General Thoughts on AP Accuracy

[GB-man]

Originally Posted by Sir Larry Wildman

Not sure that I understand this...

I certainly can't and won't try to speak for deep-house. But just for fun I'll guess that he is implying that you would find fault in your AP and flip it rather than live with the quirks that so many work around in order to have something that does many other things so right.

Sort of reminds me of when I had a land rover. Yeah it spent some time in the shop, but the serviceman was the best and they treated me like gold. Also the car was just so damn fun to drive and made other cars seem to have no personality.

Maybe I now understand lol

[Sir Larry Wildman]

Originally Posted by tjspark

I certainly can't and won't try to speak for deep-house. But just for fun I'll guess that he is implying that you would find fault in your AP and flip it rather than live with the quirks that so many work around in order to have something that does many other things so right.

Sort of reminds me of when I had a land rover. Yeah it spent some time in the shop, but the serviceman was the best and they treated me like gold. Also the car was just so damn fun to drive and made other cars seem to have no personality.

Maybe I now understand lol

The funny thing is a year ago when I was deciding on a new car, it was between a Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland and a Range Rover Sport, and the deciding factor was perceived reliability and amount of time it'd probably spend in the shop.

Maybe that is a sign...

[AshAP]

I don't understand how you all have accuracy problems, do you sit there comparing it to a stopwatch, or do you just notice after a month that the time is different to your iPhone? I've used my watches as proper sports watches and even worn them for golf which I know isn't recommended but not ever experienced the problems reported here.

I can't help wondering if it's because I buy direct from the AD and the supply and distribution falls within the AP network.

Please forgive me if I'm wrong but it appears that a lot of guys here on TRF are buying watches through the grey or used market so the watch is already at least one stage removed from APs quality control and then if you are relying on the postal service or courier network who knows how carefully people handle the package before it is received.

[AK797]

Originally Posted by Sir Larry Wildman

The funny thing is a year ago when I was deciding on a new car, it was between a Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland and a Range Rover Sport, and the deciding factor was perceived reliability and amount of time it'd probably spend in the shop.

Maybe that is a sign...

Sir Lawrence of London please tell me you went with the Range Rover!

[AK797]

Originally Posted by AshAP

I don't understand how you all have accuracy problems, do you sit there comparing it to a stopwatch, or do you just notice after a month that the time is different to your iPhone? I've used my watches as proper sports watches and even worn them for golf which I know isn't recommended but not ever experienced the problems reported here.

I can't help wondering if it's because I buy direct from the AD and the supply and distribution falls within the AP network.

Please forgive me if I'm wrong but it appears that a lot of guys here on TRF are buying watches through the grey or used market so the watch is already at least one stage removed from APs quality control and then if you are relying on the postal service or courier network who knows how carefully people handle the package before it is received.

No, Rolexes are bought thru trusteds and greys all the time on here so it's an AP QC issue not a delivery issue.

[AshAP]

Yes but with respect, a Rolex is made by a robot and and the movement is hardly a thing of beauty. An AP is hand made. The tolerances are totally different.

I just got a text back from one of my clients who has 3 serious Pateks and he says they gain 2-3 mins per month.

[ralfcom]

Just dropped my diver off (3rd time) at Clearwater for running 94 seconds a day fast. They are extremely nice, gave me a game plan on how they intend on fixing it.

[Sir Larry Wildman]

Originally Posted by AK797

Sir Lawrence of London please tell me you went with the Range Rover!

The Jeep was for my home in the States! For my place in London, I have a Bentley Continental GT!

[masterserg]

Originally Posted by ralfcom

Just dropped my diver off (3rd time) at Clearwater for running 94 seconds a day fast. They are extremely nice, gave me a game plan on how they intend on fixing it.

That's what I am talking about ... and they will make it right

[Sir Larry Wildman]

Originally Posted by AshAP

I don't understand how you all have accuracy problems, do you sit there comparing it to a stopwatch, or do you just notice after a month that the time is different to your iPhone? I've used my watches as proper sports watches and even worn them for golf which I know isn't recommended but not ever experienced the problems reported here.

I can't help wondering if it's because I buy direct from the AD and the supply and distribution falls within the AP network.

Please forgive me if I'm wrong but it appears that a lot of guys here on TRF are buying watches through the grey or used market so the watch is already at least one stage removed from APs quality control and then if you are relying on the postal service or courier network who knows how carefully people handle the package before it is received.

I just set the time to a site like time.is, and after a few days of normal wear I check the performance.

Originally Posted by AshAP

Yes but with respect, a Rolex is made by a robot and and the movement is hardly a thing of beauty. An AP is hand made. The tolerances are totally different.

I just got a text back from one of my clients who has 3 serious Pateks and he says they gain 2-3 mins per month.

+2 min over 30 days = +4 seconds
+3 min over 30 days = +6 seconds

... both of which are within COSC standards.

[Sir Larry Wildman]

Originally Posted by masterserg

That's what I am talking about ... and they will make it right

The big thing AP has going for it, in my opinion, is the customer service. Even though there are apparent timekeeping issues, I like knowing they stand by their product and are very customer-oriented.

[///armin]

All luxury brands have their share of issues, that doesn't stop those loyal to the brand to stop purchasing it. I will give you a great example, right now Porsche is going to replace the engine on ALL new 991 GT3s it has sold in 2014 due to possible fire related issues. That's right, the whole engine and not just a part. For them to go out of their way and replace every engine is very costly but that's what a company like Porsche does to set the standard....

I'm not sure how AP handles these movement issues when the watch is out of warranty since it sounds like the issues are not something that happens overtime, they exist from the beginning. Therefore I would think they would be considerate in those cases. Either way it's still a great brand and they have some of the best watches around, I too have AP ROC that runs too fast and it did it from day one. I haven't sent it in yet because I can't see myself depart with it for a few weeks as of yet....but I will definitely be sending it within my warranty period.

