1969 OP 1002 Bracelet help.

[qwackerz]

Hello forum,
Iv not posted for years so had to re-register.

Iv just purchased a amazingly good condition 1969 production period OP 1002,

I wanted a 1969 as its my birth year and the watch is exactly the combination i wanted,

Stainless Oyster Perpetual,
Polished bezel,
Non Date,
Silver baton dial,

Just a pure clean elegant Oyster.

The only issue is that it came on a 1981 78350-19mm with 557 end pieces.

Yer it looks good but it not a good fit at the lugs and its the wrong date.

Iv done some research and found that the correct bracelet for 1969 would of been a folded or riveted type ?

I prefer the riveted,

So my question is,
What model number of bracelet and end peices should i be looking to be correct for my 1969 1002 OP?

Here she is nice body,
Shame about the legs.

[TimeToGo]

.
Welcome to the forum!

The issue with the fit could be the bracelet or the case, FYI.

USA C&I Rivet end links have no ref numbers.

7205 could have 57 / 60 ?

Just post here what you are looking at.

[Dan S]

If you are accustomed to modern bracelets, you may need to adjust your expectations (as well as the endlinks). A correct rivet bracelet may not necessarily have a better fit at the lugs.

BTW, the dial and hands do not appear to be from 1969, if it matters to you. IMO, they are service replacements, probably from the late 80s or 90s.

[qwackerz]

Riveted Bracelet wise, it could be a 7205 or 6635?

End link wise, it' could be a 57 or 60?

I can obtain them both in a 1969 date

Id just like to know which one would of been period correctly fitted to my watch at the time.

Thankyou.

[qwackerz]

Originally Posted by Dan S

If you are accustomed to modern bracelets, you may need to adjust your expectations (as well as the endlinks). A correct rivet bracelet may not necessarily have a better fit at the lugs.

BTW, the dial and hands do not appear to be from 1969, if it matters to you. IMO, they are service replacements, probably from the late 80s or 90s.

I can only really go on the serial number on the case that is within the 1969 production period and the case back inside has 69 stamped.

Iv also for reference looked up 1969 O.P.s images and found most have the dials and hands as mine.

[CarlOver]

I now see where the inspirstion came for the current silver dial OP. Very nice and quite timeless.

[Dan S]

Originally Posted by qwackerz

I can only really go on the serial number on the case that is within the 1969 production period and the case back inside has 69 stamped.

Iv also for reference looked up 1969 O.P.s images and found most have the dials and hands as mine.

I don't think you would see T SWISS MADE T in 1969. Not until the mid-1980s, IIRC. In the era of your watch, it would have been T SWISS T. The bright white lume is another giveaway. Service dial and hands, IMO. It's a matter of details.

Not a big deal, though, I don't think it affects the value significantly, and it shouldn't affect your enjoyment of the watch.

[qwackerz]

Originally Posted by Dan S

I don't think you would see T SWISS MADE T in 1969. Not until the mid-1980s, IIRC. In the era of your watch, it would have been T SWISS T. The bright white lume is another giveaway. Service dial and hands, IMO. It's a matter of details.

Not a big deal, though, I don't think it affects the value significantly, and it shouldn't affect your enjoyment of the watch.

I have the watch on 14 days approval so i can return it,
The lume is not lumimg anymore which leads me to think the dial being old,

It does hove the slimmer older style markers i feel, not the chunkier lume filled bat-tons as more current dials.

The hands look more current, however iv seen them on many 1969 O.P. photos.

The photos are what the seller did so are brightly lit.

I simply wanted a 1969 period correct O.P. in the configuration and hopefully good condition, i feel i found it, however with the forum member expertise i can now see where things are questionable.

To me its a stunning piece, but its possibly now just the case, movement and case back that are 1969, i know the bracelet is 1981 which i want to change to a 1969 riveted with correct end links, hence the reason for this thread.

Therefore, it will effect my enjoyment as if the dial and hands are Service replacements, there not original to the watch or the era, and its the face that you look at the most so id not know if im looking back at 1969 or 80s or 90s

There is no box or papers either, i think that quite common for vintage pieces.

Thankyou all.

[qwackerz]

How would i be able to tell if the dial and hands are service replacements?

Would there be a "S" marking somewhere?

Also, can i get the movement serial number production date checked to see if that is 1969??

Theres a shop near me that deals in pre owned Rolex, i was going to take the watch to him for a polish n buff and ask him about the bracelet to see if he could obtain one.

