Oyster Perpetual 28mm - chances of getting?

[Novartis]

Posted to wrong forum - not sure how to move. Reposting here but would be grateful if moderators could delete the other!

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Hello, I'm new here. It's a special event next year (14 months away) and I would like to get a Rolex. I am female, small of build and work in a very non-flashy profession. I'm not a luxury buyer in general. I like well-made, unfussy things that are built to last a lifetime.

I am drawn to the Oyster Perpetual 28mm as the simplest, smallest, and yes, cheapest Rolex - though even if it wasn't, there is something very pleasing and pure about how plain it is (IMO). I'm not fussed about the dial colour, I like them all.

I approached a local AD. They were nice but immediately told me I wouldn't get an OP, even 28mm, as they are far too popular. They advised I could get a Lady Datejust within the timeframe and put me down for one.

But, I don't really want a Lady Datejust, I want an OP. And I don't want to spend £1200 more on a watch I don't like as much They suggested that they prioritise existing customers "or those who intend to become customers" - is that a veiled way of telling me I need to buy other stuff to have a chance of being offered an OP? I know it happens for the high-demand watches, but I guess I wasn't expecting all that business for a little ladies size basic Rolex.

I then wandered into Goldsmiths at the Trafford Centre on the off chance. They were much more straightforward, said it should be fine to get an OP 28mm within 14 months, sat me down and registered my details and preferences, let me try some on and take photos, and told me they'd be in touch when they had a delivery that matched. Generally it was all a lot more like my usual experience of buying things in shops.

Now I'm confused as to who is right and whether I'm likely to get this watch. I don't want to spend a year hoping and it never happen. Hence... this post.

TL;DR - how likely is it to get an OP 28mm as a brand new customer in the UK within the next year?

[Novartis]

Hopeful bump!

[Lew Archer]

Hello from across the pond. Hopefully, some our fellow members in the U.K. will chime in with their experience at authorized dealers. However, I'm not surprised you've gotten different responses from different ADs--as different dealers may have different circumstances or experiences working with Rolex.

And, individual sales associates may also be speaking from their personal experience, which may vary.

It does sound like the first dealer was hinting you would increase your chances by establishing yourself as a regular customer. Given the demand for Rolex in the last couple of years, from an ADs point of view, if they have limited stock, it is good business to favor regular customers, rather than offer the watch to a person they'll never see again. They'd prefer you to be a client, who'll come back again and again, for "all your jewelry needs".

Personally, I would not buy stuff just to establish such a relationship. If it happens they have something you genuinely like, for yourself or as a gift, fine, but I'm not going to randomly buy things just to curry favor. It sounds like you are not inclined to do that either.

The other dealer sounded reasonably optimistic that they could come through within fourteen months. So, stay in touch with them--as with all human interactions, taking the time to develop a friendly rapport is helpful.

The demand for Rolex has been unprecedented in the last couple of years. Initially, certain models, like the Daytona were hard to get...but gradually, everything became hard to get. I recently visited a Rolex boutique (run by an AD, not Rolex) in Los Angeles. They had only display models. Last year, when I visited this same boutique, they had a few watches available for sale. Not now.

However, the only constant is change. I would not assume things will stay just as they are. Demand may slow, production may increase, etc. None of us have a clue what the market will look like six months or a year from now.

So, just keep doing what you're doing...contacting dealers and letting them know what you're after. I'm a proponent of being candid and straightforward.

Now, let's talk about the OP for a second. I think it's a lovely choice. In fact, eight years ago, I decided to buy an OP for my daughter. She was seven at the time! My plan was to buy the watch, and eventually give it to her, perhaps after she graduates from university. I looked at the 28mm, but ultimately went with the 31mm.

The sales associate and I worked out a little scheme to get my daughter's input. We stopped into the shop one Saturday afternoon, a seemingly casual visit, just to say hello to the sales associate, who has known us a few years. The sales associate asked my seven year daughter for her opinion...she told my daughter that she had a client who was torn between two watches.

She showed my daughter the OP in 28mm and 31mm. Both were otherwise identical, a silver dial with pink markers (they don't make that one anymore). My daughter weighed both watches in her hand, thought for a moment, then said, "this one"--holding up the 31mm. Then she said, "the other one looks like an old lady's watch."

I have no idea how she got that idea, but...that was her reaction.

