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The GMT Master · 1 August 2010, 11:55 PM

For me, I'd go for a PC laptop. I base my decisions based on hardware, and for comparable prices, the spec of a PC laptop will always win. Windows 7 is an absolute doddle to use, a big improvement over Vista - OS X looks sharp, but universal software is always an issue. I did look in to buying a Mac a few years back, but for my needs, it wasn't right, and compatability would have been an issue.

Hope this helps

TheDude · 1 August 2010, 11:59 PM

Seriously, for the folks who missed what I said earlier:

Office for Mac 2011 is in Beta.

Previous -recent- versions of Office for Mac did not have Outlook (they had Expose).

The new version has Outlook 2011 and is very nice. I am currently running it and it is lightning fast.

http://www.tuaw.com/2010/07/28/micro...-for-mac-2011/

If you or the org you work for doesn't have a Mac software lic or a contract that permits flexibility, then you might have to install the Windows version in a VM just to be compliant with corporate policy or MS licensing.

Ed Rooney · 2 August 2010, 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sakuraba

Mac user here.

Once you go Mac, you never go back!

I had the original Mac 128K, along with issue number 1 of Macworld magazine.

Also a Plus

And a Turquoise iMac.

And a Powerbook G4

And an Iphone 3G.

I went back.

TheDude · 2 August 2010, 12:10 AM

As you know I am usually a guy who is speaking up against Apple (even though I too have had their products and am quite familiar with them).

I personally chose a Mac with the new job because I was sick of IT departments meddling with my machine and loading all sorts of crap.

Windows admin tools are far more pervasive in IT orgs, and the people enforcing and updating are quicker to push garbage onto your work machine if you're running Windows.

So far, I'm happy to be free of this sort of nonsense. The IT team isn't as familiar with Mac OS X and they don't care what I do. It was initially a little bit more challenging getting the various internal resources working, but I got everything just right.

TheDude · 2 August 2010, 12:19 AM

FWIW to the OP, if you like Sony they have what I'd consider the best Wintel option out there.

A buddy of mine has it, it has a 1080p LCD and it's only a 13.1" laptop. He has the dual RAID SSD option as well. In-Sane. If you're not sure, peruse the specs on both the MBP and the Sony Z Series. I think the Sony can hold its own.

http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs/...52921644569398

nauticajoe · 2 August 2010, 12:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDude

FWIW to the OP, if you like Sony they have what I'd consider the best Wintel option out there.

A buddy of mine has it, it has a 1080p LCD and it's only a 13.1" laptop. He has the dual RAID SSD option as well. In-Sane. If you're not sure, peruse the specs on both the MBP and the Sony Z Series. I think the Sony can hold its own.

http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs/...52921644569398

Thanks Dude! I currently use the VGN series. I like it. But as you said earlier, sometimes it can be a pain in the a$$ when one has to deal with these "anti" everything & patches, etc...

Ed Rooney · 2 August 2010, 01:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDude

As you know I am usually a guy who is speaking up against Apple (even though I too have had their products and am quite familiar with them).

I personally chose a Mac with the new job because I was sick of IT departments meddling with my machine and loading all sorts of crap.

Windows admin tools are far more pervasive in IT orgs, and the people enforcing and updating are quicker to push garbage onto your work machine if you're running Windows.

So far, I'm happy to be free of this sort of nonsense. The IT team isn't as familiar with Mac OS X and they don't care what I do. It was initially a little bit more challenging getting the various internal resources working, but I got everything just right.

You must not be getting the 300MB downloads to update Safari, Quicktime and Itunes every few weeks. Apple is constantly pushing updates.

TheDude · 2 August 2010, 01:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nauticajoe

Thanks Dude! I currently use the VGN series. I like it. But as you said earlier, sometimes it can be a pain in the a$$ when one has to deal with these "anti" everything & patches, etc...

Just to clarify, I don't mean the OS or app patches in Windows. If anything, I think Apple needs to do a better job with that.

I'm talking about the Enterprise level deployment tools and packages that give admins all sorts of rights and access. Also, these admins generally mess up at least once a year and deny you service to your corporate resources (in my experience anyway).

TheDude · 2 August 2010, 01:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed Rooney

You must not be getting the 300MB downloads to update Safari, Quicktime and Itunes every few weeks. Apple is constantly pushing updates.

As I said before, I have no issue with those. Those are easy. It's the Enterprise tools in the Windows IT space to deploy all sorts of garbage that I take issue with.

Route 66 · 2 August 2010, 01:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tools

PC based systems are 93% of the market..... I'll stick with mine as they're easy to upgrade and you can get peripherals practically anyplace...

Sorry Larry, but I have to question this logic from a Rolex owner.

