Rolex fines AD for 2020 Grey dealer inventory

[botsy]

Originally Posted by Soultime

Didn't it happen in the UK when the Pepsi first came out?
I am sure it was reported on here.

Berry’s jewellers lost their franchise for doing exactly that!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Harry-57]

The things ADs come up with. It must be a slow week. You wouldn't have thought so. Or maybe they've been mad busy and needed to relax with a good laugh.

[dmash]

Originally Posted by Harry-57

The things ADs come up with. It must be a slow week. You wouldn't have thought so. Or maybe they've been mad busy and needed to relax with a good laugh.

And then when some state ‘I’ve known my AD for many years and we’re friends!’.

Yeah, and he doesn’t want to hurt your feelings and tell you the truth that he’s selling out the backdoor for a profit instead of giving to you at list.

Harsh times we’re living in.

[georgekart]

Originally Posted by dmash

And then when some state ‘I’ve known my AD for many years and we’re friends!’.

Yeah, and he doesn’t want to hurt your feelings and tell you the truth that he’s selling out the backdoor for a profit instead of giving to you at list.

Harsh times we’re living in.

That's the strange part for me. I'd rather ADs tell us the truth. Like "Hey, this grey pays me 12K for a watch that retails for 10K so he can sell it to others for 15K. Oh and those VIPs buying X worth of watches a year." would not make me unhappy. Whereas when they say "Oh we haven't gotten any new releases in and will only get them in maybe 2-3 months." I am kinda unhappy with that. Because I know it is a blatant lie. If I was told the first one my response would be either A) "Ah, OK. Understandable." or B) "Let's cut him out and I'll pay you the 12K instead" if I was willing to pay that premium.

[58junior]

ADs do not sell Rolex, they just have a Rolex sign and empty cases.

[Soultime]

Originally Posted by botsy

Berry’s jewellers lost their franchise for doing exactly that!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Thanks Botsy. I was sure I had read that on here.

[spoon-turbo]

Too good to be true. I doubt Rolex really did this.

[dmash]

Originally Posted by georgekart

That's the strange part for me. I'd rather ADs tell us the truth. Like "Hey, this grey pays me 12K for a watch that retails for 10K so he can sell it to others for 15K. Oh and those VIPs buying X worth of watches a year." would not make me unhappy. Whereas when they say "Oh we haven't gotten any new releases in and will only get them in maybe 2-3 months." I am kinda unhappy with that. Because I know it is a blatant lie. If I was told the first one my response would be either A) "Ah, OK. Understandable." or B) "Let's cut him out and I'll pay you the 12K instead" if I was willing to pay that premium.

What’s funny is the grey pricing is mostly just driven up by the illusion how there’s not many, since ADs never have them and spew these lies.

If ADs just ignored MSRP and charged grey pricing, prices would immediately drop because others would realize the truth in that these watches are not rare whatsoever and youve been getting played lol. Some are driving up prices because they don’t walk in stores and see them and just want to be a part of ‘exclusivity’. This is not a Birkin though, there’s TONS of SS sport watches being produced.

Seriously, a premium on a black sub is insanity. I can’t believe anybody would overpay for that watch, which aside from the Datejust is the most common/notable watch in the entire world. Rolex didn’t start limiting production as harshly as some like to believe. ADs just became better businessmen and figured out how to turn a better profit.

[georgekart]

Originally Posted by dmash

What’s funny is the grey pricing is mostly just driven up by the illusion how there’s not many, since ADs never have them and spew these lies.



If ADs had them and charged grey pricing, prices would immediately drop because others would realize the truth in that these watches are not rare whatsoever and youve been getting played lol.



Seriously, a premium on a black sub is insanity. I can’t believe anybody would overpay for that watch, which aside from the Datejust is the most common/notable watch in the entire world. Rolex didn’t start limiting production like crazy as some like to believe.

