32xx movement problem poll and data thread

[MikeyV]

Originally Posted by jakjakman

Question for those who have had their watch repaired under warranty to fix this problem. Are you happy with the repair? For example, if your watch was losing 30 seconds a day, is it back within a range you're happy with now?

I had two repairs under warranty. Just got it back from the second - running about 1.5 spd fast. Nice.

I was/am happy with both repairs, but the trust is gone. We'll see how long it lasts this time. Next repair will be on me!

[Idcutthat13]

Do I need to change any settings on my No. 1000?

[alphadweller]

Originally Posted by Idcutthat13

Do I need to change any settings on my No. 1000?

Lift angle should be 53.

[Idcutthat13]

Thanks. To elaborate on my above post, I’m not losing 5 spd. I seem to have lost 5 seconds in less than one day and now it does t seem to be losing or gaining.
I used a saw all for a minute the other day and wonder if that could have done it. From what I’ve read, it SHOULDNT have done it but that’s the only thing I can think of that would make sense.

[Idcutthat13]

17 hours into timegrapher test. Not being able to wear my watch for the day is not enjoyable.

[padi56]

Afraid today things like timegrapher machines can and sometimes take away the enjoyment of actually wearing the watch on the wrist to tell the time and what it was designed for.

[Idcutthat13]

Depends how obsessed someone is with it I suppose.

[Kevin of Larchmont]

Originally Posted by Idcutthat13

Depends how obsessed someone is with it I suppose.

Have you read these multiple 32XX threads? The obsession is legendary.

[SearChart]

Originally Posted by Kevin of Larchmont

Have you read these multiple 32XX threads? The obsession is legendary.

Your obsession with their obsession is quite legendary as well

[Idcutthat13]

Screenshot 2023-07-30 at 8.11.06 AM.png

Beat Rate Error was 0.0, 0.1. Excel was printing a 0 and I didn't feel like figuring out how to fix it for the 10th time.

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by Idcutthat13

Attachment 1382522

Beat Rate Error was 0.0, 0.1. Excel was printing a 0 and I didn't feel like figuring out how to fix it for the 10th time.

Excel
Format
Cells
Category: Number
Decimal places: choose 0,1,2, …

[alphadweller]

After I scanned my watches over 72 hours last weekend, I decided to put my spanking new timegrapher away. I won't be taking further measurements until the end of the year. Once or twice a year sounds about reasonable to me. Although I enjoyed checking the health of my watches, I find wearing them a lot more pleasurable.

I can have an obsessive mind, so I make a point of putting some boundaries on this thing for my own sanity. It would be easy for me to get sucked into data collecting beyond necessary. This is the reason it took me so long getting a timegrapher.

Once the diagnostic is established, I can accept the situation and move on. I'd rather know than not know. My SD43 is slow, and it's got low amplitude, so I won't be surprised or too upset if it gets worse and needs a visit to the RSC. In a way, knowing it's out of spec is therapeutic and helps manage expectations.

[Idcutthat13]

Originally Posted by alphadweller

After I scanned my watches over 72 hours last weekend, I decided to put my spanking new timegrapher away. I won't be taking further measurements until the end of the year. Once or twice a year sounds about reasonable to me. Although I enjoyed checking the health of my watches, I find wearing them a lot more pleasurable.

I can have an obsessive mind, so I make a point of putting some boundaries on this thing for my own sanity. It would be easy for me to get sucked into data collecting beyond necessary. This is the reason it took me so long getting a timegrapher.

Once the diagnostic is established, I can accept the situation and move on. I'd rather know than not know. My SD43 is slow, and it's got low amplitude, so I won't be surprised or too upset if it gets worse and needs a visit to the RSC. In a way, knowing it's out of spec is therapeutic and helps manage expectations.

That’s my exact mentality as well, and why I’m testing the watch right now. It’s new and I want to have one good test. Maybe I won’t test it again unless I notice poor performance. Maybe I’ll test every couple of years otherwise.

[Idcutthat13]

Should I bother testing beyond 36 hours? That would be tomorrow at 6:30am.

[Murdoc370]

Very well said.

I hope you can enjoy your beautiful watch now, keeping a good amplitude, for the next years to come.