Obviously, you should get what you like, what suits your taste, style, and so on. However, I would suggest you take another look at the 31mm. And, if it's acceptable, let the sales associate you're working with know that a 31mm would also work. I don't know what the demand is for the 31mm, but if you're open to either 28mm or 31mm in any dial color, I reckon you'd increase the odds that something fitting the bill will turn up at one of the shops you're dealing with, sooner or later.

My daughter is 15 and recently told me she doesn't like watches. She has no idea that she is already the owner of a 31mm OP, tucked away for the future. Hopefully, she'll take a different view of watches when I finally give it to her.

Anyway, sorry to ramble on, but best of luck to you, and welcome to the forum.

[Parapraxis]

The OP, even at 28mm and in any color, is a very high demand watch. No doubt it will be given to previous customers. However, there will be times when they pass or are unreachable. So there still does exist a chance you could get a call for one within 14 months. The best bet is to go to every AD you can and put your name down. The black, silver and blue dials should be easier to get. I think within 14mo, you could get one.

The alternative is go grey market. Especially with assets pulling back right now due to the state of the world, you might be able to get a 28mm black/silver/blue OP at or only slightly above retail from a second hand dealer.

Good luck

[Old Expat Beast]

At that size I'd seriously consider Cartier.

[amh]

Everyone else is thinking like that as well, hence the popularity. "I just want to get my foot in the door." The OP is a great watch for sure.

Just my opinion, but that extra $1200 for a Datejust is worth it:
- You get a date!
- Large selection of dials, bezels, metals

I'd at least let these dealers know you'd be open to it - if you stick with stainless then it's not really all that different than the OP yet is one step up in the Rolex catalog.

[gnardex]

Hi Novartis,

I had three totally different experiences with three different ADs.
I will tell you my story.
I wanted to buy an important present for an important goal that my son reached in his life.

The AD in my city, similar to your first, told me
that he reserved his watches to the people of his club (club???).
You can clearly imagine the activities of his club: sell jewelry
to the affiliates of the club.

The second was in the city where I work. Big dealer (the other was pretty small).
Very professional but not very much empathetic. Quite cold.
He told me to wait 12 months for the watch I wanted to buy.
They would have called me.
It was not a very hot reference, but certainly hotter than a OP28.

The third AD was an angel. An AD in the city close to the place where my son lives.
I explained her well the situation (that was quite peculiar).
She was very very kind and sympathetic. I feel ashamed to confess how much time I had to wait for the watch. Hard to believe. One day. Certainly it was a lucky coincidence that a customer was not interested in the watch anymore, and by chance she had one in store. But she decided to give it to me. For sure she had many other clients waiting in some list for that watch.

Incidentally, the second AD after one year phoned me asking if I was still interested in the watch (I though to be not in the list... too cold, it seemed to me that he was not even listening to me). I thought it was a sign of the destiny: I bought the watch and now me and my son have the same watch, and every time I look at it, I think to him.

The moral is:

1) AD are VERY VERY different. If you can, try another one. Tell him/her your story.
Your story is simple, and it was so nice and kind the way you told, that I am sure that you will find your watch. This is how things "should" go.

2) Even if you don't have the lucky I had and even if you don't find an angel, I would trust serious dealers, and as far as I understand your second dealer is quite famous and trusted.
I would be tempted to think that you ARE in a list. In any case, wait a bit and go back to him asking if you can rely that, soon or later, you will get your watch, It is your right to know. Clearly you cannot know when, and you cannot push them, but at least to know if you soon or later you will get it, this is your right.

3) Listen the wise words of Lew Archer: 28OP is for older people... buy a little bigger! At least... promise you will think about it!!

Good luck!
ciao!
g

[VacherObsessive]

The market is on a bit of a dip in the UK at the moment and April is always quiet - go to a good grey (like NBQ watches if in london) and I believe you will be able to push for a good deal below whatever they are listing it at, as I believe these ladies pieces will be the first to drop as the markets soften

14 month wait for a 28mm OP is absolutely bonkers. Go grey

[S.Explorer]

I bought an OP31 from WOS Group (of which Goldsmiths are part of) after several months on the list, no previous spend. Therefore, in your situation, I'd be patient and follow-up periodically rather than feed the flipper market.

[Novartis]

Thank you so much all - I really appreciate everyone's input and the kind welcome!

Lew Archer - that's very helpful context, and also, what a lovely story about your daughter. She is very lucky! I wish my father had thought to buy me an OP aged 7... I will definitely have a look at 31mm in person. Though as my wrists are so small a 28mm looks like a 31 or even larger.

