Relationship Builder With AD

[Guppydriver]

Originally Posted by amh

That's how much it is these days if you want a Rolex. You could get an equivalent Seiko for $500, sure. If you want a sub, 13k is what it is.

Unless you are willing to play the long game. Which I am. I'd rather have a Sub and be 3K closer to my next watch, but I understand.


Obviously, we both know that even though a Seiko has equivalent specs as a Sub, it's not finished to the same horological detail as the Submariner. But this is kind of my point as well. Many would opine that a Submariner at gray pricing (13-18k depending on reference) is not finished to the same detail as other options available at that price point (especially the LV).

Again...

I get both arguments and I freaking LOVE the Sub! I'm just saying that my upper middle class but not wealthy butt finds the Sub very pricey and not a great value when not purchased at retail.

But if bring you more smiles than anything else, than who cares about "value" I suppose.

[ol' Rex]

If I can get a Submariner for retail -- which I recently did -- then basically anyone can.

It's only impossible if one never tries...

[PenDelicate]

Originally Posted by BKScripto

This is one reason I have not went grey. I don’t think Rolex is worth more than MSRP, that is just my opinion and the grey market disagrees with me right now. That’s cool… I’ll wait. If Subs continue to come down in price and get very close to retail pricing+tax, then I’ll bite if my AD doesn’t come through.

A lot of people don't like paying grey market premiums and that's fine. To each his own.

You *could* consider it differently, however. You know how at theme-parks like Disney you pay for your day-ticket (for example) and you can go on the rides. But you can (or could) also buy "FastPass" tickets, which sell at a premium, but let you skip the queues.

That's sort-of what the grey market premium is. You're still buying the watch for MSRP; the extra just let's you skip the year-long queue at the AD.

I wonder would someone who refuses to pay a grey-market premium for a Rolex also refuse to pay the FastPass premium at DisneyLand.

[bluestreak]

Originally Posted by PenDelicate

A lot of people don't like paying grey market premiums and that's fine. To each his own.

You *could* consider it differently, however. You know how at theme-parks like Disney you pay for your day-ticket (for example) and you can go on the rides. But you can (or could) also buy "FastPass" tickets, which sell at a premium, but let you skip the queues.

That's sort-of what the grey market premium is. You're still buying the watch for MSRP; the extra just let's you skip the year-long queue at the AD.

I wonder would someone who refuses to pay a grey-market premium for a Rolex also refuse to pay the FastPass premium at DisneyLand.

The fast pass at Disney world costs USD 25…

A more apt analogy is first class upgrades on airlines. If you spend a lot of money on the airline, the chances of getting the upgrade are pretty good, but not guaranteed. The more popular the route, the higher level of spend you have to be at to secure the upgrade.
And if you absolutely must sit in first, there is always the option to pay the premium to sit there…

[BKScripto]

Originally Posted by PenDelicate

A lot of people don't like paying grey market premiums and that's fine. To each his own.

You *could* consider it differently, however. You know how at theme-parks like Disney you pay for your day-ticket (for example) and you can go on the rides. But you can (or could) also buy "FastPass" tickets, which sell at a premium, but let you skip the queues.

That's sort-of what the grey market premium is. You're still buying the watch for MSRP; the extra just let's you skip the year-long queue at the AD.

I wonder would someone who refuses to pay a grey-market premium for a Rolex also refuse to pay the FastPass premium at DisneyLand.

That’s an interesting analogy. I’ve never tried at Disney, but universal studios fast pass was like $200+ dollars the day we tried to get it. Instead we showed up early and was just fine without it. So maybe that answers your question hahaha

[VerticalClutch]

Originally Posted by PenDelicate

A lot of people don't like paying grey market premiums and that's fine. To each his own.

You *could* consider it differently, however. You know how at theme-parks like Disney you pay for your day-ticket (for example) and you can go on the rides. But you can (or could) also buy "FastPass" tickets, which sell at a premium, but let you skip the queues.

That's sort-of what the grey market premium is. You're still buying the watch for MSRP; the extra just let's you skip the year-long queue at the AD.

I wonder would someone who refuses to pay a grey-market premium for a Rolex also refuse to pay the FastPass premium at DisneyLand.

Your analogy doesn’t work because of the time you have at the theme park. You are only there for 3 days or something like that. So spending time in line wastes the money I spent to get in.

