My watchmaker "You can't take it with you Rolex 1675" sale???

[flyinghell34]

Originally Posted by jatco

...So did this 'happen'.. or still pending.. The suspense is killing me...!!

Yes and no. Yes it a done deal and it's not for sale or listed anywhere. Just an agreement between the two of us. 35 years in a safe so a few more days was not a concern for him. No...not final yet until I pick it up on Tuesday or Wednesday evening. That is unless someone here tells me to turn around and run for the hills...anyone...hello...anyone??

[azguy]

I wouldn't pay $6,500 if it didn't have all the links, box, papers, booklets, etc...much closer to $5,500 IMHO...

[springer]

The watch looks fairly nice from the one photo and the serial number dates it to circa 1966, although the case back stamping could be anywhere from 1967-1969. Serial number dating for vintage Rolex, especially from the 1960's, is not very close to actual production dates.

The price range you quoted, $5500-$6,500 is within range for a late 1960's GMT. The more original the watch, the higher the price. I'd check the bezel insert, bracelet, hands and dial to determine if they are original for the watch which would definitely affect the price if they have been replaced. The case appears very nice and it appears to still have the chamfers left on the case lugs.

Many that are not into vintage Rolex consider replacement parts original, although they might be original Rolex, they are not original to the watch or a specific era when the watch was manufactured. This should all be factored in when negotiating the price of the watch - original vs replacement parts.

From the one photo posted, the bracelet looks like it might be a 78360 and the insert appears to have been replaced at one time. While this is not a deal breaker for most of us, especially if you prefer the newer bracelet or an insert that isn't scratched or overly faded, it would affect the price.

Good luck! The GMT's are my favorite Rolex model.

[TurboWatch]

Originally Posted by flyinghell34

Yes and no. Yes it a done deal and it's not for sale or listed anywhere. Just an agreement between the two of us. 35 years in a safe so a few more days was not a concern for him. No...not final yet until I pick it up on Tuesday or Wednesday evening. That is unless someone here tells me to turn around and run for the hills...anyone...hello...anyone??

Doesn't hurt to ask/bargain.

Don't expect to pay an average price for a top condition piece. Ask Ken, his pristine pieces cost twice as much as an "average priced" models. If it is as MINT and close to NEW as your watch maker said, GET IT even if he wants $6500.00 for it. If you don't, let me know, I'll buy it. Like new, truly unpolished, unmolested vintage is hard to come buy.

BTW: the insert looks to be a mid-font serviced type, so I'll take lots of pictures for us all to see before paying him.

[watchcrank]

sounds like you want to keep it a while so don't run away for a few hundred. the 1675 is a wonderful work horse of a watch and wears great! Luck with the purchase. M

[pdoukas]

I have to weigh in on this. I'm with John Springer on this one. My 68 GMT is ser # 193xxxx. The dial you are posting appears to be correct although I cannot blow it up enough to be certain. The lines in the "E" in Rolex should be the same length. That's indicative of the Long "E" trademark of the matte dial late 60s GMT dials. The insert appears to have been replaced. To me, the font appears thinner than mine and those that appeared during the late 60s. The date wheel should be silver. That one, and it could be because of the flash, appears to be white. I have seen pictures where they appear white but the flash makes them appear that way so I could be wrong. The one thing that really stands out for me though are the hands......they do not appear to match the patina of the hour plots. Once again though, it may be the flash. The lugs around the crown appear nice and thick, but I cannot tell from just the one image how the rest of the case looks. Ask the watchmaker to remove the caseback, I bet it will say 68. The bracelet appears to be a 7836(0) but without looking from the side I wouldn't be able to tell you. IMHO the closer tom$5500, the better.

Pete

[skprd13]

Man I think it amazing what you guys can tell from such a small picture. I got to hand it to you, the expertise you all have in determining the insert, bracelet etc. from that picture. This is why always post a picture if in doubt about a watch you are going to purchase on this forum to get expert reviews, comments etc. Personally the description on the watch you gave makes it to good to be turn. What an incredible find! Congrats you hit the lottery my friend.

[Maxtor]

Fantastic insights from the community. Good luck with the watch.

[Cesium133]

What a score. Pretty rare find. Even at asking price...

[springer]

Cesium, here is a circa 1966 that is a 183XXXXX serial number for you to compare it with. The date wheels were white during that time period not to be confused with the later ones which were a light silver paint and then a brushed silver finish.

[pdoukas]

Springer, I was unaware of that. Is it possible that the 68 should be white or is the fact that there are no real records make it a draw?

