SubC running fast after only 40 minutes

[samuel019]

Quick question everyone. The question is basically the thread title. At any rate I keep three of my four in constant rotation and when not wearing one of the three it stays on a winder. My other one is kept in a drawer of the winder for safe keeping and to keep as close to mint as possible. The three are my 214270, 216570, and the 114060. The SubC is the one Im referring to. I havent worn it it probably 6 days but its been on the winder. So today I pull it out to give a few manual winds even though its on the winder as Ive read its good to wind your Rolex every week or so even if its worn everyday. Granted I havent been but Im sure the winder takes the place of my wearing it everyday. So on to the question. I set it today per time.gov at 11 35 am to the second and now at 12 24 pm it is already 10 seconds fast. Any cause to be alarmed? The watch is maybe 2 months old and is a Random Serial 114060. Sorry guys for dragging out such a long post for a simple question.....

[tifosi]

Is this the first time you timed it? Sounds odd to be 10 sec off that quickly..

[samuel019]

Originally Posted by tifosi

Is this the first time you timed it? Sounds odd to be 10 sec off that quickly..

Nope Ive timed it before over the last few months and always something with COSC standards. Mainly always running a little fast but NEVER this fast. Im wondering if the manual winding had something to do with it because as I stated I only did a few manual turns because when I was doing it I could tell the main spring was a little tight already. I did maybe 6-9 turns. I Probably shouldve done NONE being it was on a winder 24/7 for 6-7 days. Should I let it wind down and keep that winding station off and try again in a few days??

[Gator08]

Your time interval is much too small. COSC standards are an average over a much longer time

[handsfull]

It sounds magnetized. That's about the typical rate of acceleration for a magnetized movement.

[samuel019]

Originally Posted by Gator08

Your time interval is much too small. COSC standards are an average over a much longer time

Your so right! I forgot all about that. I tell you what, out of all 4 of my watches the 214270 G Serial is the most accurate. That one is deadly accurate. Then the 216570 and lastly the 114060. My other one I couldnt say because I havent worn it in over 6 months but if I remember correctly it was also a little fast.

[samuel019]

Originally Posted by handsfull

It sounds magnetized. That's about the typical rate of acceleration for a magnetized movement.

Okay. Who can demagnetize it. Would I have to send it to RSC or can my A D do it? Is it pretty simple to do and how long?

[77T]

Your AD or an indie certified watchmaker is an option...

[samuel019]

Originally Posted by Gator08

Your time interval is much too small. COSC standards are an average over a much longer time

Guys thank you so much for your concerns but I think Gator08 nailed it. I have time.gov still open as one of my many pages at work and now I swear to you its now ONLY about 4 SECONDS fast. Wow! How stupid do I feel now. I actually watched 2 mins go by comparing the SubC to the website to make sure I wasnt wrong and Im not. Im guessing over the next 12 hours it might even get better. Thanks again Gator08 and everyone. Have a great day. Now its time to leave the office a do some Christmas shopping....

[padi56]

Originally Posted by handsfull

It sounds magnetized. That's about the typical rate of acceleration for a magnetized movement.

Well if you believe the Rolex marketing getting a magnetised hairspring thats near impossible with the parachrom hairspring and would most seriously doubt if his watch is magnetised in any way.And IMHO to the original poster I would say its a error on your part.And a winder will not fully wind a watch and always fully manual wind around 40 full crown turns clockwise before putting on a winder.A winder will just keep the watch running myself just cannot see any point in winders on any watch especially one with just a date.And to test any watch for accuracy it must be done over at least 5 days.First fully wind watch 40 full crown turns clockwise only.Then sync your watch with a reliable time source for this test any quartz watch will do.Once you have sync time wear you watch as normal but for 8 hours plus a day.Check time daily with same setting source over 5 complete days and nights then average the loss or gain over those 5 days for a accurate result.

[handsfull]

Originally Posted by padi56

Well if you believe the Rolex marketing getting a magnetised hairspring thats near impossible with the parachrom hairspring and would most seriously doubt if his watch is magnetised in any way.

You nailed it Padi. Good work.

To answer: no, I don't believe marketers/marketing. I like good old fashioned science myself. I had a watch that was apparently exposed to some errant flux and was running 10-12 seconds fast per 12 hour period that I had demag'd. That said, this situation (provided his information was accurate, which it was not) seemed similar if not identical.

[samuel019]

Originally Posted by handsfull

You nailed it Padi. Good work.

To answer: no, I don't believe marketers/marketing. I like good old fashioned science myself. I had a watch that was apparently exposed to some errant flux and was running 10-12 seconds fast per 12 hour period that I had demag'd. That said, this situation (provided his information was accurate, which it was not) seemed similar if not identical.

Jeff not quite sure what you meant by inaccurate info. I wrote exactly what happened to the letter. Just cked it now and its still running about 3-4 seconds fast which is a whole lot better then plus 10. It was plus 10 for about the first 40 mins. Cked it numerous times before posting the thread as I was hesitant to do so for such a trivial matter. Also thanks Peter for the info. I know you are anti winders and stickers Which I respect. We all dont tend to agree here on TRF but we all seem to help one another which is another reason why I love this place.

[cht]

Originally Posted by handsfull

You nailed it Padi. Good work.

To answer: no, I don't believe marketers/marketing. I like good old fashioned science myself. I had a watch that was apparently exposed to some errant flux and was running 10-12 seconds fast per 12 hour period that I had demag'd. That said, this situation (provided his information was accurate, which it was not) seemed similar if not identical.

Ummm, did that watch have a parachrom spring?

Why don't you take a read, this is pretty good info.

http://people.timezone.com/library/extras/200708222443

[dsio]

Originally Posted by handsfull

You nailed it Padi. Good work.