If I had an artificial time that I could only enjoy the watch for 3 years and then I had to give it back, I wouldn’t waste a year of those three in line.

So I guess if I were older and closer to meeting my creator, I wouldn’t wait and I’d pay gray prices.

I’ve never purchased a watch outside of an AD and I likely never will. Just start a relationship with an AD. It isn’t that hard and they’ll get you watches.

[Nads786]

Originally Posted by Guppydriver

Man..

I get the prudence of going gray as opposed to buying things you don't like, but either way...

It blows me away that people want to spend 13 thousand dollars (or more) on a 200m stainless steel dive watch.

That's not a dig on the submariner at all, I love the watch.

Heck, I get peoples tastes are different, but I could buy a new steel and gold GO Panodate for 20% off at around 12K with a level of finishing that is more commensurate to that price.

Not saying you shouldn't pick up what you love most, but I just still trip out on what people are paying for a damn nice, but not overly impressive watch.

I’ve tried to find something to dethrone the sub, going to dealers and doing side by sides and wrist by wrist checks. The sub seems to keep beating out everything else I’ve tried.

[Guppydriver]

Originally Posted by Nads786

I’ve tried to find something to dethrone the sub, going to dealers and doing side by sides and wrist by wrist checks. The sub seems to keep beating out everything else I’ve tried.

I understand, it's a great watch. I agree that there isn't much I would want more at around 10K (retail), but at gray pricing of 13K or more, I PERSONALLY find that there are other options that seem more commensurate in detail and finishing to that price point.

I can get a FF or GO new from AD for the same price as a gray Sub. None of that matters if you like the Sub better (which I actually might tbh), but I'm just saying that's a lot of money for a SS, closed caseback. 200m diver.

I'm waiting for a sub, but will continue to wait until I a.) get the call (whenever that is) or b.) the gray price is the same as retail (which may never happen).

[Nads786]

Originally Posted by Guppydriver

I understand, it's a great watch. I agree that there isn't much I would want more at around 10K (retail), but at gray pricing of 13K or more, I PERSONALLY find that there are other options that seem more commensurate in detail and finishing to that price point.

I can get a FF or GO new from AD for the same price as a gray Sub. None of that matters if you like the Sub better (which I actually might tbh), but I'm just saying that's a lot of money for a SS, closed caseback. 200m diver.

I'm waiting for a sub, but will continue to wait until I a.) get the call (whenever that is) or b.) the gray price is the same as retail (which may never happen).

I 100% agree. I was actually putting it head-to-head against the Seamaster which comes at a 5K discount. I was close to fulfilling my instant gratification needs but decided the best way to know the answer is go to a AD and see them head to head and take as many pictures as possible.

If there was no sub I would be very happy with a Seamaster, but now that I've seen and experienced the Sub it's really hard to chose the seamster.

I also told the AD show me every diver in the store - we took a look at Longines, Breitling, Tudor but nothing spoke to me the same way.

I went the GS route and figured maybe they would blow me away and make me flip but I didn't get that same feeling.

[BKScripto]

Originally Posted by Nads786

I 100% agree. I was actually putting it head-to-head against the Seamaster which comes at a 5K discount. I was close to fulfilling my instant gratification needs but decided the best way to know the answer is go to a AD and see them head to head and take as many pictures as possible.

If there was no sub I would be very happy with a Seamaster, but now that I've seen and experienced the Sub it's really hard to chose the seamster.

I also told the AD show me every diver in the store - we took a look at Longines, Breitling, Tudor but nothing spoke to me the same way.

I went the GS route and figured maybe they would blow me away and make me flip but I didn't get that same feeling.

I love my Speedy racing panda dial -- but the seamaster 300m just doesn't do it for me. That helium escape crown and the non-tapered bracelet are not for me.

The Sub has something extra - maybe it's the name. Maybe it's just the way the light hits it... but it seems Rolex got everything right with the Sub.

[Rico_Brasole]

Originally Posted by Guppydriver

I understand, it's a great watch. I agree that there isn't much I would want more at around 10K (retail), but at gray pricing of 13K or more, I PERSONALLY find that there are other options that seem more commensurate in detail and finishing to that price point.

I can get a FF or GO new from AD for the same price as a gray Sub. None of that matters if you like the Sub better (which I actually might tbh), but I'm just saying that's a lot of money for a SS, closed caseback. 200m diver.