Parapraxis - that's useful to know. I'd rather manage my expectations than be disappointed. I really like the blue dial so would be totally happy with that, and would take a silver or black too.

Old Expat Beast - Cartier is actually my back-up if no Rolex materialises in 14 months! Hopefully I will still be able to buy those over the counter at any time. But I am drawn to a mechanical watch.

amh - thank you. I actually preferred a Datejust when looking online but when I went to try on, I really preferred the OP. I loved the uncluttered, simple dial. if they were the same price I probably wouldn't care but it sticks in my craw to spend more for something I like less, if you see what I mean! But... will keep an open mind :)

gnardex - thank you for taking the time to tell your story - that's really interesting (and so lovely that you and your son have the same watch). It seems there is a huge amount of variation between ADs. I will try some others and see what happens.

VacherObsessive that's interesting and gives me hope that the ladies watches are the first to drop as markets soften (and that they may be softening). It's not a problem to wait 14 months as I don't actually need it until then (and am determined not to wear it before my 40th!)

S. Explorer that's great to hear and gives me hope! How did you follow up with the WoS dealer? I get the concept for a small local AD with a single point of contact, but not sure how to do for a big place like Goldsmiths as I've every enquiry seems to be answered by someone different.

I'm not keen on grey market as I just wouldn't know the difference between a trustworthy reseller and one that wasn't. I don't want to risk it. I might if there was a significant saving to be had, but given that it's the opposite, I'm not keen! I know this means I may end up without but so be it.

Thank you again for the help, you're a lovely bunch on here

[S.Explorer]

Originally Posted by Novartis

S. Explorer that's great to hear and gives me hope! How did you follow up with the WoS dealer? I get the concept for a small local AD with a single point of contact, but not sure how to do for a big place like Goldsmiths as I've every enquiry seems to be answered by someone different.

I'd periodically drop in to the store when passing by and would only deal with the sales person who initially noted my wishlist, just asking for a quick chat / update. Remind the sales person who you are / what you are looking for, and try to build up a rapport.

If you make an email enquiry, address it to that same sales person even if it's a generic store mailbox.

There is a balance to be struck in terms of frequency.

Good luck!

[Donkos]

Welcome to Forum

[Lew Archer]

Novartis,

Very thoughtful of you to respond to all of our posts.

I think you should heed your reservations about going grey, at least at this point.

When I first joined the forum, people went the “grey” route to secure discounts in price, which were elusive at ADs.

I was hesitant about this and so, mostly out of caution, stuck with ADs. I was paying a premium (full retail price) for certainly, warranty (which didn’t follow the watch then) and the ability to try on the watch in person. The upside of this was that I tended to work with the same AD as my watch interest evolved. And, today, I’m fortunate to have those relationships established.

Over the years, the situation reversed…and grey dealers charge a premium to offer a discount in acquisition time.

While the premium may be less on the OP you’ll buy, it’s still, for the time being, more than retail price.

In your case, you’re not in a hurry. You’re looking at a fourteen month timeframe. So, why pay extra to secure the watch now?

Others may have reasons to cut to the chase. Perhaps they’re getting a gift for a fast approaching anniversary. Or, the watch they’re after is in particularly strong demand and the wait may be measured in years, with no guarantee of the watch ever materializing. If so, and they’re willing and able, then the grey route makes sense.

In your case, I think you’re wise to pursue the watch via AD. The grey option remains available. In fourteen months, if you’ve had no luck, you can re-consider.

The market has been rising so rapidly that a reasonable fear existed that if one waits, one will only pay more. But, this is a moment in time where there’s economic uncertainty looming and numerous threads here report a slowing down, maybe a flattening, or even a drop. Too soon to tell if it’s just a “correction” or the beginning of a crash.

So, all the more reason to bide your time. You can monitor the situation and adjust your strategy if need be.

On the 28mm vs. 31mm question, your opinion is the one that counts. Keep in mind our eyes tend to adjust to what we’re used to. I’d guess the 31 will fit you, but have a slightly larger presence then you’re used to seeing on your wrist.

Fit is a bit of a misnomer. It’s the bracelet or strap that must fit your wrist, like the waist of your jeans. The size of the case, unless it looks minuscule or, at the other extreme, appears so large the watch is wearing you, rather than the other way around, is more a matter of style.

I liken it to men’s suits. I’ll buy a suit in my size, but may select a jacket with wide, medium or narrow lapels. Likewise, the cut may very—compare 1940s suits to those from the 1960s. So, suit in my size with such variations will wear very differently, yet still “fit”, that is, be in my size.

