Why I Love my Gray Dealer

[PleaseStandBack]

So happy today, was able to snag a NOS 2019 116610 Sub Date at a reasonable price from my favorite Gray Dealer! I've been thinking and here are some reasons why I like Gray vs ADs (aside from the obvious ones):

1. They are happy to help when I ask for a SS piece instead of looking sideways at me (OK not actual eye contact, but the quick response I get translates to "happy to help" in my book).
2. Some have a don't ask don't tell policy about paying out of state tax.
3. I can choose from multiple model years and pay adjusted prices accordingly (like the NOS piece I just got).
4. I don't have to guess what my collection will look like in the months or years from now when I get a piece from an AD (i.e. if I'll still want it).
5. I don't feel the push to buy s**t I don't want to increase my "purchase history."

Anyway, just excited to get my sub that no AD in their right mind would likely ever get me and thought I'd see if others have similar thoughts.

[TswaneNguni]

great

[Goin2drt]

When you are over paying for anything of course you get excellent service and selection and they are glad to take your money. They price things high enough that the demand is just enough to get a buyer. When you are an ad and have to sell at MSRP of a product that commands well over then why would you think anything else but the reasons you stated. Common sense.

[Hollie_Rollie]

Originally Posted by Goin2drt

When you are over paying for anything of course you get excellent service and selection and they are glad to take your money. They price things high enough that the demand is just enough to get a buyer. When you are an ad and have to sell at MSRP of a product that commands well over then why would you think anything else but the reasons you stated. Common sense.

Exactly

[PleaseStandBack]

Originally Posted by Goin2drt

When you are over paying for anything of course you get excellent service and selection and they are glad to take your money. They price things high enough that the demand is just enough to get a buyer. When you are an ad and have to sell at MSRP of a product that commands well over then why would you think anything else but the reasons you stated. Common sense.

It's not really common sense for me. It's taken over a year to figure out how uncomfortable I'd feel and unrequited my requests with ADs would be no matter what they seemed to promise without actually promising. Also, I started collecting watches in the middle of the high demand market so there hasn't been anything I'd remotely want that would be able to help me build a purchase history. Long story short, I've realized that the gray market is much more suited to someone like me. And in California, it's not much of a markup on many pieces when I calculate the tax I'd have paid even at MSRP.

[Jeanf]

Originally Posted by goin2drt

when you are over paying for anything of course you get excellent service and selection and they are glad to take your money. They price things high enough that the demand is just enough to get a buyer. When you are an ad and have to sell at msrp of a product that commands well over then why would you think anything else but the reasons you stated. Common sense.

+2

[PleaseStandBack]

Originally Posted by Goin2drt

When you are over paying for anything of course you get excellent service and selection and they are glad to take your money. They price things high enough that the demand is just enough to get a buyer. When you are an ad and have to sell at MSRP of a product that commands well over then why would you think anything else but the reasons you stated. Common sense.

The same could be said for buying PM items at an AD to build a purchase history. Difference here is I don't buy what I don't want.

[garyk]

If you could look into a crystal ball and predict how many years you will be on this earth, how many did you want to waste waiting for the Sub and how many wearing it?? How do you put a price on life. I bought my 2020 116613LB in late June from a grey and saving my state sales tax, I actually paid less for my watch than retail. I was also able to get the previous model with the larger lugs and smaller bracelet which I personally prefer. Great deal going grey for me...

[PleaseStandBack]

Originally Posted by garyk

If you could look into a crystal ball and predict how many years you will be on this earth, how many did you want to waste waiting for the Sub and how many wearing it?? How do you put a price on life. I bought my 2020 116613LB in late June from a grey and saving my state sales tax, I actually paid less for my watch than retail. I was also able to get the previous model with the larger lugs and smaller bracelet which I personally prefer. Great deal going grey for me...

Exactly! I wish I'd bought gray in 2019 when the subs were going for less than retail. Instead I thought it would help to start a purchase history, but I was wrong! So better late than never...

[Sinanamus]

Its not overpaying. Greys charge the fair market price. If yiu dont like it, go lick an ADs ***.