Now I'm not sure what to do.

[rootbeer7]

Originally Posted by qwackerz

How would i be able to tell if the dial and hands are service replacements?

Would there be a "S" marking somewhere?

Also, can i get the movement serial number production date checked to see if that is 1969??

Theres a shop near me that deals in pre owned Rolex, i was going to take the watch to him for a polish n buff and ask him about the bracelet to see if he could obtain one.

Now I'm not sure what to do.

Original dial would be marked t swiss t and hands would more than likely show aging or darkened lume.

[qwackerz]

Originally Posted by rootbeer7

Original dial would be marked t swiss t and hands would more than likely show aging or darkened lume.

Yes i agree,
i just thought it was a really good original condition O.P., it didn't occur to me they could be service replacements.

He also has a 1969 D.J.,
i do prefer the purity of the O.P. however with the forums assistance you've helped me to see that its not as original era correct as i first thought.

[qwackerz]

For reference.
He also has a 1969 D.J. 1603
I see the differences now as this has T SWISS T, aged hands, darkened lume,
Also a (Rolled) bracelet 6251H
End pieces 55.

[Dan S]

You can certainly find an original 1969-ish ref 1002 that is in much better condition than that 1603. That one is badly damaged. You don't have to settle for that. The lume will usually have darkened a little, but it can still be clean and yellow if it has not been exposed to moisture. You will see plenty of these silver dials from the 60s and 70s that are in good condition.

[perry911113]

The correct Oyster Bracelet for 1969 model year would be a rolled steel 7835.
However could it be possible that you could get the previous style 7205 rivet bracelet??
I believe it was 1967-68 whereby the change from 7205 to 7835.

[qwackerz]

"Forger the 1969 D.J.",
I just showed that for comparison of original patina dial,hands compared to my service from the same dealer.

After doing some more research and with the knowledge of the forum i conclude that.

The movement, case, crown and case back are all production period 1969 based upon stampings and serial numbers.

The dial, hands, bracelet (Stamped VF = 1981) are service parts.

The acrylic crystal is flawless so is most likely service also.

All this makes sense if the watch had had front damage.

Therefore,
The soul, spirit and essence are all 1969 with a few 80s - 90s era appropriate service parts.

Im content with that as i was born in 1969 and my influential eras were the 80s - 90s, as they still are to this day.

Iv also discovered from an original era correct O.P. that a dial option was a grey/silver sun ray (Sigma)? which had solid white gold markers.

Mine looks the same,
I can only assume at the service the damaged parts (Dial, hands) were swapped for like for like as close to era correct.

So on reflection
I feel mine maintains the clean,crisp and pureness of an Oyster.
And thats a good ballace.

Here a pic of (Dial, hands) era correct and my service.

[Dan S]

That sounds totally plausible to me and I’m glad you feel you can enjoy the watch because it looks very nice.

[qwackerz]

Originally Posted by Dan S

That sounds totally plausible to me and I’m glad you feel you can enjoy the watch because it looks very nice.

Many thanks,
I feel more connected with it now i know more from the help of the forum.

Even more so when i attach a 1969 riveted oyster bracelet (My preference over the folded option) in the next few day.

[qwackerz]

I just pledged due to all your help and support,

However i cant coment as the pledge thread is closed?

[rootbeer7]

Good choice. Your watch looks great. Wear in great health.

[qwackerz]

Thankyou sir.

Out of curiosity,

What does the (T) stand for in T SWISS T,

And i see some are singed O T SWISS O T ?.

[Dan S]

Originally Posted by qwackerz

Thankyou sir.

Out of curiosity,

What does the (T) stand for in T SWISS T,

And i see some are singed O T SWISS O T ?.

T represents Tritium. The "O" is actually the Greek letter sigma, and indicated that the dial furniture (and hands, IIRC) is solid gold. It was done in the early 70s to promote the fact that solid gold indices were used on those dials. Eventually they switched over to making all dials with gold furniture and stopped advertising it.

[qwackerz]

Originally Posted by Dan S

T represents Tritium. The "O" is actually the Greek letter sigma, and indicated that the dial furniture (and hands, IIRC) is solid gold. It was done in the early 70s to promote the fact that solid gold indices were used on those dials. Eventually they switched over to making all dials with gold furniture and stopped advertising it.

Ahhh very interesting,

Im learning more about my vintage Gentleman's Wrist Watch all the time.