Looks as if Lance Armstrong will lose it all

[dddrees]

Originally Posted by 77T

What we have seen in this instance (and similar examples of cheating in other pursuits whether sports, business or personal) is that character counts more than the offense.

Armstrong was never a very nice guy, period. He vaulted to the forefront of professional cycling and used banned methods. He was ruthless against all comers.

Had he been a more generous and forgiving soul, then he would not have harmed his accusers with personal attacks, lawsuits, etc. Had he remained silent but for his claim of "never been tested positive" many people would be more forgiving of his cycling transgressions.

Take other examples of cheaters you've known in the past - if they were nice people except for the violation then you were probably more forgiving.

People are human, and humans make mistakes. Redemption is one thing, but accepting cheating and allowing it to continue is another thing entirely.

Currently there is a great incentive to cheat, especially in those fields were so much fame and money can be made.

However I think we've seen were cheating can have reprucussions other than just affecting the outcome of a particular game or games.

[Kingair]

I did not read all the post but regarding Armstrong and his companion drivers . . . they knew what they did . . . it is as simple as that

If you see what is happening here in Europe . . . now Rasmussen admitted that he used doping . . .

The Spanish Doctor Eufemiano Fuentes . . . . on trial . . .

Many will follow . . . you'll see !

Even our oh so praised Eddy Merckx . . . he already used doping in the 70's . . . . and they caught him as well . . . but our Belgian King Boudewijn solved the problem at that time . . .

So if you ask me know what do you think about the professional cycling racers . . . :

HAGWe

[Kingair]

It's so obvious . . . . if money is involved . . . so is cheating . . . unfortunately . . .

You all know what is happening in the Rolex world (and other watch brands) . . . how often do you see a watch that is modified . . . and not at all to lower the value of it . . .

HAGWe

[77T]

Certainly the cheating is unacceptable - what I'm referencing is the resentment many are expressing is closely tied to his prior ruthlessness in attacking accusers.

[dddrees]

Originally Posted by 77T

Certainly the cheating is unacceptable - what I'm referencing is the resentment many are expressing is closely tied to his prior ruthlessness in attacking accusers.

Sorry.

I guess I was trying to make the point that in order to recieve redemption, one may actually have to recieve some sort of punishment commensurate with the crime.

[Vincent65]

The truth usually comes out... eventually. I'll wager he was not alone. Doesn't make it right, but we've seen it in athletics for decades, too. Whatever he loses is well deserved, despite the 'enhanced achievements' attained, and huge money for charity he raised. He's finished and he's blighted the sport. At least we have Bradley Wiggins!

[bewithabob]

No doubt, Lance Armstrong has told lies about his life for many years, beyond doping in cycling. Lies are a way of life for him. The scale of his deception is incomparable to anything we have ever seen.

He is clearly a narcissist, and a pathological liar with no moral compass, even going so far as suing those who told the truth, those who tried to hold themselves and him accountable. Piling one lie upon another, his apology is just another lie.

Notice in his interview with Oprah, that he continues to refer to himself as having 'won' the 7 Tours de France in which he knowingly and admittedly cheated. Clearly he is so deceptive that he has come to believe his own lies. Not only does he lie to others, he lies to himself. And he bullied those closest to him to lie for him.

I want to forgive him, because of the good that came from Livestrong, but do I believe he is genuinely sorry in his heart for lying? No!

[HRV]

A point I would like to add, did I think he was doping whilst I watched him "win" those tours? Yes I did think he was, did I care? No not really, if the officials let him continue, then who am I to say otherwise, I enjoyed the entertainment, as I still do today watching many different sports, I think a lot of top sports men and women.....enhance them selves

[Culley22]

Originally Posted by HRV

A point I would like to add, did I think he was doping whilst I watched him "win" those tours? Yes I did think he was, did I care? No not really, if the officials let him continue, then who am I to say otherwise, I enjoyed the entertainment, as I still do today watching many different sports, I think a lot of top sports men and women.....enhance them selves

Yuuuuuuup!!! Sports is NOW competition for ENTERTAINMENT. Just like everyone that LOVED Sammy Sosa and Mark McGwire hitting all those homeruns. People KNEW they used Steroids, but the entertainment and publicity was great, so they let it go.

I say make ALL drugs legal. Get them high as a kite, and see who is willing to sell their soul (and potentially shorten their lives) for the quick buck. I realize people don't want this, as kids learn from this and eventually the trickle down is that High Schoolers and Junior High kids start to use PEDs. But i'm tired of "being mad" at an athlete for "cheating". It's ENTERTAINMENT, and that's all.