The Rolex Forums   The Rolex Watch

ROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEX


Go Back   Rolex Forums - Rolex Forum > Rolex & Tudor Watch Topics > Vintage Rolex Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 24 May 2019, 04:16 AM   #1
pabennett
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: florida
Posts: 12
Sea Dweller - 1665 Great White (repair consequences)

Hello,

I received a Sea Dweller as a gift from a family member in the 90s. He was a big scuba diver and traveled around the world diving with it. I didn't wear watches so it just sat in my house for years.

Later, in 2006, my mom decided to get it refurbished and give me the "cleaned up" working watch for my birthday.

During the repair, Rolex removed the mk1 tritium dial and put on a service replacement luminova dial.

A few weeks ago someone offered to buy the watch from me and I come to find out 1665 "Great Whites" are collector's items and valuable, yada yada yada.

My mom obviously knew nothing about this and Rolex never bothered to mention it to her before removing the original dial and hands.

Curious what you rolex experts think of this situation. How mad should I be? And why didn't Rolex mention the value of the watch in its original condition, and what do you think it's worth post repairs?

I tried to attached a picture of the watch.

The serial number is:

1665

5746182

Thanks in advance!
Attached Images
 
pabennett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 12:58 AM   #2
pabennett
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: florida
Posts: 12
bump
pabennett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 01:52 AM   #3
kegan
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Anchorage Alaska
Posts: 606
No ones gonna feel sorry for you that’s for sure. Sure as per usual Rolex screwed you
But it’s too late now to do other than be happy someone gave you an awesome
Vintage sea-dweller and your mom did something really nice for you too.
kegan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 02:00 AM   #4
Vincent65
"TRF" Member
 
Vincent65's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 14,298
Yeah, no use "dwelling" on it now!

Sorry - great watch anyway. Enjoy. Your mother meant well...
__________________
https://www.rolexforums.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=80782&dateline=139659  8629
Vincent65 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 02:09 AM   #5
1665fan
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: East coast
Posts: 6,660
It still has value and something to be proud of
1665fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 03:49 AM   #6
Fatso
"TRF" Member
 
Fatso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Real Name: Paul
Location: Montreal
Watch: GMT 1675
Posts: 129
Value aside, it's now a fully functional watch. Enjoy the clean white patina-free luminous dial and gold hands that will never get crusty for the next 50 years.
__________________
'78 Submariner 1680
'78 GMT 1675
GMT II 16710
Tudor Day-Date (California dial)
Breil OKAY Manta
Fatso is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 04:47 AM   #7
Dan S
2024 Pledge Member
 
Dan S's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 6,297
Unfortunately, this happens all the time, and what Rolex did is simply their SOP. They replaced old damaged and worn parts with authentic new parts ... that's what they do. They don't see it as their business to track or estimate what your watch is worth on the collectible market.
__________________
@oldwatchdan on IG
Dan S is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 09:31 AM   #8
pabennett
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: florida
Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan S View Post
Unfortunately, this happens all the time, and what Rolex did is simply their SOP. They replaced old damaged and worn parts with authentic new parts ... that's what they do. They don't see it as their business to track or estimate what your watch is worth on the collectible market.
A heads up would be cool though...
pabennett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 09:33 AM   #9
pabennett
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: florida
Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by kegan View Post
No ones gonna feel sorry for you that’s for sure. Sure as per usual Rolex screwed you
But it’s too late now to do other than be happy someone gave you an awesome
Vintage sea-dweller and your mom did something really nice for you too.
Yeah, all is good except Rolex devaluing the watch by X thousands of dollars. My mom certainly didn’t think a “repair” would mean that.
pabennett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 09:41 AM   #10
pabennett
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: florida
Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vincent65 View Post
Yeah, no use "dwelling" on it now!
I laffed
pabennett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 09:47 AM   #11
pabennett
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: florida
Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fatso View Post
Value aside, it's now a fully functional watch. Enjoy the clean white patina-free luminous dial and gold hands that will never get crusty for the next 50 years.
It does look nice and I do wear it now.
pabennett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 10:06 AM   #12
pabennett
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: florida
Posts: 12
But how about return the original parts the owner in a plastic bag instead of “ship to Switzerland and destroy”?
pabennett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 10:07 AM   #13
oysterquartz17000
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: AWOL
Watch: Submariner 16803
Posts: 487
Same thing happened to me. I only realised many years later (this was in the early 00's), however it also happened to a watch I will never sell as it was handed down to me, therefore it doesnt matter. If I was you I would treasure it, your mums gesture was from the heart, love your watch for that if nothing else.
oysterquartz17000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 10:18 AM   #14
Fatso
"TRF" Member
 
