Not sure what to think?

[RRsDJ]

Some of you may know that my President bracelet was deemed a counterfeit by the eBay buyer and a few members here too. The buyer asked for a $1,500.00 refund, I refused so he returned it for a full refund. Theres more to the story but thats not what this thread is about......



Today I took one of my Moms watches to her jewelers to have the battery replaced in her Scarab watch. While I was there one of the sales guys complimented me on my Rolex. After the whole Paypal ordeal Id has just assumed my bracelet was fake and never thought twice about it but while I was there I asked if he could have his repair guy take a look at my bracelet for me and tell me if its authentic or not? He said sure. His guy looked at my bracelet under his loupe then did a gold test. To my surprise he said it was an authentic Rolex President bracelet. I said are you sure, he said yes and gave me this look like, I know what Im doing. I felt bad for questioning him like that so I told him my story and he softened up. I specifically asked him about the "G" below the ladies head and he said because of how old the bracelet was that it was polished down but assured me it was authentic.

Now I want to get a second opinion. I found a jewelry shop that sells alot of Rolex watches as well as other high-end watches so I took it there. The guy there looks at it and says yes its an authentic Rolex Presidential bracelet. I asked him, are you sure and he says yes, why? I told him my story. He said his appraiser was in and could look at it for and give me a written appraisal of my DJ and bracelet. I said ok. Ive always wanted to get one but never got around to it. He was appraising other jewelery so I had to hang out in the store for a little bit. When he finally got around to me he said really loud to himself, "AH, A DATEJUST". I said yep, he then shows me his all gold Submariner with a serti dial, damn that thing was beautiful!!! I said nice, I'll trade ya and he just laughed.

Before he started the appraisal I told him my concerns. He first removed the bracelet and put it in one of those sonic cleaning things. It was really gunked up because before cleaning it there use to be black in the Rolex lettering/ script and hallmarks on the clasp. I had just assumed thats how it was supposed to look but now its all gold. He set up his little box studio and took detailed pictures of the bracelet, the DJ body and then the DJ with the bracelet installed. Next he did a gold test on the bracelet and looked it over with his loupe. After that he opened the case back on the DJ and looked at the movement. He wrote down the model / serial number, took down some notes and said the bracelet was indeed authentic and said my DJ was in great condition for its age. I asked him about the "G" and he said it was polished down throughout the years but he saw some remnants of the "G". I asked about the screws & screw hole. He removed a link and said he didnt see anything wrong with them. I said ok. He said he'll write up my appraisal and have it to me mid week. This guy is GIA certified (Not that it means anything when it comes to Rolex watches) and hes been in business for 44years and and I quote, "Has appraised his fair share of Rolex watches". He said thats all he does is appraise fine jewelery and gem stones for a living. Hes been doing this for longer than Ive been alive and this is his field of expertise so I believe what he says.

We left there and headed to an outdoor food festival at our mall. We ate and then walked around the mall for a bit and my wife said why dont you take it to the jewelry stores here. So we stopped by three jewelery stores in the mall. Two were local jewelers and the third was Kay Jewelers. All three shops looked at it under a loupe and again said it was authentic. We left the mall and I wanted to make one last stop at Jareds thats right across from the mall. I remember reading on TRF that Jareds used to be a Rolex AD so they should know. Two guys looked at it and said the same thing, yes its authentic then tried to make a sale. One guy then says the bracelet has a dent that needs to be repaired and it needs a good polishing. He said they could take care of both if I wanted to leave it with him and while it was there he could have their appraiser do a written appraisal for me. I said no and left.

There's some members here that really know their stuff when it comes to authenticating Rolex watches, parts & accessories and I really respect their opinions but pictures are sometimes deceiving. Ive had nine different people personally hold and inspect my bracelet that repair, appraise, sell / have sold Rolex watches and all have said my bracelet is authentic. Is it possible theyre ALL wrong. Sure but not likely.

I honestly believe the buyer on eBay made the whole "fake" bracelet accusation up to try and get a $1,500.00 refund out of me. A TRF member said the same buyer tried to pull the exact same stunt with them. He bought their Rolex and claimed the bracelet was fake. The TRF member had proof so it didnt work. I dont have alot of selling feedback on eBay, let alone sell high dollar items, so the buyer thought Id fall for it and just do a partial refund because I really needed the money. Obviously he was wrong.

