My prayers are with Paris, France

[greggsiam]

Originally Posted by Piloto

Ok, you can put the CNN/MSNBC talking points down now. You lost me when you said "phobia".

People are dying. A lot of people. It's not phobia. Wake up.

I live in a country where 3,000+ people have been killed in the south due to Muslim extremists (and are still being killed). The people committing these cowardly acts are a VERY small portion of the Muslim population. Even though they are Muslim, the whole problem stems from everything but religion.

Rootbeer beat me to it. There are people dying every day, from all sorts of groups and different religions. There is no "war" on the west from Muslims, it's just extremists.

Do you think all the Irish are terrorists based on the acts of the IRA? It's basically the same logic.

[greggsiam]

Originally Posted by engin33r

Precisely, I also think it never was about religion, it was about wealth, about exploitation, who gets to control what.

It's like some thieves set up some fire in a neighborhood so that when the people go out and see, the thieves can plunder their houses.

About the misconception, I think the West is still in denial that Islam is being used as a political tool by the elite few in the middle east. To be an effective controlling machine, Islam has to be absolute. The religion is being used to legitimize their dictatorship rules. Since Islam is absolute, it must be good (otherwise if it is deemed bad, it can be changed), so if there is anything bad, it doesn't come from within. They kept blaming the West and Israel for all sorts of their problems, but never themselves.

Since Islam spread under the guise of religion, it transcend borders. So the muslim immigrants in the west, who are marginalized, the poor, uneducated. Faced with bleak future (low paying job, if any) they turn to this fundamentalism view of the world. They start to think that their problems are by design, that some evil is making them suffer. They had to do something radical. That is the seeds of terrorism.

The more they are being persecuted, the more militant they will become. Enlightenment is the solution. There are bright lights in muslim world - some muslims they can think for themselves, they don't just follow orders, they don't simply believe what they are told. But they must get support. And in the same time the West's leaders should encourage secularism in those muslim countries such they won't export their politics under the pretext of religion. Politic and religion is such a deadly cocktail.

Well said.

Let's not forget that a lot of these religious leaders get into power when a void in the current government opens, or it is toppled. Once they get in, they kill or imprison the educated and moderates, then enforce their rule with harsh laws and death.

[Kingair]

Aren't the Muslims still busy like in 1683 ?

[padi56]

Originally Posted by jot_

I think it's sad that a thread meant to post condolences and thoughts on a tragedy couldn't go a full two days without devolving into a political argument.

Have to agree so subject now closed before it needs the ban button.