Darren reay

[AK797]

Originally Posted by beer

Thanks for posting and all the best to you.

P.S. Have been wondering about whether to trust Time 4 Diamonds for a while. Could not find any info but hearing you recommend them is extremely comforting!

If you deal with them let us know, they always seem to have the watches I'm interested in but comms have never been good and I don't trust them.

[Minimalist]

..

[Watchseller]

Hello guys,

I came across this thread accidently on Google and normally I’m not a forum type of person (sorry!) however I felt the urge to add a few lines regarding Darren Reay who I have known personally and in business for around 15+ years and have had plentiful contact with during his problems with HMRC. You shouldn’t always believe everything that you read online. Yes Darren did sell imported watches from the USA for 4 years out of the 15 years he was in business, and yes he didn’t pay anywhere near the correct amount of import VAT and duty, however he certainly didn’t pocket anything like £1.2M, and none of his customers lost a penny, on the contrary his customers saved anything from 15% to 40% on their luxury watch, while Darren earned an average of 5% from each sale, on a typical £10k watch he would get £500 gross and then pay VAT on his profit (I've seen the figures myself!). Over a period of 4 years he earned approx. £300k in total from the USA imported watches and ended up having to sign over 800 used watches to HMRC in order to satisfy them and quash his Import VAT bill, so it is safe to say that HMRC have now been settled in full. He was arrested by HMRC and interviewed/prosecuted by HMRC (Not the police as some people have said). It seems that the only person who has lost out here is Darren himself, after 15 years in business he has been wiped out financially, and also been sentenced to 3 years in prison. Don’t get me wrong I do not condone tax evasion, everyone needs to pay what they owe. The people close to Darren know the real truth, the people who don’t know Darren believe every word they read in the newspapers and online stories, which don’t show all of the facts. Sorry to waffle on a little but Darren isn’t here to defend himself and explain (for obvious reasons) so I took it upon myself to pass this information on.

And before anyone asks, no I don’t know where the 800 watches are being sold :-) probably some auction house somewhere making 10% of what they are actually worth!

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by Watchseller

Hello guys,

I came across this thread accidently on Google and normally I’m not a forum type of person (sorry!) however I felt the urge to add a few lines regarding Darren Reay who I have known personally and in business for around 15+ years and have had plentiful contact with during his problems with HMRC. You shouldn’t always believe everything that you read online. Yes Darren did sell imported watches from the USA for 4 years out of the 15 years he was in business, and yes he didn’t pay anywhere near the correct amount of import VAT and duty, however he certainly didn’t pocket anything like £1.2M, and none of his customers lost a penny, on the contrary his customers saved anything from 15% to 40% on their luxury watch, while Darren earned an average of 5% from each sale, on a typical £10k watch he would get £500 gross and then pay VAT on his profit (I've seen the figures myself!). Over a period of 4 years he earned approx. £300k in total from the USA imported watches and ended up having to sign over 800 used watches to HMRC in order to satisfy them and quash his Import VAT bill, so it is safe to say that HMRC have now been settled in full. He was arrested by HMRC and interviewed/prosecuted by HMRC (Not the police as some people have said). It seems that the only person who has lost out here is Darren himself, after 15 years in business he has been wiped out financially, and also been sentenced to 3 years in prison. Don’t get me wrong I do not condone tax evasion, everyone needs to pay what they owe. The people close to Darren know the real truth, the people who don’t know Darren believe every word they read in the newspapers and online stories, which don’t show all of the facts. Sorry to waffle on a little but Darren isn’t here to defend himself and explain (for obvious reasons) so I took it upon myself to pass this information on.

And before anyone asks, no I don’t know where the 800 watches are being sold :-) probably some auction house somewhere making 10% of what they are actually worth!

thats pretty much what i thought, so not sure why its new info. Not paying VAT is stealing and is also undercutting legitimate businesses with an unfair advantage potentially putting them out of business. Having an unfair advantage isn't a legitimate business model, and the fact his customers got a good deal is irrelevant. If i get a good deal buying stolen goods vs buying them on the high street its also wrong and basically the same thing. Paying VAT on the profit is what allowed him to sell at 40% discounts since he was not paying VAT on the import value.