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[MrGoat]

I’m in the camp where my time is worth much more than the premium I’m paying a grey dealer to get me what I want, when I want it. Time is money, giving an AD a deposit is essentially giving them free money (not much but still, they’re making money off that deposit) without getting a set date for delivery. I will happily pay a premium for access, customer service and save my time. If anyone else wants to play games then that’s fine, I however have too many irons in the fire to waste my time begging someone to sell me a watch.


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[brandrea]

I don’t get the save tax thing ... aren’t you supposed to pay the tax even if you are “out of state”?

[Goin2drt]

Originally Posted by PleaseStandBack

The same could be said for buying PM items at an AD to build a purchase history. Difference here is I don't buy what I don't want.

Originally Posted by Sinanamus

Its not overpaying. Greys charge the fair market price. If yiu dont like it, go lick an ADs ***.

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My point is let ADs sell for whatever price they want and you would have the same experience the OP had with a gray. My post has nothing to do with buying or not buying from a gray. Do whatever the hell you want. The OP wanted to brag how wonderful his gray is and my point is let an AD charge as you would say “market price” and your experience would be the exact same. Plenty of great people and sales people at ADs. Their practices are only such because they get limited inventory so they need to get theirs. A gray is nothing special. Of course they love taking your money for an item they paid about 40% less for and have plenty of inventory.

[faz]

Originally Posted by brandrea

I don’t get the save tax thing ... aren’t you supposed to pay the tax even if you are “out of state”?

My canadian friend... in US out of state businesses were not required to collect state tax from other states. The buyer should themselves report and pay the tax to their respective state. ( yeah rrright).

Bow they have passed the law thst all out of state businesses are required to collect the tax. Hence a 10% ish increase in out of pocket cost for the California buyer when buying from say a Florida grey business.

For example, I just recently had to pay tax to Radcliffe jewelers for the Tudor I bought for my nephew.


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[kieselguhr]

Glad you found a seller you like

[sokoloka]

Originally Posted by faz

My canadian friend... in US out of state businesses were not required to collect state tax from other states. The buyer should themselves report and pay the tax to their respective state. ( yeah rrright).

Bow they have passed the law thst all out of state businesses are required to collect the tax. Hence a 10% ish increase in out of pocket cost for the California buyer when buying from say a Florida grey business.

For example, I just recently had to pay tax to Radcliffe jewelers for the Tudor I bought for my nephew.


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My understanding is there is an annual threshold for out of state sales to each particular state after which they are supposed to start charging and collecting sales tax on transactions. Want to say $500k?

EDIT: Varying threshold for each state.

https://www.avalara.com/us/en/learn/...exus-laws.html

CA is $500k which is why I had that stuck in my mind.

[garyk]

Originally Posted by brandrea

I don’t get the save tax thing ... aren’t you supposed to pay the tax even if you are “out of state”?

I thought so too but my state sales tax would have added another thousand dollars or so and the grey price was like 300 more than retail so win, win.... He did not ask for the tax money so there you are. Hey Brian, you are not the tax man, right??

[brandrea]

Originally Posted by faz

My canadian friend... in US out of state businesses were not required to collect state tax from other states. The buyer should themselves report and pay the tax to their respective state. ( yeah rrright).

Bow they have passed the law thst all out of state businesses are required to collect the tax. Hence a 10% ish increase in out of pocket cost for the California buyer when buying from say a Florida grey business.

For example, I just recently had to pay tax to Radcliffe jewelers for the Tudor I bought for my nephew.


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Thanks, that's what thought

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[tone024]

I agree, I'm fine with Grey. And yes, the no sales tax helps. I bought a Polar Explorer 2 recently grey (complete set) and paid less than I would have paid from an AD after NJ sales tax.

Also, running my own business, 2 young kids, neither my wife or I are into jewelry, introverted, and the closest AD is 20 minutes away... The idea of playing the AD game to save some money is not really something I have any desire to do.

Time is way more valuable to me than money right now.

[zeiter]

1) Pay Ransom

2) Pull up ladder

I think the AD’s are going to find themselves without clientele, but with tax troubles. It’s a ridiculous arrangement.

