that you were hoping it was 1961 so I'm sorry that it didn't work out. But, if nothing else, you have contributed to our collective knowledge of mid 60's oyster serials! Hope the return goes well.

[Andad]

This is why Rolex have moved to random ID’s.

One less issue for us to worry about?