While it may be true he may not have pocketed 1.2M, my guess is that fugue is what he owed by not paying the correct VAT, so in his pocket or not its the same.

I would suspect Darren isn't the only one who "has lost". Im guessing there are some legitimate dealers who played by the rules and paid what they owed who were undercut and lost their businesses as a result of the illegal pricing structure. Not to mention the taxpayers who also lost. That 1.2m would have otherwise gone to funding things like schools, or other public services. He stole from me and i didn't even buy a watch from him, but i am a taxpayer.

[Giggsy11]

I have dealt with them recently for a watch for the other half.. it was good smooth transaction. Went up to their office in More London, close to London Bridge/ Tower Bridge and examined the watch, like what I saw and deal sorted....

[Hilly10]

He is in jail now

[Sam Philip]

Originally Posted by Hilly10

He is in jail now

Correct, I read it as well.

Here is the link

http://www.islandecho.co.uk/news/cow...lion-tax-fraud

[rootbeer7]

oh dear

[bluebeamer]

http://www.sunderlandecho.com/our-re...-vat-1-8157444

[Colin W]

Originally Posted by bluebeamer

http://www.sunderlandecho.com/our-re...-vat-1-8157444

That's incredible - he had over 800 watches stashed in his house. I am amazed he got away with this scam for so long given the volume of parcels he was importing.

I wonder where and how HMRC are selling these watches.

What about his customers who have bought a watch where the VAT import duty has not been paid, will this be an issue for them. I have heard of problems with insurance companies not paying out if a watch was stolen and it is discovered that the VAT has not been paid - they use it as an excuse to get out of paying out in the event of a claim.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Busyboy]

Guess this explains the competitive pricing!

[watchbowl]

Wow...

On another note, can anyone recommend trusted sellers from the UK?

[AK797]

Damn.

Official Watches and Luxe have good supply of APs but not particularly cheap nowadays.

[Hairdude1]

Wow

[Snow-Dweller]

I bought from this guy last year...

[Hound]

That might explain why when he sold a watch of mine on consignment in 2014 it was only when I saw a picture of the new watch posted by a WIS on watchprosite that I contacted him to ask where my £ were. Firstly he claimed he didn't know it had been sold i.e. Played dumb. Then to actually get the money from him was another story. Funnily enough it was when I suggested police action that he started to get a bit more responsive. He did pay eventually to his credit but I knew something was dodgy.

[GolfPunk]

Trial at Teesside Crown Court, only 10 minutes from where I live. Shocking to hear this.

[AshAP]

I've often read on TRF recommendations from members referring to grey dealers as great guys who'll look after other TRF members. This case highlights the fact that grey dealers are out to make money and unlike the AD's the grey dealers don't come under brand scrutiny and therefore some will choose to lie and cheat to deliver unbelievable prices.

[BlueIn2Red]

Originally Posted by AshAP

I've often read on TRF recommendations from members referring to grey dealers as great guys who'll look after other TRF members. This case highlights the fact that grey dealers are out to make money and unlike the AD's the grey dealers don't come under brand scrutiny and therefore some will choose to lie and cheat to deliver unbelievable prices.

That's a very unfair generalisation in my opinion.

[georgemc]

I remember buying something from Watches of Distinction a couple of years ago, and Darren came up in conversation. Giles was a bit critical of Darren's approach to importing then, and made a point of letting me know he always sources his imports from within the EU and makes sure the correct, actual VAT is paid on them. His advice was "don't ever take anything you bought from Darren on holidays abroad" Not sure how valid that is. Anyone?

[texex91]

Guess his health is about to get worse...

[georgemc]

I wonder who's charged with selling his stock now? Might be a few bargains up for grabs!

[AshAP]

It specifically wasn't a generalisation, perhaps you should read the last sentence again.

[Chute]

A couple of things I noticed from both news articles:

There seems to be real disgust in tax evasion in the U.K., plus a stiff sentence to follow. For enforcement of laws to work, punishment must be swift, certain, and severe.
You don't see that level of enforcement nor disgust as much here in the US for those who turn great profits yet manage to avoid taxes.

Second, someone please keep an eye out for the auction!!

[anothernewphone]

Wow, that's a whole lot of money he avoided paying. That's messed up.