I'm waiting for a sub, but will continue to wait until I a.) get the call (whenever that is) or b.) the gray price is the same as retail (which may never happen).

Hang in there. Basic subs used to flood the secondary market at 15% off msrp sometimes much more. Now they are just flooding the market at outrageous prices that occasionally get sold to someone who isn’t a dealer.


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[Nads786]

Originally Posted by Rico_Brasole

Hang in there. Basic subs used to flood the secondary market at 15% off msrp sometimes much more. Now they are just flooding the market at outrageous prices that occasionally get sold to someone who isn’t a dealer.


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Is this really true? I look at the time stamps for some of the “bumps” and it can range from a few weeks or a month or two. Worst I’ve seen was five months.


You really can’t stop a market correction with smoke and mirrors.

[jimcarver]

A) I wouldn't do it out of principle, B) it seems like far too much hassle for my liking.

[Krb65]

Do not buy something you don't want and sell it on the grey. People have done that at my local AD and they have found out. Have no idea how, but great way to forever tarnish a relationship before its started.

I have a great relationship with my AD. I have gotten both my watches from them at retail. Granted I did buy a lot of stuff here and there, but I use the same salesperson who is a staple at this AD, and I continue to do business with just her. It has come to the point where I just shoot her a text if I am coming in.

[Nairn1980]

In this instance, go grey and have the watch on your wrist by the weekend.
Life is too short.

[m j b]

Wow. Considering the nearly unanimous opinions here, it's kind of amazing that these new threads still pop-up regularly.

[SS Oyster]

How do you know they registered your interest in the TT YM?


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[Asuki]

I picked up a TT YM 37 last week from an AD as a first time customer after 2 week wait which I do plan to use as a relationship builder. But I love the watch and it’s the exact one I wanted. The chocolate dial is a lot more harmonious than black dial. Good luck with your decision!

[Nads786]

My personal stance is to be patient with my ADs until September 1st. If I don't have something by then, I'll go grey before my birthday.

[JRell]

My relationship builder is more like a solid handshake and good eye contact. A 15k TT watch is a bit overboard for a SS sub.

[subprimero]

It's not worth buying something you don't want.

[brkn]

I'd buy and flip the watch you don't like. You can use Moda or DavidSW or another reputable grey. It might get you closer to the sub.

[HMHM]

Some people just don’t understand that people may actually want to buy other watches that they like…. It’s not just Rolex Rolex Rolex…. If a Rolex comes along the way, that’s great! But it seems that the argument that some people try to make is centred around the fallacy that buying other watches is SOLELY to get Rolex, and once they get the Rolex, other watches can be dumped into the bin. That’s just ignorant…

[bluestreak]

Originally Posted by HMHM

Some people just don’t understand that people may actually want to buy other watches that they like…. It’s not just Rolex Rolex Rolex…. If a Rolex comes along the way, that’s great! But it seems that the argument that some people try to make is centred around the fallacy that buying other watches is SOLELY to get Rolex, and once they get the Rolex, other watches can be dumped into the bin. That’s just ignorant…

There is a definite sentiment/assumption that if you’re not buying a Rolex you’re “buying stuff you don’t want.”

I bristle at this. There are tons of watches I enjoy, including Rolex. The AD where I bought my LV and Polar sold me a Tudor first. Which I still wear more than either other watch.

[2loaded]

The wife LOVES her 126621 Yachtmaster Choc dial.
Happy hunting !

[Halifax Daytona UK]

You are not building a relationship, you are being black mailed

[Dawgprint]

Originally Posted by Halifax Daytona UK

You are not building a relationship, you are being black mailed

Preach!

[BayAreaTech]

Absolutely respect your own desires. Relationship building is not buying stuff you do not want. If that is the case, go grey.

[ducatiti]

So now going grey is the best option for most, will this Rolex fiasco ever end and when? Any guesstimates?

[temporarychicken]

In the UK the MRSP of a TT Submariner is 13,150 GBP

Rather than pay close to that in the grey market for an SS model, why not just go for the TT Rolesor which should be easier to get nowadays.

It's basically the same watch, but with some shiny 18 karat gold bits, mostly in the bracelet.

The raw price of the included gold is probably higher than the price difference between the Grey SS and MRSP TT price.

Free gold lol!