Oh absolutely. Black ND Sub going way over retail? Are you kidding me? If the most desired pieces like BLRO and white Daytona were 1-2K over retail I'd understand it. Honestly, I get it. But paying crazy premiums on everything? I honestly don't.

[faimag]

That's highly unlikely.

[sgwatchguy]

Originally Posted by bumbleb

sounds like an elaborate excuse to not sell you a hot model...


Sent from my iphone using tapatalk

+1

[Goin2drt]

Fake news. Another “anonymous” claim. Without actual facts I don’t believe this for a second. IMO with zero facts Rolex knows exactly what is going on and they are ok with it. Helps build the brand.

The last part doesn’t even make sense that the AD is scared and really makes sure they know their grey customer. Zero sense at all. Rolex could go buy the watch that was for sale from a gray the day after release and know EXACTLY which AD sold it. They could do that for every watch on the gray. They don’t. They don’t care. They love to see folks falling over themselves to spend $30k on a brand new release $9k watch.

[Tavli3]

Originally Posted by boogiebot

I call bull. How are they going to enforce this if an individual buys the watch and sells it to a grey?? I hate the fact that I can’t get a new watch right now either, but to think that Rolex can or would stop this is a bit far fetched


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

They can't stop private sales to Greys but what about fully stickered and blank warranty cards? I mentioned on another thread that I was on the phone with my daughter and her boyfriend while they were at a very large gray dealer. They were offered a 2019 BLNR with no warranty card for 15,500.00 or a 2020 with warranty card in his name for $16,900.00! What about that?

Does anyone think Rolex should be caring about that? I should think so. So what this boils down to is that the AD has this watch and is hiding it. Don't tell me about the VIP BS, I'm sure they have a ton of VIPs they could have sold the watch to. But no they have it stashed away till they get the call from this or some other gray and then magically it appears for purchase, albeit 7K over list or thereabouts. And please don't think I have sour grapes, I have a BLNR & a Hulk both at MSRP. I'm just steamed at the blatant screwing of the consumer and the BS that flies around trying to cover it up.

I'm confused OP is this something you heard directly from your AD or something you read somewhere? If you read it please provide us a link.

[garyk]

In July I bought my “Unworn” TT Bluesy from a Grey on C24 after two ADs told me they couldn’t get me one and time was running out on the now discontinued model. The warranty card indicated it had been sold by a customer of an AD in Oregon to the Grey in NYC a week before I got it. What I don’t understand is how the whole transaction occurred between the original buyer of the watch and the Grey.

[Patton250]

Originally Posted by boogiebot

I call bull. How are they going to enforce this if an individual buys the watch and sells it to a grey?? I hate the fact that I can’t get a new watch right now either, but to think that Rolex can or would stop this is a bit far fetched


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

They couldn’t. The only thing that could happen in this process is the AD could blackball the customer that flipped it to begin with.

[lkngshrp]

It’s a fact up here in Toronto that some AD’s sell directly to grey dealers. I don’t for a minute believe that Rolex could be bothered buying back or tracing anything to anyone. To them, the watch has been sold. It’s a sale.

[Jocke]

Originally Posted by garyk

In July I bought my “Unworn” TT Bluesy from a Grey on C24 after two ADs told me they couldn’t get me one and time was running out on the now discontinued model. The warranty card indicated it had been sold by a customer of an AD in Oregon to the Grey in NYC a week before I got it. What I don’t understand is how the whole transaction occurred between the original buyer of the watch and the Grey.

A Blue TT is not so difficult to get, so this is not the ones Rolex hunting.

[drfrankenstein]

Two things are simultaneously true:

1. Rolex is using an outdated sales model of the AD. These days this is not necessary - regardless of the mark-up this convenience is another reason why gray dealers are successful.

2. Rolex does not supply enough ss watches to the ADs to sell to all the people that want one - this scarcity creates an additional profit motive for the ADs to get the highest price they can, because the margins can't be made in volume.