[springer]

Originally Posted by pdoukas

Springer, I was unaware of that. Is it possible that the 68 should be white or is the fact that there are no real records make it a draw?

Without getting too far off topic with this thread, as far as I know they were white. I can't say I've seen any silver ones back then but personally, silver, red, white, as long as I have one I'm good to go! Below is a thread with many vintage dials in it. Here are four more pics, circa 1966, 1970, 1971 and a Gilt GMT.

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthre...70458#poststop

[pexus]

ok...i am taking leave from work and visiting every watchmaker in town....

[linesiders]

No to rehash what Springer posted but from the image it looks like he is spot on RE insert / bracelet. Hands are a tough call because of lighting. Date wheel looks good & white

Insert is easily sourced so near the $5500 for a (truly) watchmakers own 1675 safe stored (old lady driven, 17,000 miles) is fair.

Better images would have helped.

Originally Posted by springer

Cesium, here is a circa 1966 that is a 183XXXXX serial number for you to compare it with. The date wheels were white during that time period not to be confused with the later ones which were a light silver paint and then a brushed silver finish.

[Robbyvm]

i love the enthousiasm in all the reactions !
based on this one picture it remains difficult to judge the watch... i hope you are able to post more pictures before purchase and actual input based on clear facts can be given.
i might be (according to the seller) be in pristine condition, based on this one pic there are already some important remaks given by some real experts.

later insert
colour of hands versus markers
colour of the date wheel
bracelet (altough not that important if it's a later type)
...

if all turns out to be correct when better pictures are available this could be a fantastic find, if not then to me even 5500$ is to much

i'm very curious to see pics and read the comments

[Floorguy]

OMG!!! My Grail!!

[ghosteh]

Beautiful watch! I know virtually nothing about vintage pieces, but I can tell you that the lesson I've learned through a lifetime of collecting classic cars is that you buy the best, most original & unmolested example you can find, even if it costs a few bucks more. The other lesson I've learned is that when you have the opportunity to pick up an excellent example of something rare & desireable, you do it. If not, you'll be kicking yourself in the rear for years to come.

I'd love to have a '67 GMT (my birthyear), but haven't run across the right deal yet (although I haven't really been looking). Consider yourself very fortunate that you were in the right place at the right time & go for it!

[flyinghell34]

Wow...thanks for all the great information and the time you took looking at my post. It is much appreciated.

Well, this is a wealth of information to absorb and I appreciate the quick education regarding the 1675. It turns out these can be just as complicated as the Per-moon Speedmasters.

This is where I am and some of my reasoning behind why I think I'm going to move forward on the purchase.

From what I'm reading there is concern about the hands, date wheel, bezel, and bracelet. Damn...Pretty much the whole watch. But I'm not going to let that deter me too much.

The concerns...

Hands...I know it is not the best picture, but I agree, if the hands are later replacements and not original to the watch and dial it would be a deal breaker.

Case...I know most hardcore collectors probably fall along the same lines as the Speedmaster guys. If the case is refinished they won't touch it. For me, I love the idea of an all original case but if it has been lovingly refinished, and according to the seller it has not, I have no problem with it as long as the major case details are not distorted in any way. Missing chamfers, overly polished crown guards, poor finishing would all be deal breakers but from his description and the one image the case appears pretty nice.

Date window...If I read this right the date window should be white. Unless something is really off I verify the wheel but it appears correct.

Bezel...I know there are purist here but the bezel is not a deal breaker for me. Just like the finish on the case I kind of like having a vintage watch with a bit of a clean look. Spending thousands to buy a beat up vintage watch just to be sure its all original still perplexes me but I fully understand. While I would love the original bezel this is okay with me. Unlike trying to track down a minty condition Dot of the 90 Pre-moon Speedmaster bezel the correct bezel for this watch seems readily available for a few hundred dollars. If the newer bezel doesn't call to me after a few weeks I'll get the correct one. All that said, according to the seller he was the only one ever to service the watch. It's been sitting along time out of sight so maybe he forgot what he has done to it. I do know that sitting in his drawer was a box of 100's of used Rolex bezels. I bet the original is in there or a likely replacement. If it can't be had I'll as for a discount accordingly.

Bracelet...If the bracelet is not original to the watch it's just no big deal to me. I like the look of the Oyster as shown and if the watch was to originally come with the riveted bracelet all the better because that one does not appeal to me. As long as the one shown is close to a period correct piece I'm happy.