Fatso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Real Name: Paul
Location: Montreal
Watch: GMT 1675
Posts: 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by pabennett View Post
It does look nice and I do wear it now.
Good. The service hands and dial probably "only" knock off 10-20 percent of the watch's value, which only matters if you were planning on flipping it. Since it was a family member's watch you should probably NEVER sell it, and there's something really nice about wearing a 45 year old watch that is basically brand new
__________________
'78 Submariner 1680
'78 GMT 1675
GMT II 16710
Tudor Day-Date (California dial)
Breil OKAY Manta
Fatso is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 10:25 AM   #15
Dan S
2024 Pledge Member
 
Dan S's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 6,297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fatso View Post
The service hands and dial probably "only" knock off 10-20 percent of the watch's value ...
Impossible to even guess without seeing the condition of the watch prior to repair. As others have said, it's water under the bridge now, so enjoy your attractive watch.
__________________
@oldwatchdan on IG
Dan S is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 10:25 AM   #16
RolexDave68
"TRF" Member
 
RolexDave68's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Real Name: Dave
Location: USA
Watch: SUB 116613LN
Posts: 2,892
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fatso View Post
Good. The service hands and dial probably "only" knock off 10-20 percent of the watch's value, which only matters if you were planning on flipping it. Since it was a family member's watch you should probably NEVER sell it, and there's something really nice about wearing a 45 year old watch that is basically brand new


I’m with you 100%, enjoy the journey


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
RolexDave68 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 10:50 AM   #17
pabennett
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: florida
Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fatso View Post
Good. The service hands and dial probably "only" knock off 10-20 percent of the watch's value, which only matters if you were planning on flipping it. Since it was a family member's watch you should probably NEVER sell it, and there's something really nice about wearing a 45 year old watch that is basically brand new
The watch does have sentimental value and would’ve been hard to part with.

It does look great refurbished and that is cool.

My beef is with Rolex removing and destroying original parts that I “owned” as a business practice. Why not send back with the watch?

And I’ve seen estimates for this watch with the original parts that come out to far beyond 10-20% of the refurbished value.

Hard to see why an official Rolex refurbishment would cause that kind of destruction in value for no particular reason.

Technically the original face and hands were still my property. Just seems like a weird business practice for Rolex.
pabennett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 10:59 AM   #18
Dan S
2024 Pledge Member
 
Dan S's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 6,297
Quote:
Originally Posted by pabennett View Post
The watch does have sentimental value and would’ve been hard to part with.

It does look great refurbished and that is cool.

My beef is with Rolex removing and destroying original parts that I “owned” as a business practice. Why not send back with the watch?

And I’ve seen estimates for this watch with the original parts that come out to far beyond 10-20% of the refurbished value.

Hard to see why an official Rolex refurbishment would cause that kind of destruction in value for no particular reason.

Technically the original face and hands were still my property. Just seems like a weird business practice for Rolex.
Here is another thread on a similar topic. It may interest you because many of these issues were addressed.

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=674970
__________________
@oldwatchdan on IG
Dan S is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 12:51 PM   #19
Styles Bitchley
"TRF" Member
 
Styles Bitchley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Canada
Watch: 1680
Posts: 1,398
Quote:
Originally Posted by pabennett View Post
The watch does have sentimental value and would’ve been hard to part with.



It does look great refurbished and that is cool.



My beef is with Rolex removing and destroying original parts that I “owned” as a business practice. Why not send back with the watch?



And I’ve seen estimates for this watch with the original parts that come out to far beyond 10-20% of the refurbished value.



Hard to see why an official Rolex refurbishment would cause that kind of destruction in value for no particular reason.



Technically the original face and hands were still my property. Just seems like a weird business practice for Rolex.


Looking at auction results for true collector watches is foolish if you don’t understand the nuances of what makes them worth so much. I know it’s painful to imagine that yours worth a mint, but it’s far more likely it was an average example.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Styles Bitchley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 01:13 PM   #20
pabennett
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: florida
Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Styles Bitchley View Post
Looking at auction results for true collector watches is foolish if you don’t understand the nuances of what makes them worth so much. I know it’s painful to imagine that yours worth a mint, but it’s far more likely it was an average example.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
That’s true. And I’m no watch expert. But would be nice to find out for sure if Rolex has returned the removed parts instead of “shipping them to Zurich to be destroyed”. Which is a weird move.
pabennett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 01:14 PM   #21
pabennett
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: florida
Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan S View Post
Here is another thread on a similar topic. It may interest you because many of these issues were addressed.

