The 1rst Panerai had Rolex movement!

[housemad]

The 1rst Radiomir Panerai in introduced in 1938 had a Rolex Movement!
The PAM00021

[joeyk]

wow is this worth bit of money ????

[GBJIV]

Gorgeous... Wish I had one!

[housemad]

One of the most expensive Panerai $38,000.00USD beside the new Tourbillon ($112,000.00USD).

[Lion]

That's a really nice watch, THANX for showing us the picture!!!

[Nica64]

Very nice picture and watch!!

[BigHat]

While it is true that the first Panerai's had Rolex movements, that pic isn't of one of them.

That looks like the a pic of the commemorative re-edition of the first watch (a debatable point in itself) of 60 pieces in platinum with the 16-ligne calibre movement. Look carefully to see "PT 950" at 7 o'clock indicating such.

The early history of Panny is somewhat murky as to when prototypes transitioned into production (limited as it was). Giampiero Negreitti believes the 1938 models (that look like the "California" with mixed arabic and roman numerals) may qualify as the first production. It was signed Rolex but the ebauche was a Cortebert calibre (Rolex out-house movement :-) ), probably made for pocket watches. The movement caseback (not a display back initially except for the prototypes to show the movement) was marked Rolex as was the winding crown.
Many think they were likely built in Geneva rather than assembled by Panerai, but that's not the case. Rolex always disavowed making military watches, and acknowledged in 1990 that their lone exception was when their agents helped Panerai do so in Florence.

Maybe a Panny expert can weigh-in here or if moved to the Panny section.

[yannis]

Thanks for sharing David!!

[housemad]

Totaly right Matt!!!
Thank you for the historical course!!!

[BigHat]

Originally Posted by housemad

Totaly right Matt!!!
Thank you for the historical course!!!

Just saw your wrist pic of the California (PAM 249) in another thread.

Lucky guy to get one of those. Congrats. I have no difficulty seeing why it's your fav. I'd buy one in a second if the premiums over MSRP weren't so high.

[jdc]

I uncovered this info when finding out about California dials

Panerai was initially supplied by Rolex with case and movement (3646 case and Rolex cal. 618 movement). It is likely that the watches were delivered with the 'Cali' dial (a blank non branded dial). Panerai, being a company that actually specialized in luminescence and naval equipment produced the famous 3-6-9-12 sandwich dials (using radium filled glass tubes) and fitted them in replacement of the original Cali dials. After the 1943 armistice in Italy it is known that Rolex were supplying both sides . The 3646 watches delivered to the German forces were known as 'Kampfschwimmers' and many of them had California dials….

[BigHat]

Originally Posted by jdc

I uncovered this info when finding out about California dials

Panerai was initially supplied by Rolex with case and movement (3646 case and Rolex cal. 618 movement). It is likely that the watches were delivered with the 'Cali' dial (a blank non branded dial). Panerai, being a company that actually specialized in luminescence and naval equipment produced the famous 3-6-9-12 sandwich dials (using radium filled glass tubes) and fitted them in replacement of the original Cali dials. After the 1943 armistice in Italy it is known that Rolex were supplying both sides . The 3646 watches delivered to the German forces were known as 'Kampfschwimmers' and many of them had California dials….

Well, that's what makes Panny history so interesting. A couple of points you make though I have never heard before, 1) the case was Rolex and 2) Rolex sold watches to German forces. In an official letter dated 11 Jan 1990 to Francesco Ferretti, a collector of military watches, Rolex writes " We would like to make it clear that Rolex has never made military watches...(then the Panny caveat)." So was Panny producing for Germany using Rolex parts or was Rolex selling them watches directly? By 1941 I thought Panny had transitioned to the Angelus (sp?) movement. The case was the first modification and that took place in 1939. That's why I thought it a Panny case all along.

I have a number of books on the history of Panny, but am no expert. This is worth clearing up though and I hope we can move this to the Panny section and attract others that may have some info to share.

[promethus]

It was said the First panny houses a rolex pocket watch movement.
And Rolex pocket watch movements were not in house but Fountainmelon.

[BigHat]

Originally Posted by promethus

It was said the First panny houses a rolex pocket watch movement.
And Rolex pocket watch movements were not in house but Fountainmelon.

I guess it's the ultimate irony. Rolex fans ( not referring to the OP of course or others posting here, but those that disparage Panny from time-to-time) bragging that Panny used their movements at the outset, only to discover Rolex was using an out-house movement themselves. Oops.

[mfer]

Originally Posted by housemad

One of the most expensive Panerai $38,000.00USD beside the new Tourbillon ($112,000.00USD).

$38,000!!!! Ha! If it was that cheap, I'd be buying them all day. That one is worth more like $200,000! No joke, and it is a commemorative reissue completed in 1997. I could not begin to tell you how much an original one with a Rolex movement would cost, but priceless is a word that comes to mind b/c the people that own them, don't want to sell them.

Here is a link to a stunning example recently acquired by a man on another forum.

Original Panerai Rolex Movement

You can see in the numerous pics that the inside of the caseback and movement are marked Rolex.

[BigHat]

Originally Posted by mfer

$38,000!!!! Ha! If it was that cheap, I'd be buying them all day. That one is worth more like $200,000! No joke, and it is a commemorative reissue completed in 1997.
You can see in the numerous pics that the inside of the caseback and movement are marked Rolex.

Thanks for posting that link. AMAZING PICS !! Great to see actual photos of the early models I have only read about or seen b&w photos of in books.

Oh, to have that watch.

[Trurolexer]

38 k? Yeah, I'm with Mik!!! That's too cheap...

[BigHat]

Originally Posted by Trurolexer

38 k? Yeah, I'm with Mik!!! That's too cheap...

The release price in 1997 that quickly recent the way of the AP ROO LEs in PLT, in other words, straight up.