Another thing that really bothered from the start is how long it took him to let me know that the bracelet was fake. This guy is a self proclaimed Rolex GOD and a used-watch dealer yet it took him a week to find out that my bracelet was "fake" but little old me was able to have nine people at several different jewelery stores look at it for me in one day! He kept telling me over and over how he spends millions of dollars a year on watches so why would he play games. At the end of the day a sales man is a sales man and theyre in it to make money not loose money. I think within that week he tried to sell it and either the potential buyer he had lined up backed out of the deal or he couldn't sell it for what he thought he could and then tried for the partial $1,500.00 refund. If he got the $1,500.00 refund he wouldve gotten my DJ for $4,900.00 which he wouldve definitely made a profit on. If the partial refund didnt work he gets his money back so he doesnt have to take a loss due to not being able to sell it for more than $6,400.00.

[Czechman]

If it were me I'd just take the watch to a RSC and ask them. But wait... won't they confiscate it if it's fake? Not sure but believe I heard that somewhere.

What a mess. I feel for you brother.

[Solo118]

Sorry I dont know the rest of your story... but if you got your watch back and sent the buyer his money back... then you are done with him.

Put it back up for sale if needed, and now you have appraisal papers to prove it to anybody that tries to hassle you.

For the heck of it I would also send a copy to the original buyer to show how wrong he was.

[andromeda160]

Originally Posted by Czechman

If it were me I'd just take the watch to a RSC and ask them. But wait... won't they confiscate it if it's fake? Not sure but believe I heard that somewhere.

What a mess. I feel for you brother.

even if it is fake, its a fake item you owned, as long as your not trying to sell a fake item as authentic, i don't think it's illegal to own and I don't think that Rolex could take it. Aside from that theres like 1500-$2000 worth of gold in the band. and you could definatley sue for them stealing that kind of money ;)

as for your band, I haven't seen it but if you had that many professionals look at it i'm sure your legit. I had the same thing happen to me selling old coins on ebay once. People say it's a Replica, make you second guess themselves, send a large portion of money to them in a refund and they get their authentic item at a severe discount. Use caution when selling things on ebay, earlier I read a post on here about somone selling a legit TT oyster band and the person said it was fake and is making a false claim on paypal.

[Vincent65]

"Not sure what to think?" Who? You? After nine appraisals? Sounds like you've analysed the heck out of that one - glad it's all good! Are you going to try to sell it again now?

[U5512]

Well, the scroll mark didn't look good to me then or now, and as far the "G" under the queen's neck, it's located INSIDE the clasp where you normally DON'T polish!!! Look at your pictures inside the clasp, it is still matte / or unpolished finish, and if it has been polished to death like the appraisers said it will be so SHINY AND SMOOTH!!!

[RRsDJ]

Originally Posted by U5512

Well, the scroll mark didn't look good to me then or now, and as far the "G" under the queen's neck, it's located INSIDE the clasp where you normally DON'T polish!!! Look at your pictures inside the clasp, it is still matte / or unpolished finish, and if it has been polished to death like the appraisers said it will be so SHINY AND SMOOTH!!!

Don't know what to tell you. If you're in Orlando hit me up and you take a look at it. Lol

A guy doing appraisals for 44yrs. says its authentic. Should I just say nope wrong because some guys on TRF don't like the scroll work!??

Sorry but that's silly. Just like everyone says dials could be different dont go by fonts, the same could apply to clasps. This is not a 2012 clasp, it's pre-1995.

Anyway I'm done with the whole thing. I'm going to have multiple paperwork that says its authentic so that's what it is. I'm done second guessing that's why I took it to professionals that deal in Rolex / jewelry. :)



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[brian8121]

x2.

If you want peace of mind, take it to your local RSC

Originally Posted by Czechman

If it were me I'd just take the watch to a RSC and ask them. But wait... won't they confiscate it if it's fake? Not sure but believe I heard that somewhere.

What a mess. I feel for you brother.

[RRsDJ]

Originally Posted by brian8121

x2.

If you want peace of mind, take it to your local RSC

I'm in Orlando there is no close RSC. The closest AD is 40mins away. It's hard to find time to take it there.