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=674970
Thanks
pabennett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 03:19 PM   #22
Lol-x
Facilitator
 
Lol-x's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Real Name: Steve
Location: Omnipresent
Posts: 33,594
Technically the parts removed were your property, but Rolex requires you to relinquish ownership as a condition of their service and provision of replacement parts.

Rolex may not have expressly sought your consent to appropriate your property, but they may say it was an implied term of their service. This would be a difficult matter to imply.

If someone appropriates your property without your consent you do have a legal claim against them for conversion/detinue.

Unfortunately, these things happen.
__________________

Most folks are about as happy as they make up their minds to be. ~Abraham Lincoln
Nothing compares to the simple pleasure of a bike ride. ~John F. Kennedy

ROLEXploitation - yeah I'm a victim
Lol-x is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 03:50 PM   #23
subtona
"TRF" Member
 
subtona's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Real Name: gus
Location: East Coast
Watch: APK & sometimes Y
Posts: 26,602
They suck when it comes to caring about vintage value.

Do you have a pic of before, may have not been avoidable?
__________________
subtona is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 09:45 PM   #24
lhanddds
Banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: USA
Watch: of course
Posts: 8,429
Too bad you didn't do a little research on this watch that you seem to have shown little interest in in in 2006. This has been Rolex standard operating procedure for years. At least it's worth a lot more than your $0 investment. Enjoy it for what it is, a gift.
lhanddds is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 11:22 PM   #25
Dan S
2024 Pledge Member
 
Dan S's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 6,297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lol-x View Post
Rolex may not have expressly sought your consent to appropriate your property, but they may say it was an implied term of their service. This would be a difficult matter to imply.
Their service estimates explicitly states that they will replace worn parts on an exchange basis only. And when you sign off on the estimate, you are agreeing to the terms.
__________________
@oldwatchdan on IG
Dan S is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 11:24 PM   #26
sillo
"TRF" Member
 
sillo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Real Name: Sean
Location: NY
Watch: 5 Digit
Posts: 2,840
Quote:
Originally Posted by pabennett View Post
A heads up would be cool though...
They do give a heads up of what's going to be serviced/replaced.
__________________
14060 | 16570 | 16600 | 16700 | 16800 | 79260

@TheGMTHand
sillo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25 May 2019, 11:24 PM   #27
Richard Carver
"TRF" Member
 
Richard Carver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: US
Posts: 2,237
All Rolex replacement parts are on an exchange basis. You are given a small discount from full price for trade value. I could probably get worked up over this if I could find that old box of f**ks I used to give but I won't.

I genuinely hope you never mentioned to your mother that her kind actions might have devalued your free watch a bit. :)
Richard Carver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26 May 2019, 12:16 AM   #28
BullMotorWerks
"TRF" Member
 
BullMotorWerks's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: US
Posts: 19
Cool watch. I would enjoy it with all of the family history that goes with it. Who cares what is worth. It was a gift. One of my favorite watches is a worthless Timex Ironman. It is invaluable to me because my daughters gave it to me.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
BullMotorWerks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 May 2019, 02:18 AM   #29
pabennett
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: florida
Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Carver View Post
All Rolex replacement parts are on an exchange basis. You are given a small discount from full price for trade value. I could probably get worked up over this if I could find that old box of f**ks I used to give but I won't.

I genuinely hope you never mentioned to your mother that her kind actions might have devalued your free watch a bit. :)
Update: I'm suing my mom and rolex for devaluing my watch. Can't let their behavior stand.

pabennett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27 May 2019, 03:00 AM   #30
haven_seeker
"TRF" Member
 
haven_seeker's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Northern Ontario
Watch: 19018N OQ
Posts: 848
Quote:
Originally Posted by pabennett View Post
Update: I'm suing my mom and rolex for devaluing my watch. Can't let their behavior stand.
haven_seeker is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

OCWatches

Wrist Aficionado

My Watch LLC

WatchesOff5th

DavidSW Watches

Takuya Watches


*Banners Of The Month*
This space is provided to horological resources.





Copyright ©2004-2024, The Rolex Forums. All Rights Reserved.

ROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEX

Rolex is a registered trademark of ROLEX USA. The Rolex Forums is not affiliated with ROLEX USA in any way.