[Rocket_Man]

I really like this watch. It took me about 2 years to add this watch to my humble collection. I don't buy any watches with the plan to flip them. I plan to own them and wear them and enjoy them. Some day when I'm too old to do those things I'll either give them away or sell them. But I hope that is many years from now. I added an Exp II to my collection a month ago for my upcoming 60'th birthday. That was a 3186 movement made in 2008 and running very nicely. Beautiful polar dial in 40mm.

My own belief is that Rolex pushed too fast to respond to the competition by adding 70 hrs of power reserve. Honestly I don't need 70 hrs and if I could choose to have better timekeeping or longer power reserve I'd choose better timekeeping every time. Everyone realizes Roles moves slowly and methodically, but there is clearly some thing amiss in this movement. If it were an easy fix they would have done it. It is clearly complicated. Could they fix it? Sure. But unlike the Cyclops issue they can't fix the timekeeping issue by removing the 70hr PR claim. They are stuck between the technical fix and their marketing claims.

If there is a fix that is being incorporated in service and my watch has it I'll be happy. But Rolex is silent on the issue and the fix. They seem to think more like a jewelry company than a tool watch company. And like Boeing they may be losing a culture that made them successful. There is enough hype about their product and other luxury brands that ensure for the time being they will sell every watch they can make. It takes time to build a reputation and you can wash issues under the rug with a good reputation, but like Boeing once your reputation is gone, and people no longer trust you, they no longer buy your BS either.

[steubi1]

Originally Posted by Rocket_Man

I really like this watch. It took me about 2 years to add this watch to my humble collection. I don't buy any watches with the plan to flip them. I plan to own them and wear them and enjoy them. Some day when I'm too old to do those things I'll either give them away or sell them. But I hope that is many years from now. I added an Exp II to my collection a month ago for my upcoming 60'th birthday. That was a 3186 movement made in 2008 and running very nicely. Beautiful polar dial in 40mm.

My own belief is that Rolex pushed too fast to respond to the competition by adding 70 hrs of power reserve. Honestly I don't need 70 hrs and if I could choose to have better timekeeping or longer power reserve I'd choose better timekeeping every time. Everyone realizes Roles moves slowly and methodically, but there is clearly some thing amiss in this movement. If it were an easy fix they would have done it. It is clearly complicated. Could they fix it? Sure. But unlike the Cyclops issue they can't fix the timekeeping issue by removing the 70hr PR claim. They are stuck between the technical fix and their marketing claims.

If there is a fix that is being incorporated in service and my watch has it I'll be happy. But Rolex is silent on the issue and the fix. They seem to think more like a jewelry company than a tool watch company. And like Boeing they may be losing a culture that made them successful. There is enough hype about their product and other luxury brands that ensure for the time being they will sell every watch they can make. It takes time to build a reputation and you can wash issues under the rug with a good reputation, but like Boeing once your reputation is gone, and people no longer trust you, they no longer buy your BS either.

I think this is an excellent summary of the actual situation.
Of course, there is a basic design bug in the 32.. family with only one main spring. It is actually a trade-off between power reserve and precision.

What I would like to add is the following:
Looking back on 40 years of Rolex ownership, I have always chosen this brand because it was based on three pillars: Robustness, reliability and precision. These pillars have been important to me because I actually wear and enjoy my watches on a daily basis.
Now, I really don't understand how Rolex could abandon two of their three pillars (reliability and precision), without any need or urge to do so. I think this is a major management error, and now there is, unfortunately, no easy way to get out of this situation.
The best way in my customer's view would be a straight forward approach by Rolex: "OK guys, we made a basic error, but we have a retrofit kit with reduced power reserve to fix it definitely. Please send your watch in, it will be free of charge and it will cost you nothing."
But, of course, this will not happen, I am afraid that Rolex chose the way of no communication at all, they are most probably already working on the new family 33.. with two main springs or reduced power reserve again.

By the way, I had my Submariner 216610 serviced this year, it lost about 10 secs per day after 18 months, and is now running perfectly precise. The question is for how long..Not sure wether I am going to sell it.

Have a good day all,
Tom

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by steubi1

I think this is an excellent summary of the actual situation.
Of course, there is a basic design bug in the 32.. family with only one main spring. It is actually a trade-off between power reserve and precision.