Or take blue jeans. The style, the cut, may be baggy or skintight, the rise may be high or low, often according to changes in fashion.

In the end, you get what fits, of course, and choose the style you like best, at least for the moment. Styles change and so do our tastes.

A long winded way of saying this is more subjective than objective. And, what looks “right” is often what we’re most accustomed to seeing. So, a guy who is used to wearing an Omega Speedmaster Professional might think “the Rolex Explorer is too small!”, or vice versa. Often, either watch is neither too small nor too large, neither minuscule or huge, but the wearer first looks at the watch through the filter of past experience.

So, you may have more range here than you realize. When you try it on, this is a good issue to discuss with the sales associate. They may be more objective. For starters, they’re looking at you from another person’s vantage and perspective.

Of course, they may also want to make the sale, but I’ve found good sales people would rather steer you to what’s really right for you.

I was considering a Rolex DJ, two tone. One contender was yellow gold, and 41mm. The other was 36mm, rose gold. I thought I could get away with the 41, but leaned to the 36. The sales associate, a very stylish chap, said, “you can do the 41, but the 36 is perfect.” And, he added the rose gold was better for my skin tone. The 36mm was less expensive.

I wound up with the 36, and appreciated that input. That’s another advantage of working with a good sales person at an AD.

Cartier is great back up, as you said, and they do have mechanical watches in a range of sizes, of course.

I’m a fan of Omega, too, and think the Aqua Terra in 34mm is another great choice for a lady. Check one out, just for the hell of it. You have time!

But, if you really want a Rolex, hold out for that. Once again, good luck. Go with the one that really resonates with you.

[Novartis]

Thank you Lew Archer - that is very wise advice - I think that will be my approach. Wait, look around, and see what happens. If it's meant to be it will happen.

I've contacted another local AD so we'll see what their response is.

I understand what you're saying about the look of a size rather than physical fit. I've worn a 24mm Tissot for 14 years so my eyes are accustomed to it. I suppose it's a bit old fashioned! I do have freakish small bones though - here's some photos I took of the 28mm OP on me. I'd welcome thoughts of how it looks to others.

[Starhutch]

Looks great. Personally for your wrist 28 or 31 mm is probably ideal. My wife loves her 31mm datejust. Perfect size for her

[BlueLight]

The 28mm looks fab. I would trust the ad to deliver rather than go grey as they have set a realistic timescale and managed your expectations. Pop in every now and again just to remind them and don’t forget to post a picture when you eventually ‘get the call’ !

[Lew Archer]

Originally Posted by Novartis

Thank you Lew Archer - that is very wise advice - I think that will be my approach. Wait, look around, and see what happens. If it's meant to be it will happen.

I've contacted another local AD so we'll see what their response is.

I understand what you're saying about the look of a size rather than physical fit. I've worn a 24mm Tissot for 14 years so my eyes are accustomed to it. I suppose it's a bit old fashioned! I do have freakish small bones though - here's some photos I took of the 28mm OP on me. I'd welcome thoughts of how it looks to others.

The 28mm does, indeed, look like it was designed by Rolex for you! And, nothing old fashioned about it. Elegant, timeless. That's a lovely dial color, too.

One other thing I've noted, regarding "wrist shots"...the watches often appear a bit larger than they actually are. There's probably a technical explanation, that someone knowledgeable about photography could provide, but I've noticed that in photos smaller sized watches, like a 36mm Explorer look better proportioned for me than the larger ones, like a 40mm Submariner. Yet, when I look at the watches on my wrist, the difference between the two isn't as pronounced as it appears in the photo. It's also helpful to step back from a mirror and see the watch on you from a bit of a distance.

All that aside, I don't think you can go wrong with the 28. The 31 may work for you, too. Or, it may fit, just, but just be a bit too much "watch presence" for your tastes.

The numbers don't tell the whole story. Subtle changes in chase design can change the look...for example, a 36mm Explorer (current production) is, in some respects, smaller than a 36mm OP...and does look a bit smaller on the wrist. So, diameter is just one measurement. It's all about the proportions...the dial layout, the way the lugs taper, the bracelet design, width, etc. All the more reason to observe the watches in person. At least some Rolex ADs have exhibition watches...which are worth checking out. But, that 28 looks fabulous on you!