[brandrea]

Originally Posted by garyk

I thought so too but my state sales tax would have added another thousand dollars or so and the grey price was like 300 more than retail. He did not ask for the tax money so there you are. Hey Brian, you are not the tax man, right??

No, just a tax payer like everyone else

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[Rado63]

Originally Posted by sokoloka

My understanding is there is an annual threshold for out of state sales to each particular state after which they are supposed to start charging and collecting sales tax on transactions. Want to say $500k?

EDIT: Varying threshold for each state.

https://www.avalara.com/us/en/learn/...exus-laws.html

CA is $500k which is why I had that stuck in my mind.

Excellent point. The nexus or dollar amount that requires a seller to collect sales tax depends on their sales volume in any particular state. Use tax is a sales tax on purchases made outside one's state of residence for taxable items that will be used, stored or consumed in one's state of residence and on which no tax was collected in the state of purchase. If the purchase would have been taxed if it was made in the purchaser’s state of residence, then use tax is due. The seller has no winks or nods that can help you avoid the use tax. Most do not pay the use tax is my guess.

[Tangier11]

Its not overpaying if thats what the market allows. Geez

[Brny11]

All grays are great lol. They are happy to sell you even the most unicorn of them all (which are actually not uncommon if your willing to pay).

Happy you came in late and also came to grips with reality, purchasing for top market $$$. I for one would not pay a penny over retail as I remember getting my sub for 7100 and having the option to buy many other “hot” watches for same or less.

[PleaseStandBack]

Originally Posted by Brny11

All grays are great lol. They are happy to sell you even the most unicorn of them all (which are actually not uncommon if your willing to pay).

Happy you came in late and also came to grips with reality, purchasing for top market $$$. I for one would not pay a penny over retail as I remember getting my sub for 7100 and having the option to buy many other “hot” watches for same or less.

I get that. In a way it feels like California's housing market. I've been buying and selling for 12 years now and am used to the idea that something that was worth something last year can be worth a lot more today, especially in a "hot" neighborhood. And I'm willing to pay the price knowing the escalator is still on its way up. Although true none of us have a crystal ball, but with the increase in money supply I don't think the price of anything in this country is going down anytime soon.

[vh2k]

Originally Posted by Tangier11

Its not overpaying if thats what the market allows. Geez

If I buy a new car for $50,000, and most other people pay $55,000... I don’t care what label you apply — fair price, market price, whatever. All I care is I got a better deal.

When I pay $13,150 for a Daytona, and other people are paying $25,000... again, I don’t care what you call it. I’m much happier with $12,000 extra in my pocket.

[chinaski]

My last purchase (5 digit Explorer) came from a pre-owned Gray dealer that's well known (Tim Mosso's outfit). Absolutely the BEST experience EVER. I have used two others with great results, but Watchbox was OUTSTANDING. I'm on Mosso's Facebook group also. Had a few interactions with him online, super nice guy and one of the best in the biz IMO.

[enjoythemusic]

AD, gray, a single brand boutique... imho service should be appropriate for luxury goods of the expressed product quality.

[Harry-57]

If I can't wait or seriously believe I won't get it, I will go grey - if I want it enough (e.g. my 116610LV). If I can wait and believe I will realistically get it, I will use my AD and wait (e.g. the SS BLRO I am now waiting for).

Past that there is no rationalisation of justification required for me. There is a limit to what I will pay a grey dealer. Below that, the greys I have used have been as slick and professional as any AD. It just costs more.

[MTdweller]

I went grey for a PM Sub a couple years ago and the experience was excellent! I didn’t overpay at all - in fact, I paid almost $11k below retail w/ no sales tax.

Greys serve a purpose and get market prices for what they offer. Whether or not an individual agrees on the value proposition or not is ENTIRELY SUBJECTIVE.

Who is getting more enjoyment for their money: someone who pays $10k over retail and enjoys the watch starting today or someone who waits three years on a list? Again - it DEPENDS ON THE INDIVIDUAL.

Good for you OP!