What I would like to add is the following:
Looking back on 40 years of Rolex ownership, I have always chosen this brand because it was based on three pillars: Robustness, reliability and precision. These pillars have been important to me because I actually wear and enjoy my watches on a daily basis.
Now, I really don't understand how Rolex could abandon two of their three pillars (reliability and precision), without any need or urge to do so. I think this is a major management error, and now there is, unfortunately, no easy way to get out of this situation.
The best way in my customer's view would be a straight forward approach by Rolex: "OK guys, we made a basic error, but we have a retrofit kit with reduced power reserve to fix it definitely. Please send your watch in, it will be free of charge and it will cost you nothing."
But, of course, this will not happen, I am afraid that Rolex chose the way of no communication at all, they are most probably already working on the new family 33.. with two main springs or reduced power reserve again.

By the way, I had my Submariner 216610 serviced this year, it lost about 10 secs per day after 18 months, and is now running perfectly precise. The question is for how long..Not sure wether I am going to sell it.

Have a good day all,
Tom

Agreed 100%
Well put

[Idcutthat13]

Well I was doing 12 hour increments. If you would have asked I would have gone further, I can if you want. I was asking that question yesterday.

[saxo3]

I'm not here to tell members what to do, only propose something.

Instead, I aim to better understand things myself and try to help others, if they ask.

Do whatever YOU like, e.g., start wearing this nice watch and forget about any more measurements

[Idcutthat13]

I did ask, yesterday, and this morning.
And I am wearing my watch, but thanks for not telling members what to do……

[Rocket_Man]

Update: at 48hrs into my post-service check...

- Dial up 0 spd, 219 degree amplitude
- 6Up, -9 spd, 175 degrees amplitude

Not sure what it should be at 48 hrs. I'll give it a week or two and do a better baseline test.

I noticed I didn't get a warranty card after service. Do they no longer include a card when you get your watch back?

Thanks,

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by Rocket_Man

Update: at 48hrs into my post-service check...

- Dial up 0 spd, 219 degree amplitude
- 6Up, -9 spd, 175 degrees amplitude

Not sure what it should be at 48 hrs. I'll give it a week or two and do a better baseline test.

I noticed I didn't get a warranty card after service. Do they no longer include a card when you get your watch back?

Thanks,

You could compare your result with previous data/graphs in this thread, e.g., have a look at the new YG SUB and the repaired DD 40 power reserve data shown in 4318

[Rocket_Man]

Originally Posted by saxo3

You could compare your result with previous data/graphs in this thread, e.g., have a look at the new YG SUB and the repaired DD 40 power reserve data shown in 4318

Maybe this weekend I'll do a more methodical test. These datapoints I just did are not complete with all watch positions. My guess is they will be pretty close to that post. The timekeeping in Dial Up was rock solid. Amplitude at full wind was around 260. But at 24 hrs in a vertical position the amplitude was hovering around 200. Sometimes over, sometimes slightly under.

The watch ran down today and I calculated ~72.5 hrs of PR. A few hours more than pre-service, but other than to support the test, I'm not really concerned about the PR.

It feels like Rolex replaced the barrel/mainspring during this service. The winding feels different, I can hear the gears more clearly. At a full wind the date wheel snaps with authority. With a cleaning and lube this may have increased the amplitude and PR. But I am just speculating. But if this is all Rolex did it just enforces that they don't have a fix. Just trying to address the symptoms.

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by Rocket_Man

Maybe this weekend I'll do a more methodical test.

I would rotate the watch by 180 degrees and use the Weishi 1900 in the higher accuracy mode.

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by Idcutthat13

I did ask, yesterday, and this morning.
And I am wearing my watch, but thanks for not telling members what to do……

No need to be sarcastic in this thread ...

You can repeat a PR scan at any time, just stop wearing the watch, do a full winding .... no big deal.

[trali]

I just want to thank everyone contributing with data. Especially Saxo3 for his titanic work analizing and presenting it in a very professional way. Threads like this are real treasure.

[Easy E]

Originally Posted by trali

I just want to thank everyone contributing with data. Especially Saxo3 for his titanic work analizing and presenting it in a very professional way. Threads like this are real treasure.

I agree, this has been helpful for me.

[LNGSD43]

SD43 back from uk RSC after second visit. Watch was away just over 4 weeks, surprisingly quick I thought. Running +0.5/day. Let’s see what happens this time!

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by LNGSD43

SD43 back from uk RSC after second visit. Watch was away just over 4 weeks, surprisingly quick I thought. Running +0.5/day. Let’s see what happens this time!

Thanks for the update.
You know that timekeeping is not the first 32xx health criteria. Amplitude values after 2023 RSC repair would be very interesting to measure