Rolex Milsub 5513

[HerbieTheDog]

Hello

My old man was a RN clearance diver and was issued with the above Rolex in 1976. I didn't actually wonder about its true monetary value until last Sunday's Antiques Roadshow.

I don't have the exact model and it's not in great nick (Tritium pearl missing, frozen bezel and a chip on the glass). The bezel is the full 60 minute but the hands are not the sword but mercedes variety.

I had it valued a few years ago by a high street Rolex dealer which stated it had an insurance value of £2000-3000. The value was negligible as I'd never sell it so I never questioned it.

Providence wise I have nothing official from Rolex but I do have photos of my dad wearing the watch during the Falklands conflict. I also still have his RN dive log book which has dives logged from all over the world (including San Carlos during the Falklands, also Israel, Singapore, Hong Kong, Virginia, California and plenty in Plymouth Sound!).

What I'm looking for is advice on what to do next. I don't want to sell but I also don't want to lock it away. I've just ordered a G10 NATO strap in Admiralty Grey to restore as best I can to when my dad wore it (which he did as an everyday watch).

Should I get it valued and authenticated? One thing I have been advised about is not sending it to Rolex or let it near a Rolex service centre.

Any advice gratefully received.

[Haywood_Milton]

Hard to say without seeing some pics, but a couple of quick questions :

Can you see the numbers at the top and bottom of the watch if you pull the strap off and wipe it clean? It will probably be 5513 at the top, but what are the first four digits of the number at the bottom? Keep the last three digits off open forum.

Is there a long number on the case back (the surface against which the strap sits)? You can safely relay that here, but don't reveal the smaller number below it.

Are there any numbers on the underside of the lugs (the four arms coming out from the watch-head?

From what you've said so far, if all were otherwise correct you could multiply that hopeless high-street valuation by ten.

Haywood M

[HerbieTheDog]

Hi

The 5513 is etched on the top and the first four numbers at the bottom are 3927.

The top number on the back is 0552/923-7697.

Regards

H

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[Haywood_Milton]

Well, if there is no "5517" under a lug --- and I'm not expecting it --- then I'd still be saying the sort of figure I alluded to above, but one would really need to look at the condition, especially of dial, bezel and case-back.

You don't want to sell it; fair enough. You can't replace it with a new equivalent, so you would need what is called a Secondhand Replacement Valuation or Reasonable Compensation Valuation, under the rules of the UK's Institute of Registered Valuers (I employ two of its members, one being a Fellow). Always love to see more of these watches, so would be happy to assess for free and put my findings in writing.

I'm guessing that yours looks a little like the one on the right here, one of mine :



You could send it to Rolex UK, where they will normally follow very specific instruction, that we here can help you give. That would itself give you tangible provenance.

Do you really need it authenticating, with the word of your father as to its history? Maybe not, but if ever you, your children or grandchildren wish to sell it then they may be glad that you went to the trouble.

You sound as if you treasure his history, but guard those records well for reasons of value, too.

If you choose to wear it daily as he did, you may wish to fit a civilian bezel, as it is a part that is lost more easily than many realise and worth thousands in its own right.

Very close bunch, the CDs. I would bet a pound to a penny that he knows a number of characters I do :-)

Oh, final piece of advice for the night: do nothing in haste with it.

Haywood M

[HerbieTheDog]

Hi Haywood

Very similar to the one on the right but not with red hands. I am trying to post a couple of photos but I'm on my phone so not having much luck! Will try on the laptop tomorrow.

The real value to me is the history it's seen but I am more than happy to let you have a look for insurance reasons.

Does the dive log book add any historical value to the watch?

I've probably committed a sin here but it has been left in a box in my wardrobe since my old man died 8 years ago. However since yesterday I've really seen the beauty in the watch and do intend to wear it occasionally when the replacement G10 NATO strap arrives.

Regards

H

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[HerbieTheDog]

Here's a couple of photos...

