Shocking Experience with a Reseller. Is it me?

[AdamW]

Originally Posted by dddrees

Sure seemed originally that the OP was talking about nefarious practices by the MODs on this forum.


Sorry but at least in the seven years I've been coming here I've never seen such a problem.

HUH? I'm the OP and that's the last thing I was doing. I haven't posted here a lot and actually haven't been on the forum in years. I just didn't want to break any rules by naming the reseller. I think you are confusing me with someone else that posted about deleting posts. WAS NOT ME!

[HL65]

Originally Posted by AdamW

HUH? I'm the OP and that's the last thing I was doing. I haven't posted here a lot and actually haven't been on the forum in years. I just didn't want to break any rules by naming the reseller. I think you are confusing me with someone else that posted about deleting posts. WAS NOT ME!

You are correct he was mistaken. We were all referring to the 2 posts which were highly insulting and neither by you.

[TK-710]

Originally Posted by dddrees

Sure seemed originally that the OP was talking about nefarious practices by the MODs on this forum.


Sorry but at least in the seven years I've been coming here I've never seen such a problem.

The OP? Maybe I misunderstand "op" but as I understand it that's original post/original poster which in no way was talking about mods. The only mention of mods was the OP getting clarification if it was within forum rules to name an off forum reseller. That talk shouldn't be attributed to the OP that came later by others.

[Knappo 1307]

Originally Posted by AdamW

HUH? I'm the OP and that's the last thing I was doing. I haven't posted here a lot and actually haven't been on the forum in years. I just didn't want to break any rules by naming the reseller. I think you are confusing me with someone else that posted about deleting posts. WAS NOT ME!

OP, it wasn't you. Dan was blinded when reading your post, but the high shine on his new boots.....

[77T]

Originally Posted by bbressler

Just to play devil's advocate here...won't AD's switch out DJ dials on new watches if they don't have the one you want?

Good question - since it may have been lost in the dust up I can share my POV. Yes, an AD with a parts account and certified watchmaker can procure a dial to match your preferences. There is one proviso - it must be a dial that is allowable per the model configurations that Rolex designed for it.

But any gray dealer or indie watchmaker who does the same will void warranty...


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[Gaijin]

Wow. Awful.

[brandrea]

Originally Posted by 77T

Good question - since it may have been lost in the dust up I can share my POV. Yes, an AD with a parts account and certified watchmaker can procure a dial to match your preferences. There is one proviso - it must be a dial that is allowable per the model configurations that Rolex designed for it.

But any gray dealer or indie watchmaker who does the same will void warranty...


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Agree

Also RSC will swap out a dial as long as it is one that is meant for the same reference. I swapped out an azzuro blue dial for a blue index dial on my DJ2 at RSC Toronto. They kept the azzuro dial after the swap.

Edit: they also swapped out the hand set to match the dial.

[Tridor]

Look, the MODS here do a great job. Questioning their intentions or effectiveness is poor form, and simply fails to comport with current and historical fact. As for the OP's issue ... glad that he outed the place to help us all.

[SearChart]

Originally Posted by Ruud Van Driver

I don't normally agree with naming and shaming but in this case, I think it should be done. Offering to Franken a watch is plain wrong

If this were about a TRF seller I would not just name and shame, always go through a Mod to sort it out. It's the right way

Originally Posted by 77T

Good question - since it may have been lost in the dust up I can share my POV. Yes, an AD with a parts account and certified watchmaker can procure a dial to match your preferences. There is one proviso - it must be a dial that is allowable per the model configurations that Rolex designed for it.

But any gray dealer or indie watchmaker who does the same will void warranty...


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This

An AD or Rolex watchmaker would never compromise his own ties with Rolex to make a frankenwatch like described in the OP.

DateJusts have many different dials and a dealer can never have them all in stock, so a customer can always pick a dial from the book, which will then be placed in that watch.

[Thatguy]

I ran into the same thing at a local jewelry store. Not an AD. My wife was looking at a preowned datejust and they said if she didn't like the color he could change it and brought out a large box of dials. I was looking at a 16710 and he told me the Pepsi bezel insert was very rare and cost $1400 alone. Sigh....


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[imperio]

I wonder if any ADs do this with the deepsea black/dblue dials. Could be the reason why some dblue warranty cards have different references on them? Hmmm.


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[SDRider]

Originally Posted by Thatguy

I ran into the same thing at a local jewelry store. Not an AD. My wife was looking at a preowned datejust and they said if she didn't like the color he could change it and brought out a large box of dials. I was looking at a 16710 and he told me the Pepsi bezel insert was very rare and cost $1400 alone. Sigh....


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I think this sort of thing is fairly prevalent in the pre-owned Rolex world. It is easy to change the bezel or dial of a basic Datejust and add bling (diamonds) and pass it off as a genuine more expensive model. This is one of the reasons I prefer to buy new from an AD only. I don't have the knowledge or experience to be able to spot a fake (unless it is really obvious) so I'd rather just have the peace of mind of knowing the watch I purchased is genuine.

[bayerische]

What they do all day in the diamond district in NYC.

[SMD]

This practice is very common. Most common pieces are traded like baseball cards by dealers and so they will often advertise watches they don't have but can obtain. Of course, some even list watches they have no hope of obtaining as well to drive traffic, but this practice is very, very common in the online/chrono24 world (Not TRF).

[FTX I]

OP, the seller is a member here or it was someone outside TRF?

[Old Geezer]

There are a lot of unscrupulous independent and ADs that will do whatever to sell a watch. Realistically, a lot of buyers are not WIS and will likely never know they got some franken watch. It may be their only Rolex and may not service it unless it breaks or fails to keep time therefore never even knowing they have a franken watch. The seller has little risk of being caught by most buyers.