How much of the new watch market does Rolex have?

I converted to being Mac user about 5 or 6 years ago and haven't looked back. I don't consider myself to be a computer expert by any stretch of the imagination and to me, a Mac is just much easier to use. I hear of people becoming new Mac users often, and I don't know of any one of these 'Switchers' (as they are called), going back to PC.

BarkMaster · 2 August 2010, 01:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDude

As I said before, I have no issue with those. Those are easy. It's the Enterprise tools in the Windows IT space to deploy all sorts of garbage that I take issue with.

Most of the tools are for management purposes and save large companies small fortunes in support costs.

It is forbidden by policy at most coporations and prevented by technology at some of the well run ones.

If your company / IT department allows you to connect an "unmanaged" device to their network, they deserve what they get.

rr-nyc · 2 August 2010, 02:20 AM

Like many here, I have both. I need my thinkpad for work but I want my macs for everything else.

21"iMac, 13"MBP, 1tb Time Capsule, AppleTV and iphone 3GS round out my home.

TheDude · 2 August 2010, 02:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 777

Most of the tools are for management purposes and save large companies small fortunes in support costs.

It is forbidden by policy at most coporations and prevented by technology at some of the well run ones.

If your company / IT department allows you to connect an "unmanaged" device to their network, they deserve what they get.

I agree that depending on the size and focus of the company, unmanaged devices can be dangerous. Fortunately, everyone is a security professional and the security of these devices is taken very seriously.

I would argue that a small company in this kind of mode can be more secure than a poorly run large company that can check all the boxes but isn't really securing anything.

BarkMaster · 2 August 2010, 02:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDude

I agree that depending on the size and focus of the company, unmanaged devices can be dangerous. Fortunately, everyone is a security professional and the security of these devices is taken very seriously.

I would argue that a small company in this kind of mode can be more secure than a poorly run large company that can check all the boxes but isn't really securing anything.

I can't argue with that!

Most InfoSec guys I know use *nix, however.

TheDude · 2 August 2010, 03:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 777

I can't argue with that!

Most InfoSec guys I know use *nix, however.

Sure. *nix or Mac OS in my experience.

Bit of trivia, Google won't provision employees a Windows machine. Only Mac or Linux. I know several folks who work in a security capacity there.

BarkMaster · 2 August 2010, 03:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDude

Sure. *nix or Mac OS in my experience.

Bit of trivia, Google won't provision employees a Windows machine. Only Mac or Linux. I know several folks who work in a security capacity there.

It seems like all the "better" (common) tools are made for *nix, so I think that is the reason why... You can run them in a VM, of course!

Ed Rooney · 2 August 2010, 05:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDude

Sure. *nix or Mac OS in my experience.

Bit of trivia, Google won't provision employees a Windows machine. Only Mac or Linux. I know several folks who work in a security capacity there.

There's a story behind that. Google won't provision Windows because their Windows team wasn't patching the OS's, and it bit them hard. They were letting developers dictate IT policy, which is trouble.

Patching is good.

BarkMaster · 2 August 2010, 05:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed Rooney

Patching is good.

And that applies to all OSes and applications.

daveathall · 2 August 2010, 05:22 AM

Whats patching please?

BarkMaster · 2 August 2010, 05:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daveathall

Whats patching please?

Vendors such as Microsoft, Apple, etc routinely release updates to their operating systems and applications. Some are for improved functionality and some are for security.

Ed Rooney · 2 August 2010, 05:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daveathall

Whats patching please?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patch_%28computing%29

daveathall · 2 August 2010, 05:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed Rooney

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patch_%28computing%29

Quote:

Originally Posted by 777

Vendors such as Microsoft, Apple, etc routinely release updates to their operating systems and applications. Some are for improved functionality and some are for security.

Thank you.

Brunotheboxer · 2 August 2010, 08:41 AM

Ed go to Mcdonalds and get yourself a happy meal. Maybe you'll feel happy for one time in your life. No hard feelings Ed Steve Jobs doesn't have anything to do with mcdonalds.

Ed Rooney · 2 August 2010, 09:46 AM

Can't stand MacDonalds. I doubt any Applemming would be seen there, either.

BarkMaster · 2 August 2010, 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brunotheboxer

Ed go to Mcdonalds and get yourself a happy meal. Maybe you'll feel happy for one time in your life. No hard feelings Ed Steve Jobs doesn't have anything to do with mcdonalds.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed Rooney

Can't stand MacDonalds. I doubt any Applemming would be seen there, either.

You two crack me up.

Brunotheboxer · 2 August 2010, 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed Rooney

Can't stand MacDonalds. I doubt any Applemming would be seen there, either.