[Haywood_Milton]

Very much as hoped! Thanks for posting.

This will be a treasure for you to enjoy in more ways than one.

Will respond to your pm at a more civilised hour.

H, out.

[cruvon]

Congrats on the find!

Here's another similar one that appeared a while ago with Shear, has a later insert and hands and military markings polished off though but rare nevertheless.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/1972-VERY...AAAOSwhcJWLmDD

[etp095]

That's a real gem, really cool that it belonged to your dad, and his military history. Glad your not going to sell it, hope you wear it for a long time to come. I'd like to see a few pics of your dad wearing it.

[morafa4]

Beautiful looking watch you have there! Wear it in good health --- and if you're feeling generous, feel free to post some pictures of your pops wearing it! We love a good story over here

[scooba]

Lovely watch and some good advice from Haywood Milton .

[jedly1]

at the moment rolex UK are ducking liability on bigger value pieces it seems and pushing these items away from RSC and declining to work on them , saying they can only go down the geneva heritage service route , a @1k estimate fee deducted from the service cost (usually 5k+ ) ..

bloody silly situation, but they've cocked up on so many in last couple of years approving fakes and condemning genuine watches that its probably for the best.

nothing at all to stop you hopping an easy jet to geneva and submitting it for a normal service there as a few other forum members have , accepted at normal price and they are totally to be trusted with your gem as long as you just give some clear written instructions . The geneva service and confirmation will stand you in good stead down the line IF for any reason life priorities change and you need to sell , and a proper manufacturers service will stand the watch in good stead for many many moons to come.

[GreatCircle]

Wow, great watch and story! Hoping to see some pictures of your old man wearing it. Loves these kind of watches "with a heart &history" !!

@jedly1 can you tell a little bit more about this Geneva vintage service route ? Are they the only RSC that does not "destroy" vintage watches by replacing dials, hands inserts etc? I know for effect that for example Brussels and Cologne are very difficult to deal with if you want to keep original (tritium) parts.
Is this a normal walk in service centre ? Any idea how much they charge for let's say a 5513 movement service only?
Thanks!

[Passionata]

Originally Posted by jedly1

at the moment rolex UK are ducking liability on bigger value pieces it seems and pushing these items away from RSC and declining to work on them , saying they can only go down the geneva heritage service route , a @1k estimate fee deducted from the service cost (usually 5k+ ) ..

bloody silly situation, but they've cocked up on so many in last couple of years approving fakes and condemning genuine watches that its probably for the best.

nothing at all to stop you hopping an easy jet to geneva and submitting it for a normal service there as a few other forum members have , accepted at normal price and they are totally to be trusted with your gem as long as you just give some clear written instructions . The geneva service and confirmation will stand you in good stead down the line IF for any reason life priorities change and you need to sell , and a proper manufacturers service will stand the watch in good stead for many many moons to come.

AFAIK there was a gentleman at Bexley who did authentication on such pieces but he s already retired.

BTW very nice watch considering todays trend on vintage watches with such a provenance it should hit an amazing amount of cash at an auction

[Haywood_Milton]

Originally Posted by Passionata

AFAIK there was a gentleman at Bexley who did authentication on such pieces but he s already retired.

BTW very nice watch considering todays trend on vintage watches with such a provenance it should hit an amazing amount of cash at an auction

Henry Hudson is sadly long gone from Rolex UK now and it is a very different place from what it used to be. Better in some ways, but not this. They have also moved the service centre to "Jubilee Drive" in West Malling.

OP not selling, but we can help him understand what he has and help him enjoy it as safely as possible. That has to be a result for any watch forum!

H

[HerbieTheDog]

Thanks to everyone for their kind words and advice.

I have learnt so much about these watches in the last couple of days so it's been a real eye opener.

The possible value astounds me so I need to make sure I have the relevant insurance should some scrote come a burgling. However I do collect swords so I guess he better come prepared.