[diver2012]

Originally Posted by ///armin

I will give you a great example, right now Porsche is going to replace the engine on ALL new 991 GT3s it has sold in 2014 due to possible fire related issues. That's right, the whole engine and not just a part. For them to go out of their way and replace every engine is very costly but that's what a company like Porsche does to set the standard.

Most customers (at least in the UK) would say Porsche have been shocking with dealing with this problem though. It's been a total shambles with next to no communication.

Many just gave the car back and asked for a refund and went to other brands because the service was so bad.

AP customer service is on another level.

[lmcgbaj]

My 15400 has been within COSC. No issues whatsoever.

[Sir Larry Wildman]

Originally Posted by diver2012

Most customers (at least in the UK) would say Porsche have been shocking with dealing with this problem though. It's been a total shambles with next to no communication.

Many just gave the car back and asked for a refund and went to other brands because the service was so bad.

AP customer service is on another level.

Plus I think an important distinction is that Porsche manufactures something that many other brands can not offer - high performance sports cars. Like, the engine is the selling point. You can't get that performance anywhere else.

With AP, I truly feel like, no matter how snobbish anyone here wants to be about the movement, you're buying it for the look and the heritage of the brand. If you really, really wanted accurate time keeping in an automatic watch, you would go with an Omega 8500-based watch, which I believe to be the best deal in watch making.

While Porsche is not only endangering people's lives, but they are failing at the most important part of what they produce. AP continues to make flawless looking timepieces, it's just that the accuracy of their movements aren't on par with other brands.

[AshAP]

You can hardly hold up Porsche as an example of exemplary customer service, my experience of buying a new Porsche was that once they have your money they don't really care.

Also anyone into Porsche has probably come across Jalopnik and the lemon 911. Porsche only gave in eventually because of the negative media campaign.

[masterserg]

Anyway, I think the issue is blown out of proportion. I had 5 different APs and they were all good in the timekeeping department. I had to send one to CW for a different problem and it was quickly and properly resolved.

[AK797]

Originally Posted by Sir Larry Wildman

The Jeep was for my home in the States! For my place in London, I have a Bentley Continental GT!

Gordon Gekko will be pleased.

[yjfang]

What do you mean you can't get that performance anywhere else?

Originally Posted by Sir Larry Wildman

Plus I think an important distinction is that Porsche manufactures something that many other brands can not offer - high performance sports cars. Like, the engine is the selling point. You can't get that performance anywhere else.

With AP, I truly feel like, no matter how snobbish anyone here wants to be about the movement, you're buying it for the look and the heritage of the brand. If you really, really wanted accurate time keeping in an automatic watch, you would go with an Omega 8500-based watch, which I believe to be the best deal in watch making.

While Porsche is not only endangering people's lives, but they are failing at the most important part of what they produce. AP continues to make flawless looking timepieces, it's just that the accuracy of their movements aren't on par with other brands.

[Sir Larry Wildman]

Originally Posted by AK797

Gordon Gekko will be pleased.

Gekko? He's a two bit pirate and a greenmailer. Nothing more... Not only will he sell his own mother to make a deal, he'd send her C.O.D.

Originally Posted by yjfang

What do you mean you can't get that performance anywhere else?

Like, you can't get the performance in a Ford Focus. Obviously you can buy a Ferrari, but it's not obvious to me that you can spend much half as much and still get a high performance sports car. However, you can spend less than half of what an AP 15400 costs and still get an accurate non-ETA movement.

[onesixeight]

Originally Posted by AshAP

You can hardly hold up Porsche as an example of exemplary customer service, my experience of buying a new Porsche was that once they have your money they don't really care.

Also anyone into Porsche has probably come across Jalopnik and the lemon 911. Porsche only gave in eventually because of the negative media campaign.

I second that. Porsche does a great job for small service issues until you are having serious issues with your car. My Panamera 4S was an absolute lemon. Car had a passenger airbag issue and their solution, told me to put my passengers in the back seat. YES!

If you're in the market for a Porsche you should watch that video of Nick Murray and the issues with his 991. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eXUnZrykDY That's the way they're gonna treat you if you are having serious issues with your car. Porsche North America doesn't give a crap about their NA customers because they are making so much money elsewhere.

Now AP service is top notch! Best service in the watch business. As soon as they receive your watch, you get a personalized e-mail and they usually have an estimate within 24 hours. While I've had issues with time keeping on two of my AP pieces, I'm happy the service is good and I feel that I'm being taken care of.

[yjfang]

Have you looked at a Nissan GTR?

Originally Posted by Sir Larry Wildman

Gekko? He's a two bit pirate and a greenmailer. Nothing more... Not only will he sell his own mother to make a deal, he'd send her C.O.D.



Like, you can't get the performance in a Ford Focus. Obviously you can buy a Ferrari, but it's not obvious to me that you can spend much half as much and still get a high performance sports car. However, you can spend less than half of what an AP 15400 costs and still get an accurate non-ETA movement.

[AK797]

Originally Posted by Sir Larry Wildman

Gekko? He's a two bit pirate and a greenmailer. Nothing more...

Don't forget he also dates Mermaids...

[snoopy_dude]

My diver ran +3 seconds a day out of the box during the first month break-in. After a few months of ownership, it's now gaining about 7.5 seconds a day when worn, and about 15 seconds a day when sitting up in the box. Not too impressed by the accuracy. However, I plan on getting the watch regulated when I send it in for the 3rd year warranty soon. So hopefully the watch will run with COSC when it's returned.