[Jocke]

If an ordinary customer sells to a gray dealer, there is no problem as he is registered as the owner of the certificate.
Some countries keep the certificate for one year before the owner receives it only to counteract resale. I have heard
that some ADs stop flippers for further purchases through blacklisting.

[dmash]

Originally Posted by drfrankenstein

Two things are simultaneously true:

1. Rolex is using an outdated sales model of the AD. These days this is not necessary - regardless of the mark-up this convenience is another reason why gray dealers are successful.

2. Rolex does not supply enough ss watches to the ADs to sell to all the people that want one - this scarcity creates an additional profit motive for the ADs to get the highest price they can, because the margins can't be made in volume.

Re: 1

Exactly why everybody who wants to defend Rolex is in the wrong. If Rolex TRULY wanted to deter this nonsense, they’d make all sales through internet and boutiques only. There is no longer 3rd party making sales and possibly sending to greys, they have a grip on everything from factory to consumer.

They don’t do this because....they don’t care. And these stories ADs lead you to believe are fantasy. Just think about it, why would Rolex get angry at the new demand and a $10k watch seemingly now worth $20k and they can increase prices without anyone blinking an eye?






In the end, if anybody wants to place blame, it’s the people who pay these prices. If everyone stopped, prices would settle, simple fact. People are just too impatient for the most part and it’s driving this.

[travisb]

Originally Posted by Fleetlord

Absolutely not.

AD lose their status because they won't / can't upgrade their merchandising standards, are victims of consolidation in a saturated market, are in a declining location or are not performing adequately.

Rolex will be moving more and more to chain stores because they just align better with Rolex strategy and are much easier to sell to as there is centralized control vs having to deal with a myriad of individual owners, so expect to see these independents disappear.

The grey market is a very important sales and marketing channel for Rolex, especially in today's luxury space.

Oddly enough I think Rolex was more concerned with the grey market a few years ago when watches routinely sold well BELOW MSRP.

That made the brand look trashy and put pressure on the dealer network as they were being undercut. Both are bad things.

Now those issues are both nicely resolved...so other than the sticker policy (which comes down to appeasing the dealers and helping their image by showing you can't really get NEW and untouched Rolex anywhere except from AD), Rolex lets the grey market be...

This.

[Harry-57]

Originally Posted by Jocke

I have heard that some ADs stop flippers for further purchases through blacklisting.

My AD says they do this. The customer always gets the benefit of the doubt because people buy, sell and flip for all sorts of reasons. And who cares anyway? Just some people on some forums who cant get the watches they want. No big deal outside these forums.

But people who obviously buy to flip and gouge can potentially hurt the AD, so they will not get another model that is in demand. They will be politely told that the list for such a watch is closed. Obviously, they are welcome to spend as much as they want to on anything else, including Rolex watches that are not hot.

They do have some quiet intervals and they are in the habit of checking the second hand market on line. Once you routinely start browsing, you begin to notice the new arrivals. When I went to collect my CHNR they had just spotted one. It wasn't difficult because the seller had even posted a photo of the sales receipt! This individual was listed for three other hot models. He won't get any of them from my AD. They won't humiliate him because they still want his money. But his Daytona, BLRO and something else (I forget) will never turn up.

[EEpro]

This is a story they tell flippers.

[Etschell]

My understanding is the AD owns the inventory and can sell to who they wish. Perhaps it is frowned upon but contractually I doubt there is anything preventing them from selling to a grey dealer. Also, grey dealers can easily get around any controls by paying people to go buy watches from the AD.

[Harry-57]

Originally Posted by dmash

And then when some state ‘I’ve known my AD for many years and we’re friends!’.

I consider a couple of SAs in my AD, and other staff/owners of other businesses who I have long term relationships with to be "friends" of a particular sort. We may do each other favours occasionally. There may be good will. But the relationship is based on me giving them money. And I'm not their only customer, or their most frequent customer or their richest customer or their biggest spending customer.

