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Orchi · 22 August 2011, 05:16 PM

Err Buddies...Orchi has just came across the existence of this matter...
after noticing it from the recent watch listings in VRM n likewise in TRF...

Orchi has no dealings with the Seller before...
apart from knowing that he sells regularly in VRF n TRF...
n that he is known to be a reputable n good Seller...

Perhaps he too may not be aware of the issue on the 1680 watch...
which he has listed for sale...
Perhaps others may not have noticed it in VRM or TRF...
but Orchi feels that this issue should be highlighted for discussion...
hopefully to gain extra understanding for others n Orchi too...

Nevertheless Orchi can't be sure about the history of the watch in discussion here...
Orchi hopes the Seller might be able to chip in his opinions on the subject matter that Orchi is raising here as well...

Here are some pictures of Original Case engravings(factory) taken from a couple of normal 1680 Sub watches for comparisons...
The general conditions n appearance of the machine tool marks are consistent...
to normal the wear n tear elements...on such vintage watches.
(One of the 1680 Sub is also being listed by the same Seller n another one belonging to Orchi)

Here's a couple of pics taken from the Seller's listings...
showing the Case engravings between the lugs...
on the 1680 Sub(S/Nos. 5.70mil)...

Firstly...you would see that the types of engraved fonts on the 1680 Sub
S/nos. 5.70mil are different by comparison with the normal 1680 Subs above...which are in quite close range of case series...

For Orchi that is...these engraving fonts do not look consistent with those...
that would have been done originally....

Here are the tell tale signs which Orchi had relied on to have notice that...
the Case Engravings on the 1680 Sub with S/nos. 5.70mil...
may have been changed or altered...
especially so...when the conditions n appearance of the machine tool marks on this particular case...
are inconsistent to the normal elements of wear n tear...
n the present engravings between the lugs...
are looking somewhat...FRESH...so to speak.

Of course Orchi is not aiming to say that the Seller in this case had anything to do with it...certainly not.

But Orchi is asking whether such a change or alteration(if any) could have been done Rolex service or perhaps done by outside party...?
How about the opinions of others in here...?
Have you seen such change or alteration of S/nos. before...?

It would be interesting to check inside the CB to see if there is any...
service markings which might indicate a another set of S/nos...
was used before...
that might tell a bit clearly on the history of the watch...

jedly1 · 22 August 2011, 07:49 PM

two diff styles both of which raise concerns ...i know on VRF one of the other mods is talking to Jacek.

the 1680 side looks off even by itself...and the engraving on serial side is similar to some replacement cases style engraving by rolex....but this makes little sense on a registered design style case as opposed to an original rolex design case....and certainly makes no sense on the same case as engraving at other end

but the case itself looks ok ...so some discussion of the watches provenance and history is needed???

Orchi · 22 August 2011, 08:17 PM

Err Buddy Jedly..deeper in thoughts..
It makes sence for Orchi IF possible the case reference was different before..
Eg: "ORIG.ROLEX DESIGN" marked Ref "551x"..
At 12 o'clock..

jedly1 · 22 August 2011, 08:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orchi

Err Buddy Jedly..deeper in thoughts..
It makes sence for Orchi IF possible the case reference was different before..
Eg: "ORIG.ROLEX DESIGN" marked Ref "551x"..
At 12 o'clock..

yes maybe model number end has been altered , but that makes little sense on a low value model to go to so much trouble...to issue a replacement case by rolex ...and then someone else remove model number and original rolex design .....to then re engrave ....just easier to find a spare 1680 case ....but strange things happen ....i dont know is honest answer...little makes sense on this one..... maybe even mixed up photos ...have to wait for Jacek i think.

Rolex Junky · 22 August 2011, 08:35 PM

On a side note. If I may be so bold. Why does Orchi refer to himself in the third person?
On topic: interesting thread. Orchi you are like the Gil Grissom of Rolex CSI.

Johny · 22 August 2011, 10:08 PM

hi it looks like a file down and re-teep(RE STAMP). imho.

Enifed · 23 August 2011, 01:46 AM

Good write up.

dysondiver · 23 August 2011, 01:51 AM

looks like a bad stamping rather than a good engraveing . way too out of line for my liking.
there again the six eight and zero dont really jave the nice curvs that factory bought stamps have either .. dont know ,

Grissom · 23 August 2011, 05:05 AM

The 1680 looks engraved, not stamped.

onkyo · 23 August 2011, 05:52 AM

I believe we are looking at two different cases..... and one of them I would not buy.

hint - it says '1680'