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[joseluu]

If you are convinced that should be it. The problem will resurface though when you try to convince someone else. I guess only the Rolex AD word would convince everybody.

[Darmapow]

You already appear to have invested a substantial amount of time in to this. Surely 40 mins to draw a line under it all and put your mind at ease is worth it.


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[Syed117]

Originally Posted by RRsDJ

I'm in Orlando there is no close RSC. The closest AD is 40mins away. It's hard to find time to take it there.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

40 minutes? That's it? I agree that if you've out this much into it, 40 minutes shouldn't be an issue.

[RRsDJ]

Originally Posted by Darmapow

You already appear to have invested a substantial amount of time in to this. Surely 40 mins to draw a line under it all and put your mind at ease is worth it.


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Originally Posted by Syed117

40 minutes? That's it? I agree that if you've out this much into it, 40 minutes shouldn't be an issue.

That's it? Well lets see....Its 40mins without ANY traffic ONE way. Have you ever been to Orlando? If so then you'll understand, if not come on down!! It'll easily take over an hour ONE way. And if I have to leave it with them, thats another trip. I never intended to go to any jewelers this past weekend for the purpose of having my bracelet checked out. It was a fluke and it just so happened they were all within 3 miles of my home which was not a hassle unlike a trip to the AD.

I work until 5-5:30pm, sometimes on the weekends too, especially around year end. My wife is in school finishing up her last 2yrs for nursing so shes very busy herself. I have a 6yr old daughter thats in girl scouts, takes karate and takes ballet & dancing classes during the week and weekends. I have a 5 month old baby boy thats a handful. I have an 89yr old grandmother with Alzheimers and dementia that I see on the weekends along with a 87yr old grandfather a few streets over in assisted living that I also have to find time to see on the weekends.

So I dont exactly have alot of free time and when I do I dont want to spend it sitting in a car for 2hrs+.








Mods you can delete / lock the thread. I though it might be interesting for members following my situation to know about the bracelet. I dont really need an answer or help.

[Darmapow]

Then I guess you will have to go with what you have on this one. Good luck with whichever route you take.

[Gaijin]

The AD for authentication is the only way to ever put this back up for sale again. To do so otherwise would be wrong. There are too many differing opinions and the authenticity has been called into question so you must get the final word from Rolex USA prior to re-listing it. That is the right thing to do. Or to disclose all of this both positive and negative to a prospective buyer. That seems like more work than boxing it up and shipping it to Dallas or NY.

I think it would be easier to SEND it to the RSC. With their stamp of approval you can tell all to well whatever you want to tell them...

[springer]

RRsDJ, quick question about your "expert" examinations. Did any of these "experts" have a known genuine band for comparison purposes to your band?

[RRGHOST1]

I would go along the route that if you had refunded the $1500,he would have been happy. If nine respected people have authenticated that it is genuine then i would say it is. Its an easy scam but you didn't fall for it,its only put a doubt in your mind now unfortunately.

[MonBK]

Originally Posted by springer

RRsDJ, quick question about your "expert" examinations. Did any of these "experts" have a known genuine band for comparison purposes to your band?

I think it's a matter of wishing/wanting it to be authentic.

To me that bracelt is still fake no matter if 20 people looked at it.

[RolexSA]

Originally Posted by MonBK

I think it's a matter of wishing/wanting it to be authentic.

To me that bracelt is still fake no matter if 20 people looked at it.

Luckily the clasp scroll work comes in relief .... Similar to reading in Braille .

[MonBK]

Originally Posted by RolexSA

Luckily the clasp scroll work comes in relief .... Similar to reading in Braille .

Would be hard to read this one.

[Mitcho28]

Originally Posted by U5512

...if it has been polished to death like the appraisers said it will be so SHINY AND SMOOTH!!!

Not exactly correct, after cleaning and polishing the grain can be re-applied with a scouring pad. In fact the scroll work seems to support that. The higher more defined edges seem to have been polished down, leaving only the lowest valleys of the scroll work. To me this adds more credence to the G being polished off also, then the whole clasp scoured to return the finish to on original look. Seems like the story of it being polished down sounds reasonable.

[crowncollection]

Holy thread resurrection. The band was fake for many reasons other than the scroll work and the g I checked it out in detail

[ironmanmarcus]

Originally Posted by crowncollection

Holy thread resurrection. The band was fake for many reasons other than the scroll work and the g I checked it out in detail

WOW fair dinkum??
I just read this whole old thread and was convinced it was real!!

