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samson66 · 2 December 2013, 11:10 PM

I've been looking at picking up an GMT-Master II with the "Pepsi" bezel for a while now and have two watches that work for me. I wanted to get your opinion on which one you would suggest.

Mid-2000's era, great condition, with all paperwork

-or-

M-series 2007 model with 3186 movement, excellent condition, but with NO paperwork.

Cost is approximately $2,000 more for the 2007 model

What would you do? Is it worth paying a $2,000 premium for the 3186 movement but without papers???

Dan Pierce · 2 December 2013, 11:40 PM

Worth an extra $2K? Not to me.
dP

Old Expat Beast · 2 December 2013, 11:42 PM

I would go for the 3185. I have that movement in my Exp II and it is accurate to within less than ten secs per month.

Ector495 · 2 December 2013, 11:44 PM

I think the older one should be fine. Good luck in your choice. Keep us update and have pics ready.

Bobcat09 · 2 December 2013, 11:45 PM

I wouldn't pay an extra 2K for the M serial for the 3186 movement.

RolexDivers · 2 December 2013, 11:49 PM

At my house, $$ doesn't grow on trees... So I would say NO WAY to the 2007 model ...

Get the older one that is complete. Apart from the WIS community, no one really cares if it has the 3186 in it or the 8186 in it (if there is such a thing!) and most people in this world would not know what a 3186 is if you hit them on the head with it...

samson66 · 3 December 2013, 12:22 AM

Thank you for the replies. My understanding is that it would be close to ANOTHER $2,000 extra if it had full paperwork.

If you don't think the M series is worth that kind of premium I think I'll just go with the older one.

Now in terms of accuracy is there any difference between the two?

subtona · 3 December 2013, 12:40 AM

Absolutely not for the 3186 & no way would box & paper add another 2k.

jwill051 · 3 December 2013, 12:47 AM

No way would I pay up for the 3186. Both of my 16710's have the 3185 movement and I am completely happy with both.

kilyung · 3 December 2013, 12:52 AM

I'd always buy the newest one I could afford but not because if some perceived collectibility of a model.

Jake B · 3 December 2013, 01:10 AM

God, no...I purposefully hunted down one from around 2001-2002 to have the lug-holes/SEL combo, and couldn't care less about a the 3186, especially not to the tune of $2000

shoota70 · 3 December 2013, 01:14 AM

IMO, I'd pass on the M even if it was a complete set. If I was to get an M I would ONLY get it if it had the complete box and papers.

93 Turbo · 3 December 2013, 01:22 AM

IMO go for the B&P, it'll give you potentially another $2K you can put into another watch.

I've had both movements and traded the watch with a 3186. And now have two GMT watches with the 3185 mvt. The 3185 is a fine movement. Good luck. J

SLS · 3 December 2013, 01:40 AM

Get the model that is priced the best and in the best shape...B&P are a bonus.

Rockrolex · 3 December 2013, 01:46 AM

I have a Y series (2003) all black GMT-II (purchased new back then). It's my favorite watch and gets about 95% of my wrist time. It's got the 3185 movement and it's as accurate as you can get with a mechanical watch. I wouldn't trade it for a 3186 movement nor would I spend an extra $2,700 for that movement. I have the box and papers for mine, but they don't mean a thing if you ain't going to flip the watch. And I would never do that with this one.

springer · 3 December 2013, 02:25 AM

I'd opt for an older model as the others here have opined. $2000 plus for a newer model because of the movement is way over-hyped and is over-valued.

In short, I too agree with the other comments here.

lamnyc · 3 December 2013, 02:32 AM

Save the 2K for any watch in the future.

Explorador · 3 December 2013, 02:40 AM

3185

samson66 · 3 December 2013, 02:52 AM

Great feedback everyone. You definitely have swayed me towards the older model of the two. When I first started looking for a "Pepsi" GMT I didn't realize how much more they charged for the 3186 version. It does sound a littler over-hyped, similar to the "error dial" business...

swils8610 · 3 December 2013, 04:23 AM

3185 for sure.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

tomchicago · 3 December 2013, 04:36 AM

tough one...if the money isn't too much of an issue and the 3186 is genuine and super tight, i would spring for the 3186, but either way you can't go wrong!

mike · 3 December 2013, 05:53 AM

For me it would be the older watch. A complete service is a lot less the 2K and it'll be new.

Cc1966 · 3 December 2013, 06:32 AM

For modern pieces, I try and buy the newest. Good luck...

Jason71 · 3 December 2013, 06:37 AM

Older version. Save the $2,000 IMHO

alanc · 3 December 2013, 06:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan Pierce

Worth an extra $2K? Not to me.
dP

This -

I have the 3185 in mine and it's fine. 2K for a somewhat newer watch is not worth it; do a service on the older one and it will be like new anyway. Finally, always better to have box and papers.

shou.biao.kuang · 1 January 2014, 05:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by samson66

Thank you for the replies. My understanding is that it would be close to ANOTHER $2,000 extra if it had full paperwork.

Hi Samson, so is your set 2k more even though it is without the B&P or you have been offered another set for 2k more with B&P?