[Novartis]

Thank you both! I do actually really like the dial colour, which was totally unexpected, as I hate pink. I went in saying "any dial colour apart from pink". But the only model they had to try on was pink, and suddenly... it's my top choice It's sorcery I tell you.

[Lew Archer]

Originally Posted by Novartis

Thank you both! I do actually really like the dial colour, which was totally unexpected, as I hate pink. I went in saying "any dial colour apart from pink". But the only model they had to try on was pink, and suddenly... it's my top choice It's sorcery I tell you.

Yes, you just never know till you see the watch in hand. And, with dials, in different light. That's something you'll enjoy...as you wear the watch, it will take on somewhat different looks, depending on the lighting...

[Deepseadog]

My wife has very slender wrists and her 28mm DJ is perfect on her. Sometimes it's about understated elegance, not the largest watch you can manage. I would stick to your guns and get the 28mm.

[gnardex]

That watch looks great on you.
Novartis, remember of us and let us know wehenever you'll get it
(you will, I know)
g

[winst]

Camera isn’t lying on that picture - that size looks perfect for you. I reckon 28mm should be easier to get than 31mm as well - Good Luck!

[Vesper Lynd]

Originally Posted by Novartis

Thank you Lew Archer - that is very wise advice - I think that will be my approach. Wait, look around, and see what happens. If it's meant to be it will happen.

I've contacted another local AD so we'll see what their response is.

I understand what you're saying about the look of a size rather than physical fit. I've worn a 24mm Tissot for 14 years so my eyes are accustomed to it. I suppose it's a bit old fashioned! I do have freakish small bones though - here's some photos I took of the 28mm OP on me. I'd welcome thoughts of how it looks to others.

28 mm looks good on your wrist. I think 31mm would be excessive.

[Number3]

That looks absolutely perfect on you, it’s a chunky little piece of understated elegance! I would call a few of the ADs near you (DMR, Prestons in Wilmslow, Whittles in Preston, Lister Horsfall in Halifax, HL Brown in Sheffield etc.) and speak to them as the 28mm OP will not be one of the ones they get constantly pestered for.

Good luck!

[Novartis]

Thank you Starhutch, BlueLight, Lew Archer, Deepseadog, gnardex, winst, Vesper Lynd and Number3 for the opinions on the watch size and colour! It's greatly appreciated.

So, some positive news. I tried Prestons in Wilmslow on your suggestion Number3 (it's the only other non-WoS within 30 mins) and they were fantastic. Very straightforward, helpful and down to earth. The salesperson told me she was confident she would be able to get me one but it may take 12-18 months. She could not guarantee she could get it in time for my birthday, but she felt she probably could, and if not it would be within a few months. She spent a lot of time talking to me about the watch and the practicalities of owning it (how to wear, how to wind, servicing intervals etc) and checking how to contact me once it was in (what time of day around my working pattern etc), which gave me a good feeling that it was going to really happen!

There was no pressure to buy anything else, unlike DMR. She said that the OP is a popular line but the 28mm the least so, hence the most realistic prospect, which fit with what I thought.

They had a blue dial 28mm to try on, and I was surprised by how much I loved it! I think even more than the pink. The depth of colour is just beautiful. The only thing that worries me is whether it looks too masculine, like I'm wearing my dad's watch if you see what I mean

[gnardex]

Hi Novartis!
I'm happy to hear good news from you!

These pictures confirm the size: definitely 28!
Concerning colors, I can bet, ANY of the 4 colors in which come the OP
will find you enthusiastic. The reason: the most "dangerous" color to wear
is the pink..., but it fitted in your arm very very well on you!
So you can be confident that ANY color will be fantastic!
Believe me: you cannot go wrong!

ciao!
g

[Wahlberg]

Both pink and blue look amazing on you.

Kinda crazy how they say 12-18 months, I hope you'll get it sooner.

[amh]

Those OP 28 models look very good on you OP. Don't worry about it being 'masculine', it's a very dainty little watch!

[gnardex]

Forgot to tell you:
1) remember to pass and say hello from time to time, just to chat, if you can
2) I don't know in UK, but in Italy the time they give you is a kind of upper bound.
If they say 12 to 14 months I would not be surprised that in less than a year you get it.
Any dealer want happy clients. If you say 6 months and then it comes after a little less than a year, the client is very unsatisfied, the double the time.... If you say 14 months and it arrive in less than a year you are very satisfied. Same time, but totally different mood.

ciao!
g

[vahu]

The 28 looks great on you, perfect size. With that size it's very feminine regardless of the dial color.