To answer: no, I don't believe marketers/marketing. I like good old fashioned science myself. I had a watch that was apparently exposed to some errant flux and was running 10-12 seconds fast per 12 hour period that I had demag'd. That said, this situation (provided his information was accurate, which it was not) seemed similar if not identical.

If a watch gets magnetised, you'll notice more than 10-12s. I've never had it happen myself, even went to the trouble of posting photos of my 1680 sub with its lowly Nivarox hairspring sitting on top of large speakers, a computer, and perched on top of the magnet at the back of a 10" speaker cone when someone was talking nonsense about keeping watches away from speakers and computers a while back. Made no difference at all, some people must be walking into X-Men from time to time.

[More Deneiro]

Make sure you have healthy connection to the internet to be consistent and use this:
http://tycho.usno.navy.mil/simpletime.html

It's fast loading, I quite sure it's pretty accurate. Hope this helps.

[padi56]

Originally Posted by samuel019

Jeff not quite sure what you meant by inaccurate info. I wrote exactly what happened to the letter. Just cked it now and its still running about 3-4 seconds fast which is a whole lot better then plus 10. It was plus 10 for about the first 40 mins. Cked it numerous times before posting the thread as I was hesitant to do so for such a trivial matter. Also thanks Peter for the info. I know you are anti winders and stickers Which I respect. We all dont tend to agree here on TRF but we all seem to help one another which is another reason why I love this place.

No I am not anti-winder its simply they are not needed with any watch that has only a date compication or no date at all.Just cannot see any point of putting wear on any movement, if its not needed to tell the time on the best winder in the world, and what Rolex watches were designed for wearing on the wrist.Now stickers thats a different story they are best just thrown away at point of sale.

[padi56]

Originally Posted by dsio

If a watch gets magnetised, you'll notice more than 10-12s. I've never had it happen myself, even went to the trouble of posting photos of my 1680 sub with its lowly Nivarox hairspring sitting on top of large speakers, a computer, and perched on top of the magnet at the back of a 10" speaker cone when someone was talking nonsense about keeping watches away from speakers and computers a while back. Made no difference at all, some people must be walking into X-Men from time to time.

There is nothing lowly about Nivarox hairsprings I can assure you, they have powered most of the Swiss watch industry watches for decades, most high end brands included.Nivarox is the name for the metal used much like Rolex calls theres parachrom.And there is nothing magical about both they are just Bréguet overcoil style hairsprings.And when adjusted correctly I would seriously doubt in the real world would the wearer find any real difference between Nivarox or parachrom in the watches case.

While in the Rolex marketing video it states the Parachrom is 10 time more shockproof, but what they don't state is to what.Most cetainly not the Nivarox ones that they and most of the watch industry have used for the past 40 odd years.And with magnetic test where they hold a powerful magnet over a open case on a watch.So if you don't wear your watch dial down with the case back off with a powerful magnet near any hairspring.Then I would doubt in the real world that it would make little or no difference whatever the name of hairspring in the case. Today they sometimes quote watch is magnetiesd but in most cases all the watch needs is simple regulation.And if and its a big if any watches hairspring or other part gets magnetised its very very simple to De-magnetise.

Now Nivarox thats the name of the alloy much like Rolex calls there Parachrom.Today it is used mainly in the watch/clock industry, but also in other micro-machine industries and in certain types of medical equipment and high presicion surgical instruments. There are several variations of the Nivarox alloy depending upon the intended application. These alloys are stainless steel alloys with high concentrations of Cobalt (42-48%), Nickel (15-25%) and Chromium (16-22%). There are also small amounts of titanium and beryllium. Hairsprings made of this alloy are highly wear-resistant,and they are practically non-magnetic in normal wearing,and non-rusting and possess a low coefficient of thermal expansion.

Nivarox 1 through 5 is a series of grades of hairsprings with number 1 being the best quality. The most commonly encountered Nivarox hairsprings in the watch industry are grades 1 to 3. The alloy is unaffected by heat and normal every day ordinary magnetic fields. There is however, also the Anachron hairspring which is said to be of even higher quality than the Nivarox No 1 grade.Who knows perhaps that the grade that Rolex used over the past 40 odd years.


Fact research specs from Nivarox Far.

[handsfull]

Originally Posted by samuel019

Jeff not quite sure what you meant by inaccurate info.

Stating your watch was running 10 seconds fast after 40 minutes. Watches don't speed up and slow down drastically without mechanical issues.

Originally Posted by cht

Ummm, did that watch have a parachrom spring?

No, it was a Grand Seiko....8L35

Originally Posted by dsio

If a watch gets magnetised, you'll notice more than 10-12s. I've never had it happen myself....

I've had two watches demagnetized. One ran about 10 seconds fast per hour, the other 1 minute per hour. It all depends on exactly which part or parts are magnetized within the watch.....there is no true "standard" rate of acceleration for a mag'd watch movement, it's unpredictable.

Respectfully, as much as I love the Rolex brand, the parachrom hairspring is made of metal and therefore is subject to magnetism. Remember, other parts in a watch movement can have magnetism introduced into individual components thus creating erratic timekeeping.

[al_bongo]

In normal day to day life where are people experiencing magnetic fields powerful enough to magnetise watches?

[kxux]

Originally Posted by al_bongo

In normal day to day life where are people experiencing magnetic fields powerful enough to magnetise watches?

Fridge doors magnet, some women's purses use strong magnet to close them. Just few places I try to be careful around.

[dsio]

Originally Posted by kxux

Fridge doors magnet, some women's purses use strong magnet to close them. Just few places I try to be careful around.

Seriously neither of those are even remotely in the ballpark