[AdamW]

Originally Posted by FTX I

OP, the seller is a member here or it was someone outside TRF?

Outside. Wingate. Tic-Tock.com

[dddrees]

Originally Posted by AdamW

HUH? I'm the OP and that's the last thing I was doing. I haven't posted here a lot and actually haven't been on the forum in years. I just didn't want to break any rules by naming the reseller. I think you are confusing me with someone else that posted about deleting posts. WAS NOT ME!

My fault, please accept my apology.

[dascenzo.nicola]

I once went to Brussels to a shop called Vintage Today to buy a 14060M. I found the perfect one. As it is a pretty well known shop, I simply trusted the sellers. Nobody removes the bracelet in a shop to check the reference on the case (in my opinion).
As I got home, I was becoming suspicious. The watch did not glow in the dark a lot. And the case reference was not the one I had on paper.
I called Rolex to check what watch it exactly was. It was a 14060 from 1996.
Clearly not what I was looking for.
Sellers were asses when I told them. Insinuating I lied about it all.
I had to wait almost a month to get my money back. They said it was because the watchmaker had to make sure the components of the watch were still ok and the accountant was in holidays (bullsh**).
I called them anonymously the same day and they assured me the watch was ready to pick.
Don't go there I would say.

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[AdamW]

Originally Posted by dddrees

My fault, please accept my apology.

All good. No worries.

[dddrees]

Originally Posted by AdamW

All good. No worries.

Good, my comments really where intended for the person alluding to something potentially nefarious taking place on the forum, but I guess I should have taken more care in how I crafted my comments.

[Cru Jones]

Jomashop does the same thing (listing watches for sale that they don't have in stock).

As for the tuxedo dial, I'm not sure of when they stopped producing the dial, but if it was produced for the same reference number as the watch in the shop, it shouldn't be a problem vis-a-vis Rolex service. I suppose the warranty would be voided, though, if RSC figures it out.

[Mick P]

Chaps

With thousands of deals being done every year, you will get the occasional mis-hap.

As regards to "naming and shaming", there should be a strict code to deal with it. When someone makes a claim of bad selling, we are just hearing one side of the argument which may be justified or not and naming someone who could be innocent is really unethical.

The only person allowed to name and shame should be a mod and they would only do this by taking a balanced view after hearing both sides of the case.

Regards

Mick

[MonBK]

Originally Posted by Mick P

Chaps

With thousands of deals being done every year, you will get the occasional mis-hap.

As regards to "naming and shaming", there should be a strict code to deal with it. When someone makes a claim of bad selling, we are just hearing one side of the argument which may be justified or not and naming someone who could be innocent is really unethical.

The only person allowed to name and shame should be a mod and they would only do this by taking a balanced view after hearing both sides of the case.

Regards

Mick

The mods that just sits idling and have nothing to do must be applauding your suggestion.

[Mick P]

Originally Posted by MonBK

The mods that just sits idling and have nothing to do must be applauding your suggestion.

Yes I quite see the funny side of that

[Tony64]

Originally Posted by 77T

Good question - since it may have been lost in the dust up I can share my POV. Yes, an AD with a parts account and certified watchmaker can procure a dial to match your preferences. There is one proviso - it must be a dial that is allowable per the model configurations that Rolex designed for it.

But any gray dealer or indie watchmaker who does the same will void warranty...


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Curious how anyone would know the difference though?

[77T]

Originally Posted by Tony64

Curious how anyone would know the difference though?

Rolex has its way. As we know:
Each watch has a unique S/N.
In their database Rolex knows the precise build.
ADs or certified watchmakers who order a replacement dial enters S/N when work is done to change dial.

So when you submit a watch for warranty service, RSC checks the database for several reasons (is it stolen, is it correct, any aftermarket parts or past reports on servicing). So a watch that may have started life with one dial, and shows up with a Tuxedo dial - but no authorized service to do that - gets flagged.

No Soup For Owner.


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[Tony64]

Originally Posted by 77T

Rolex has its way. As we know:
Each watch has a unique S/N.
In their database Rolex knows the precise build.
ADs or certified watchmakers who order a replacement dial enters S/N when work is done to change dial.

So when you submit a watch for warranty service, RSC checks the database for several reasons (is it stolen, is it correct, any aftermarket parts or past reports on servicing). So a watch that may have started life with one dial, and shows up with a Tuxedo dial - but no authorized service to do that - gets flagged.

No Soup For Owner.


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Now I get it, didn't realize the AD recorded the change in a database.

Makes sense

[lhanddds]

Originally Posted by sleddog

First off, I think the OP is talking about an online site reseller. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong...

Secondly, I personally take offense to these two comments above!
In no way, EVER, in my tenure as a mod here on TRF, has any thread been removed with the intention of smothering or covering the truth! No matter who it is directed at.. If misgivings are proven to be correct, and there is fraudulent activity, and or problematic sales tactics, this forum is all about naming and shaming those who don't follow the basic ethic of fair trading! To insinuate anything less is outrageous!

The only time threads are removed in these types of 'watchout' threads, is when false accusations, forum legality exposures, stories that are far from truths, and or both parties formally agree to settle with an amicable outcome outside the forum. Never has there been anything swept under the rug here.
We always welcome the discussion, and the legitimate outing of those who try to deceive or defraud the above board members of the watch community!
Anything less is a failure in my eyes, and that includes the core of this site, from top to bottom.

I agree Ken and Rob