I will throw my vote to the 16710-3186 :)

shou.biao.kuang · 1 January 2014, 05:26 AM

Hi,

Anyone any idea when was the last batch of "M" series 16710 with the 3186 movement? Some mentioned that the full "M" series has 16710-3186 but I doubt so. Thus far, I have seen case number up to M36x only.

A 16710-3186 M9xx?

Not likely IMHO

Chainring · 1 January 2014, 05:30 AM

Definitely not worth the $2k.

mrhy · 1 January 2014, 05:42 AM

Ditto I would go for the older one

roger0770 · 1 January 2014, 07:50 AM

If you want the 3186, why not go for the 2C? Complete package is my choice.

2 December 2013, 11:10 PM	#1
samson66 2024 ROLEX SUBMARINER 41 Pledge Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Real Name: Mike Location: Downy Ocean Hon Watch: my money leaving! Posts: 13,793	Help with GMT-Master decision please I've been looking at picking up an GMT-Master II with the "Pepsi" bezel for a while now and have two watches that work for me. I wanted to get your opinion on which one you would suggest. Mid-2000's era, great condition, with all paperwork -or- M-series 2007 model with 3186 movement, excellent condition, but with NO paperwork. Cost is approximately $2,000 more for the 2007 model What would you do? Is it worth paying a $2,000 premium for the 3186 movement but without papers???

2 December 2013, 11:40 PM	#2
Dan Pierce 2024 Pledge Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Real Name: D'OH! Location: Kentucky Watch: Rolex-1 Tudor-3 Posts: 36,217	Worth an extra $2K? Not to me. dP __________________ TRF Member# 1668 Bass Player in TRF "AFTER DARK" Bar & NightClub Band Commander-in-Chief of The Nylon Nation The Crown & Shield Club Honorary Member of P-Club

2 December 2013, 11:42 PM	#3
Old Expat Beast TRF Moderator & 2024 SubLV41 Patron Join Date: Jul 2013 Real Name: Adam Location: Far East Watch: Golden Tuna Posts: 28,826	I would go for the 3185. I have that movement in my Exp II and it is accurate to within less than ten secs per month. __________________ _______________________

3 December 2013, 12:40 AM	#8
subtona "TRF" Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Real Name: gus Location: East Coast Watch: APK & sometimes Y Posts: 26,601	Absolutely not for the 3186 & no way would box & paper add another 2k. __________________

3 December 2013, 01:10 AM	#11
Jake B "TRF" Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Hong Kong Watch: Gold Sub 116618LN Posts: 2,820	God, no...I purposefully hunted down one from around 2001-2002 to have the lug-holes/SEL combo, and couldn't care less about a the 3186, especially not to the tune of $2000 __________________ Things are more like they are now than they ever were before.

2 December 2013, 11:44 PM	#4
Ector495 "TRF" Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: North Carolina Watch: 16622 Posts: 1,097	I think the older one should be fine. Good luck in your choice. Keep us update and have pics ready.

2 December 2013, 11:45 PM	#5
Bobcat09 "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Real Name: Bob Location: Alabama Posts: 192	I wouldn't pay an extra 2K for the M serial for the 3186 movement.

2 December 2013, 11:49 PM	#6
RolexDivers Banned Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: BIG BEAR, CA Posts: 1,468	At my house, $$ doesn't grow on trees... So I would say NO WAY to the 2007 model ... Get the older one that is complete. Apart from the WIS community, no one really cares if it has the 3186 in it or the 8186 in it (if there is such a thing!) and most people in this world would not know what a 3186 is if you hit them on the head with it...

3 December 2013, 12:22 AM	#7
samson66 2024 ROLEX SUBMARINER 41 Pledge Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Real Name: Mike Location: Downy Ocean Hon Watch: my money leaving! Posts: 13,793	Thank you for the replies. My understanding is that it would be close to ANOTHER $2,000 extra if it had full paperwork. If you don't think the M series is worth that kind of premium I think I'll just go with the older one. Now in terms of accuracy is there any difference between the two?

3 December 2013, 12:47 AM	#9
jwill051 "TRF" Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Real Name: Jim Location: Maine & Florida Watch: 16710,116619 Posts: 540	No way would I pay up for the 3186. Both of my 16710's have the 3185 movement and I am completely happy with both.

3 December 2013, 12:52 AM	#10
kilyung 2024 SubLV41 Pledge Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Cave Watch: Sundial Posts: 33,940	I'd always buy the newest one I could afford but not because if some perceived collectibility of a model.

3 December 2013, 01:14 AM	#12
shoota70 "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: earth Watch: 216570 White Posts: 224	IMO, I'd pass on the M even if it was a complete set. If I was to get an M I would ONLY get it if it had the complete box and papers.