22 August 2011, 05:16 PM	#1
Orchi Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Malaysia Posts: 2,934	Change or Alteration or modification of Case Engravings Err Buddies...Orchi has just came across the existence of this matter... after noticing it from the recent watch listings in VRM n likewise in TRF... Orchi has no dealings with the Seller before... apart from knowing that he sells regularly in VRF n TRF... n that he is known to be a reputable n good Seller... Perhaps he too may not be aware of the issue on the 1680 watch... which he has listed for sale... Perhaps others may not have noticed it in VRM or TRF... but Orchi feels that this issue should be highlighted for discussion... hopefully to gain extra understanding for others n Orchi too... Nevertheless Orchi can't be sure about the history of the watch in discussion here... Orchi hopes the Seller might be able to chip in his opinions on the subject matter that Orchi is raising here as well... Here are some pictures of Original Case engravings(factory) taken from a couple of normal 1680 Sub watches for comparisons... The general conditions n appearance of the machine tool marks are consistent... to normal the wear n tear elements...on such vintage watches. (One of the 1680 Sub is also being listed by the same Seller n another one belonging to Orchi) Here's a couple of pics taken from the Seller's listings... showing the Case engravings between the lugs... on the 1680 Sub(S/Nos. 5.70mil)... Firstly...you would see that the types of engraved fonts on the 1680 Sub S/nos. 5.70mil are different by comparison with the normal 1680 Subs above...which are in quite close range of case series... For Orchi that is...these engraving fonts do not look consistent with those... that would have been done originally.... Here are the tell tale signs which Orchi had relied on to have notice that... the Case Engravings on the 1680 Sub with S/nos. 5.70mil... may have been changed or altered... especially so...when the conditions n appearance of the machine tool marks on this particular case... are inconsistent to the normal elements of wear n tear... n the present engravings between the lugs... are looking somewhat...FRESH...so to speak. Of course Orchi is not aiming to say that the Seller in this case had anything to do with it...certainly not. But Orchi is asking whether such a change or alteration(if any) could have been done Rolex service or perhaps done by outside party...? How about the opinions of others in here...? Have you seen such change or alteration of S/nos. before...? It would be interesting to check inside the CB to see if there is any... service markings which might indicate a another set of S/nos... was used before... that might tell a bit clearly on the history of the watch...

22 August 2011, 10:08 PM	#6
Johny "TRF" Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Real Name: john Location: Scotland Watch: sub 16610Lv Posts: 13,523	hi it looks like a file down and re-teep(RE STAMP). imho. __________________ "AFTER DARK" BAR AND NIGHT CLUB GM.

23 August 2011, 05:05 AM	#9
Grissom "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Real Name: Nathan Location: US, Latin America Watch: GMT IIc 18K/SS Posts: 3,349	The 1680 looks engraved, not stamped. __________________ *(Member NAWCC since 1976)* 116713LN GMT-IIc 18k/SS (Z) + 116520 SS Daytona (M) + 16700 GMT Master (A) + 16610LV Submariner (V) + 16600 Sea Dweller (Z) + 116400 Milgauss White Dial (V) + 70330N Tudor Heritage Chronograph Grey w/Black Sub Dials (J) + 5513 Submariner Serif Dial (5.2 Mil) Who else needs an Intervention? (109 297) (137 237) (73 115) (221) (23) (56) (229) P-Club Member #5 RIP JJ Irani - TRF Legend

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22 August 2011, 07:49 PM	#2
jedly1 "TRF" Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: mel(oz)/Yorks(uk) Posts: 1,929	two diff styles both of which raise concerns ...i know on VRF one of the other mods is talking to Jacek. the 1680 side looks off even by itself...and the engraving on serial side is similar to some replacement cases style engraving by rolex....but this makes little sense on a registered design style case as opposed to an original rolex design case....and certainly makes no sense on the same case as engraving at other end but the case itself looks ok ...so some discussion of the watches provenance and history is needed???

22 August 2011, 08:17 PM	#3
Orchi Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Malaysia Posts: 2,934	Err Buddy Jedly..deeper in thoughts.. It makes sence for Orchi IF possible the case reference was different before.. Eg: "ORIG.ROLEX DESIGN" marked Ref "551x".. At 12 o'clock..

22 August 2011, 08:35 PM	#5
Rolex Junky Banned Join Date: Apr 2010 Real Name: Lorenzo Location: Netherlands Watch: 116710LN & 116201 Posts: 849	On a side note. If I may be so bold. Why does Orchi refer to himself in the third person? On topic: interesting thread. Orchi you are like the Gil Grissom of Rolex CSI.

23 August 2011, 01:46 AM	#7
Enifed Banned Join Date: Aug 2011 Real Name: Hans Location: Baden Watch: Rolex Posts: 8	Good write up.

23 August 2011, 01:51 AM	#8
dysondiver "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Real Name: tom Location: northern ireland Watch: my fins Posts: 10,063	looks like a bad stamping rather than a good engraveing . way too out of line for my liking. there again the six eight and zero dont really jave the nice curvs that factory bought stamps have either .. dont know ,

23 August 2011, 05:52 AM	#10
onkyo Banned Join Date: Apr 2008 Real Name: Pav Location: Manhattan Posts: 11,495	I believe we are looking at two different cases..... and one of them I would not buy. hint - it says '1680'

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