Price...I think I'm in a good place with the price. I have seem on too many Speedmaster guys buy a vintage 321 only to have problems finding parts, competent watchmakers, and big repair bill to know I'm happy spending a bit more to know I have a clean mechanically sound watch that I can depend on with the 2 year backing of the seller. This is my largest purchase to date. For some it s drop in the bucket but for me I need to make sure I don't get into trouble buying from an unknown seller only to have a watch that needs more money put into it. From some of the stuff I have read vintage repairs can get out of hand real fast.

Tomorrow I head over to see it in the flesh and to flush out the service details and its history. Unless something feels bad or the watch is well off how he described it I think I'm going to take it home with me.

Thanks for the help and I look forward to sharing it with you all in the near future.

[strafer_kid]

I think a key thing here is that you can trust the source. Found myself in a similar situation a while backing looking for a 1675, and was too wary of pulling the trigger on a few that I saw on the net. Eventually my local AD turned one up in a trade in from the original owner, dating around 1967/68 and I went for it. Full service given and no doubt it has had a few bits changed through the years, which to some degree would be a negative for some folk. The key thing is that I knew it was sound and if that meant running with a few replacement parts, so be it! You will know if it is for you when you see it. good luck!

[javierleon]

Do it

[motoikkyu]

It seems very much from this thread that you are well aware of what you are buying, and you love the watch and it speaks to you. That's great! I congratulate you on a fine acquisition.

[rodrob59]

Congratulations on a true find. Now tell us about this Explorer....

[pdoukas]

John (Flyinghell34) what's the status buddy?!?! I'm excited for you. How did you fare?!

Pete

[flyinghell34]

Wow....I can't believe it's been almost 10 years now that I've had this watch but also surprised I never came back and closed out this discussion.

Well, here is a good reason to bring it back to life now. After 10 years and my companion in over 30 countries, I finally girded my loins enough to ship it off for a little cosmetic work. When I purchased it from my watchmaker it quickly became my favorite watch.

To answer a question I never did, we agreed to a price of $5700 to purchase the watch.

Upon looking at it in person there were a few issues I noticed.

The hands were replaced somewhere along the way and never matched the beautiful cream color of the dial. They were tritium OEM replacement hands but were somewhat whiter. The case somewhere along the way was polished, and in my opinion was not great, but I could live with it. Obviously as pointed out the bezel insert was replaced along the way but over the past 10 years of daily wear its taken on a lovely aged patina of its own.

All that said, while I love vintage watches I'm not a purist and I like my watches to look nice so it was finally time to part with it for a little cosmetic work.

After a few email exchanges with Edvi and research on hand relumination and case refinishing I settled on sending it off to LA Watch Works for the work.

The watch arrived back today and all I can say is it is Wow, Wow, Wow!!!. Their work is stunning. A huge shout out and kudos to the stunning work done by Edvi and Beau at LA Watch Works. What a fantastic job and fast turn around in just under 3 weeks.

The hands were polished and relumed to color match the dial. The color and texture is stunning and is a perfect match now. I'm glad I finally had this done. While the dial was stunning my eyes were always drawn to the color disparity between the hands and dial.

The case wasn't bad but some of the lines a bit wonky. The sharp edges polished away and the chamfers there but not really sharp. In the hands of the magician Beau he restored the sharp lines and straightened up the case so it's all symmetrical now. The crown guards were a bit off so those were cleaned up and sharpened. The brushed surfaces redone as well. All polished and then a bit of a vintage overtone applied to match it to the bracelet.

I'm thrilled with the results and can totally vouch for anyone contemplating sending their watch to LA Watch Works.

Here she is in all her glory now...

[jatco]

\/....It looks fabulous. They obviously know what they're doing and did a Great job on your watch.
Now...you feel better about it, don't you.
Congrats on a stellar piece.

[Cooper33]

Was just about to ask "who brought this thread back to life after 10 years", haha! Good to know you still have it, wear it in good health.

[Arnozerosix]

Hello,
Nice story...
May I ask what you are meaning by "vintage overtone applied" ?

thx,
Cheers,
Arno

[Kongelunden]

Wow, this looks amazing! Great job on the watch!

[flyinghell34]

Originally Posted by Arnozerosix

Hello,
Nice story...
May I ask what you are meaning by "vintage overtone applied" ?

thx,
Cheers,
Arno

From my understanding, and by the looks of it, the areas such as the case sides once corrected and highly polished they add some very light surface swirls so the case finish aligns more with the unfinished bracelet. I believe it was referenced on the invoice as “vintage finish”

[Snowballs]

Fantastic!