3 December 2013, 01:22 AM	#13
93 Turbo 2024 SubLV41 Pledge Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Australia Watch: Rolex.Tudor.PAM Posts: 1,554	IMO go for the B&P, it'll give you potentially another $2K you can put into another watch. I've had both movements and traded the watch with a 3186. And now have two GMT watches with the 3185 mvt. The 3185 is a fine movement. Good luck. J

3 December 2013, 01:40 AM	#14
SLS "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Real Name: Scott Location: GMT -7 Watch: GMT's & Sub's Posts: 10,401	Get the model that is priced the best and in the best shape...B&P are a bonus. __________________ "The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of lower price is forgotten." -Benjamin Franklin Member No. 922

3 December 2013, 01:46 AM	#15
Rockrolex TRF Moderator & 2024 SubLV41 Patron Join Date: May 2005 Real Name: God Location: Washington, D.C. Watch: What do you think? Posts: 37,969	I have a Y series (2003) all black GMT-II (purchased new back then). It's my favorite watch and gets about 95% of my wrist time. It's got the 3185 movement and it's as accurate as you can get with a mechanical watch. I wouldn't trade it for a 3186 movement nor would I spend an extra $2,700 for that movement. I have the box and papers for mine, but they don't mean a thing if you ain't going to flip the watch. And I would never do that with this one. __________________ Despite the high cost of living, it's still very popular. *Tosser Cabinet Member* Official Member: 'Perpetual 30' Vegas International GTG 2016 Official Member "WIS-CON" Las Vegas International GTG 2017 Official Member "WIS-CON" Las Vegas International GTG 2018 Official Member "WIS-CON" Las Vegas International GTG 2019

3 December 2013, 02:25 AM	#16
springer 2024 SubLV41 Pledge Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Real Name: jP Location: Texas Watch: GMT-MASTER Posts: 17,319	I'd opt for an older model as the others here have opined. $2000 plus for a newer model because of the movement is way over-hyped and is over-valued. In short, I too agree with the other comments here. __________________ Member of NAWCC since 1990. INSTAGRAM USER NAME: SPRINGERJFP Visit my Instagram page to view some of the finest vintage GMTs anywhere - as well as other vintage classics.

3 December 2013, 02:32 AM	#17
lamnyc "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: nyc Posts: 1,762	Save the 2K for any watch in the future.

3 December 2013, 02:40 AM	#18
Explorador "TRF" Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Switzerland Watch: 16710LN,PO 8900 Posts: 227	3185

3 December 2013, 02:52 AM	#19
samson66 2024 ROLEX SUBMARINER 41 Pledge Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Real Name: Mike Location: Downy Ocean Hon Watch: my money leaving! Posts: 13,793	Great feedback everyone. You definitely have swayed me towards the older model of the two. When I first started looking for a "Pepsi" GMT I didn't realize how much more they charged for the 3186 version. It does sound a littler over-hyped, similar to the "error dial" business...

3 December 2013, 04:23 AM	#20
swils8610 2024 SubLV41 Pledge Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Real Name: shannon Location: usa Posts: 9,211	3185 for sure. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

3 December 2013, 04:36 AM	#21
tomchicago Banned Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Chicago Watch: 16710BLRO, 214270. Posts: 2,717	tough one...if the money isn't too much of an issue and the 3186 is genuine and super tight, i would spring for the 3186, but either way you can't go wrong!

3 December 2013, 05:53 AM	#22
mike "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 22,683	For me it would be the older watch. A complete service is a lot less the 2K and it'll be new.

3 December 2013, 06:32 AM	#23
Cc1966 "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Real Name: Christopher Location: Georgia, USA Watch: ing the Sea... Posts: 6,713	For modern pieces, I try and buy the newest. Good luck... __________________ "I wish to have no Connection with any Ship that does not Sail fast for I intend to go in harm's way." Captain John Paul Jones, 16 November 1778 "*Curmudgeons* " Favorites: 1665 SD, Sub Date, DSSD, Exp II, Sub LV, GMTIIc

3 December 2013, 06:37 AM	#24
Jason71 "TRF" Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Real Name: Jason Location: USA Watch: Rolex/Tudor Divers Posts: 7,973	Older version. Save the $2,000 IMHO __________________ Best Regards, Jason Just Say "NO" to Polishing Card-Carrying Member of the Global Association of Retro-Grouch Curmudgeons LIfe is too short to wear inexpensive watches PLEXI IS SEXY

1 January 2014, 05:26 AM	#27
shou.biao.kuang "TRF" Member Join Date: Apr 2013 Real Name: SBK Location: Singapore Watch: means shou biao Posts: 289	16710-3186 M9xx? Hi, Anyone any idea when was the last batch of "M" series 16710 with the 3186 movement? Some mentioned that the full "M" series has 16710-3186 but I doubt so. Thus far, I have seen case number up to M36x only. A 16710-3186 M9xx? Not likely IMHO

1 January 2014, 05:30 AM	#28
Chainring "TRF" Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Real Name: Steve Location: Grand Junction CO Watch: A few, not enough. Posts: 1,725	Definitely not worth the $2k.

1 January 2014, 05:42 AM	#29
mrhy "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: new york Watch: Pepsi GMT Posts: 2,383	Ditto I would go for the older one

1 January 2014, 07:50 AM	#30
roger0770 Banned Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: On Earth Watch: A Few Posts: 1,510	If you want the 3186, why not go for the 2C? Complete package is my choice.

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