[crowncollection]

Originally Posted by ironmanmarcus

WOW fair dinkum??
I just read this whole old thread and was convinced it was real!!

president bracelets are the hardest to tell, you can read my thread in the reference section authenticating gold parts, i did not reveal all my knowledge, the band is fake, end of story for reasons other than the missing G and scrollwrok, trust me there are 5 other checks that it failed.

[saaduk]

Hi. Please post a link to the thread regarding checking out diff betw fake and authentic bands as I am not able to find it.

Thank you.

Originally Posted by crowncollection

president bracelets are the hardest to tell, you can read my thread in the reference section authenticating gold parts, i did not reveal all my knowledge, the band is fake, end of story for reasons other than the missing G and scrollwrok, trust me there are 5 other checks that it failed.

Originally Posted by crowncollection

president bracelets are the hardest to tell, you can read my thread in the reference section authenticating gold parts, i did not reveal all my knowledge, the band is fake, end of story for reasons other than the missing G and scrollwrok, trust me there are 5 other checks that it failed.

[crowncollection]

Originally Posted by saaduk

Hi. Please post a link to the thread regarding checking out diff betw fake and authentic bands as I am not able to find it.

Thank you.

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=265249

[RRsDJ]

Forgot all about this thread. Few updates. I decided to keep my DJ and I finally got around to taking it to my Rolex AD sometime last year.

I had them polish the bracelet and authenticate it. They confirmed it is indeed an authentic Rolex 18K Presidential bracelet and I have that in writing on official letterhead. If I can make it to my bank's safety deposit box next week I'll upload a copy for all to see especially crowncollection but I'm sure he'll still say it's fake to save face.

Originally Posted by crowncollection

The band was fake for many reasons other than the scroll work and the g I checked it out in detail

You checked it out in detail through pics. You have never personally held or looked at my bracelet in person with your own eyes / loupe.

Originally Posted by crowncollection

president bracelets are the hardest to tell, you can read my thread in the reference section authenticating gold parts, i did not reveal all my knowledge, the band is fake, end of story for reasons other than the missing G and scrollwrok, trust me there are 5 other checks that it failed.

A Rolex AD has said otherwise. This is a prime example of believe half of what you see and nothing what you hear or read.




My DJ says hello to all....

[crowncollection]

Originally Posted by RRsDJ

Forgot all about this thread. Few updates. I decided to keep my DJ and I finally got around to taking it to my Rolex AD sometime last year.



I had them polish the bracelet and authenticate it. They confirmed it is indeed an authentic Rolex 18K Presidential bracelet and I have that in writing on official letterhead. If I can make it to my bank's safety deposit box next week I'll upload a copy for all to see especially crowncollection but I'm sure he'll still say it's fake to save face.









You checked it out in detail through pics. You have never personally held or looked at my bracelet in person with your own eyes / loupe.









A Rolex AD has said otherwise. This is a prime example of believe half of what you see and nothing what you hear or read.









My DJ says hello to all....

AD knows stuff all, you believe what you want my friend they know far less than me, ad is not Rolex and your band is fake based on the gold link you showed me . I love how these guys get free advice and try to discredit people later, very appreciative mate. Ad opinion means nothing to me, m they know shit all, seen them get it wrong a hundred times, they sell new watches, you seem determine to discredit me when I tried to help you, this is your third bump of this thread and I still see no letter from Rolex until I do it's fake. As I stated can only judge the link you showed us, if that is judged real I will eat my hat as they say. I doubt you will tell us if Rolex tell you it has some fake links anyway, and that's what you showed us, that does not suit your agenda, so this discussion is over and I will not divulge how I know on a open forum. I say again I judged it on the link you showed and that was undoubtably fake

[mjm800]

Originally Posted by crowncollection

this is your third bump of this thread and I still see no letter from Rolex until I do it's fake.

The proof is in the pudding. Send the watch to an RSC if they give it then you're good anything less then an RSC seal of approval then it is suspect.

[crowncollection]

If we want to get technical the watch should have a jubilee the band it does not even go with that watch. Ad this and that crap, 1 year and he does not have the balls to take it to Rolex. Still making bold statements with no proof at all.