Then have a drink on me Ed. Loosen up a little and enjoy some life and stop worrying about Steve Jobs everyday.

Ebruner · 2 August 2010, 10:21 AM

Buy a MAC and be happy.

PC folks are always so angry and worked up all the time.

-Eddie

Route 66 · 2 August 2010, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ebruner

Buy a MAC and be happy.

PC folks are always so angry and worked up all the time.

-Eddie

You would be to if you had to deal with The Blue Screen of Death!

ed90401 · 2 August 2010, 10:30 AM

MacBook Pro 15" ...

BarkMaster · 2 August 2010, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stevarn

You would be to if you had to deal with The Blue Screen of Death!

You mean this one? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IW7Rqwwth84

2 August 2010, 05:22 AM	#49
daveathall "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Real Name: Dave Location: England. Watch: Various Posts: 7,305	Whats patching please? __________________ KINDEST REGARDS DAVE

2 August 2010, 10:21 AM	#57
Ebruner "TRF" Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Real Name: Eddie Location: Kentucky Watch: 118208 Posts: 2,510	Buy a MAC and be happy. PC folks are always so angry and worked up all the time. -Eddie __________________

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1 August 2010, 11:55 PM	#31
The GMT Master "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Real Name: Chris Location: England Posts: 8,150	For me, I'd go for a PC laptop. I base my decisions based on hardware, and for comparable prices, the spec of a PC laptop will always win. Windows 7 is an absolute doddle to use, a big improvement over Vista - OS X looks sharp, but universal software is always an issue. I did look in to buying a Mac a few years back, but for my needs, it wasn't right, and compatability would have been an issue. Hope this helps

1 August 2010, 11:59 PM	#32
TheDude "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: DC Area, USA Watch: IIc,1680 Red,16660 Posts: 4,492	Seriously, for the folks who missed what I said earlier: Office for Mac 2011 is in Beta. Previous -recent- versions of Office for Mac did not have Outlook (they had Expose). The new version has Outlook 2011 and is very nice. I am currently running it and it is lightning fast. http://www.tuaw.com/2010/07/28/micro...-for-mac-2011/ If you or the org you work for doesn't have a Mac software lic or a contract that permits flexibility, then you might have to install the Windows version in a VM just to be compliant with corporate policy or MS licensing.

2 August 2010, 12:10 AM	#34
TheDude "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: DC Area, USA Watch: IIc,1680 Red,16660 Posts: 4,492	As you know I am usually a guy who is speaking up against Apple (even though I too have had their products and am quite familiar with them). I personally chose a Mac with the new job because I was sick of IT departments meddling with my machine and loading all sorts of crap. Windows admin tools are far more pervasive in IT orgs, and the people enforcing and updating are quicker to push garbage onto your work machine if you're running Windows. So far, I'm happy to be free of this sort of nonsense. The IT team isn't as familiar with Mac OS X and they don't care what I do. It was initially a little bit more challenging getting the various internal resources working, but I got everything just right.

2 August 2010, 12:19 AM	#35
TheDude "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: DC Area, USA Watch: IIc,1680 Red,16660 Posts: 4,492	FWIW to the OP, if you like Sony they have what I'd consider the best Wintel option out there. A buddy of mine has it, it has a 1080p LCD and it's only a 13.1" laptop. He has the dual RAID SSD option as well. In-Sane. If you're not sure, peruse the specs on both the MBP and the Sony Z Series. I think the Sony can hold its own. http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs/...52921644569398

2 August 2010, 02:20 AM	#42
rr-nyc Liar & Ratbag Join Date: Nov 2009 Real Name: Renato Location: NYC / Miami Beach Watch: Rolex Daytona Posts: 5,344	Like many here, I have both. I need my thinkpad for work but I want my macs for everything else. 21"iMac, 13"MBP, 1tb Time Capsule, AppleTV and iphone 3GS round out my home.

2 August 2010, 08:41 AM	#53
Brunotheboxer Banned Join Date: Mar 2008 Real Name: Bruno Location: Boston/Cape Cod Watch: 16610,PAM. 111, G Posts: 7,608	Ed go to Mcdonalds and get yourself a happy meal. Maybe you'll feel happy for one time in your life. No hard feelings Ed Steve Jobs doesn't have anything to do with mcdonalds.

2 August 2010, 09:46 AM	#54
Ed Rooney "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Annapolis, MD Watch: Sea-Dweller 16600 Posts: 5,081	Can't stand MacDonalds. I doubt any Applemming would be seen there, either.

2 August 2010, 10:30 AM	#59
ed90401 "TRF" Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Mission Viejo, CA Watch: GMT Master II/c Posts: 14	MacBook Pro 15" ...

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