I sell things to people as a part of my living. I enjoy it and I'm paid only a sales commission, which keeps it real. I tend to find that among my clients, the people who claim to be my biggest friends are those who want something, and they remain my biggest friends until they get it. My real friends are people from years back who gave me a break, gave me a job or helped me set up my business. Then there's friends outside business, and so on....

I guess we all have different perspectives. I sometimes wonder if some people have any! But that's people for you. All different. All existing in our own reality.

[Rrpdc]

Originally Posted by dmash

more ‘ad said this without definite proof’..

*yawn*

+1

[Tricolore66]

That’s the point; they have nothing to sell you yet there are literally thousands of BNIB hot stainless models for sale at grey dealers and every single one of them originated at an AD. I’m not sure this is a policy that can be successfully policed by Rolex, but the mere risk that an AD might lose their status might help. I suspect the point is to identify the most egregious offenders and cancel them. I do believe they’re doing this, as the current situation is really creating a lot of ill will with legitimate aspiring Rolex owners and bad for the brand.

Originally Posted by Rado63

I don't see how an AD can exist without sales to secondary market dealers or gray dealers or flippers. How do you explain the fact that no AD has Steel sports in the case? No watches to sell but still in business?

[socalwatchcollector]

Originally Posted by Fleetlord

Absolutely not.

AD lose their status because they won't / can't upgrade their merchandising standards, are victims of consolidation in a saturated market, are in a declining location or are not performing adequately.

Rolex will be moving more and more to chain stores because they just align better with Rolex strategy and are much easier to sell to as there is centralized control vs having to deal with a myriad of individual owners, so expect to see these independents disappear.

The grey market is a very important sales and marketing channel for Rolex, especially in today's luxury space.

Oddly enough I think Rolex was more concerned with the grey market a few years ago when watches routinely sold well BELOW MSRP.

That made the brand look trashy and put pressure on the dealer network as they were being undercut. Both are bad things.

Now those issues are both nicely resolved...so other than the sticker policy (which comes down to appeasing the dealers and helping their image by showing you can't really get NEW and untouched Rolex anywhere except from AD), Rolex lets the grey market be...

This^^^

[inadeje]

Sorry OP but I call BS on this one. I can’t see why Rolex would spend resources on policing this aspect of their supply chain. Goods bought by ADs are theirs, to do with what they see fit. I can understand Rolex contractually “wishing” that ADs don’t markdown pieces publicly (via ads), but the fining seems pretty far fetched.

[socalwatchcollector]

Originally Posted by Harry-57

My AD says they do this. The customer always gets the benefit of the doubt because people buy, sell and flip for all sorts of reasons. And who cares anyway? Just some people on some forums who cant get the watches they want. No big deal outside these forums.

But people who obviously buy to flip and gouge can potentially hurt the AD, so they will not get another model that is in demand. They will be politely told that the list for such a watch is closed. Obviously, they are welcome to spend as much as they want to on anything else, including Rolex watches that are not hot.

They do have some quiet intervals and they are in the habit of checking the second hand market on line. Once you routinely start browsing, you begin to notice the new arrivals. When I went to collect my CHNR they had just spotted one. It wasn't difficult because the seller had even posted a photo of the sales receipt! This individual was listed for three other hot models. He won't get any of them from my AD. They won't humiliate him because they still want his money. But his Daytona, BLRO and something else (I forget) will never turn up.

Similar situation except my AD and I have been close friends for many, many years and he also takes my money with a big grin! Most of the stuff you read about shortages and this and that is all inaccurate web information. Social media-forums, and gossip are a good way to sucker people out of money. Over 90% of what you see people put out there is nonsense. They don't have the slightest clue. The grey dealers and flippers know this and use it to their advantage. I have never had an issue obtaining any Rolex at anytime. Patek is a bit different story. I have encountered some issues with Patek but never on mass produced watches such as Rolex. Not sure where this new and improved kool-aid is coming from but it must be the good stuff.