As I'd like to wear it occasionally I am considering replacing the glass. There is quite a chip in it around the 1600 mark which can be seen in the above photos.

Is it worth getting this repaired or would it affect the value too greatly? If I do go ahead any advice on who could do this?

The other issue is the frozen bezel. Would a service sort this?

Ideally I'd like to wear it without the damage but don't want to devalue it (even though I'd never ever sell it).

Kind regards

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

[rootbeer7]

Originally Posted by Haywood_Milton

Henry Hudson is sadly long gone from Rolex UK now and it is a very different place from what it used to be. Better in some ways, but not this. They have also moved the service centre to "Jubilee Drive" in West Malling.

OP not selling, but we can help him understand what he has and help him enjoy it as safely as possible. That has to be a result for any watch forum!

H

beautiful piece and brilliant advice as ever

[Pict]

Wonderful thread, loving the initial exchanges between the OP and HM

[Rebel]

Great watch. Glad to hear it will continue to be well loved.

[Old Expat Beast]

Originally Posted by HerbieTheDog

Thanks to everyone for their kind words and advice.

I have learnt so much about these watches in the last couple of days so it's been a real eye opener.

The possible value astounds me so I need to make sure I have the relevant insurance should some scrote come a burgling. However I do collect swords so I guess he better come prepared.

As I'd like to wear it occasionally I am considering replacing the glass. There is quite a chip in it around the 1600 mark which can be seen in the above photos.

Is it worth getting this repaired or would it affect the value too greatly? If I do go ahead any advice on who could do this?

The other issue is the frozen bezel. Would a service sort this?

Ideally I'd like to wear it without the damage but don't want to devalue it (even though I'd never ever sell it).

Kind regards

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

Do you know that you should push the bezel down to turn it? That might be why it seems stiff.

[joli160]

Congrats Herbie, great piece.

[cardiel]

That moment when you are watching the Antiques Road Show and you think 'hang on a minute……I've got one of those' - must be a nice feeling. Many of here can only dream of owning such an amazing time piece!

[RCAFBuster]

I also hope that you have your Dad's Medals to keep with this fabulous Milsub.
cheers,
Buster

[HerbieTheDog]

I do Buster...Falklands Conflict Medal and Long Service Medal.

As well as a load of diving odds and sods including a beautiful divers knife from the 60s in a brass sheath.

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[RCAFBuster]

I'm glad to hear that, keep everything together at all costs. Follow the advice of the Masters and get a sympathetic servicing while keeping everything original, no polishing or buffing.

I've got my Dad's watch, which is fantastic, but it is only a Seiko Pepsi Pogue Moonwatch.

Wear in good health, especially as we commemorate our Veterans today in Australia.

Buster

[HerbieTheDog]

I'll be wearing it tomorrow to celebrate Armistice Day here in the UK...as long as the replacement G10 NATO strap arrives!

Never the less my dad won't be far from my thoughts.

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[brettpaul]

Originally Posted by HerbieTheDog

I'll be wearing it tomorrow to celebrate Armistice Day here in the UK...as long as the replacement G10 NATO strap arrives!

Never the less my dad won't be far from my thoughts.

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Beautiful watch! Wear it with great pride and listen to H...he's the man on vintage and is only equaled by one Mr. Mike Wood IMHO on Sub knowledge!

[Daytonaman799]

GREAT WATCH with an unbelievable history. if/when you get it serviced make sure its in REALLY good hands. It looks perfect. Enjoy and thanks to your dad for his service.

[TheRolexKingofLV]

That's a great story, wow!

[Haywood_Milton]

Originally Posted by brettpaul

Beautiful watch! Wear it with great pride and listen to H...he's the man on vintage and is only equaled by one Mr. Mike Wood IMHO on Sub knowledge!

That's very kind, albeit wholly over-stating my knowledge! Thankyou just the same, Brett.

Jedly, Mike and a number of others would give excellent advice to the OP.

Haywood