Submariner 16800 Matte Dial Variations

[sillo]

Originally Posted by srlwatch

When did the white gold begin going around the lume for the 16800? Can anybody help?


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Typically understood to be around 8.4 million serial, which is ~1984. This isn't a hard number though.

[JustinK]

Originally Posted by srlwatch

When did the white gold begin going around the lume for the 16800? Can anybody help?


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Around 8.4 million from what I have seen.

[Cooper33]

Originally Posted by sillo38

Typically understood to be around 8.4 million serial, which is ~1984. This isn't a hard number though.

Mine is a late serial matte dial, '84 but 8.7mil. There are a few 8.6 mil around as well. I think for a real, real hard number we would be looking at 9mil. Wonder why Rolex doesn't make this information public...

[Glosstritium]

Originally Posted by srlwatch

When did the white gold begin going around the lume for the 16800? Can anybody help?


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I have a 1984 all original early 16800 gloss transitional dial that was bought at the Rolex dealer when it first came out and been in the family for 35 years now and is my daily wearer... The serial number is 8.395k...


EDIT. Oh and I forgot to add, my uncle bought a new one also in 1984 serial 8.355k...

[sillo]

I wasn't even born at this point, but I have read that it wasn't unheard of for dealers to swap in the new gloss dials into old stock since it was the new thing and people love new things. This also can go in the opposite direction when dealers realized that matte dials were hot. Swap in a spare matte dial to a slightly later serial and make some $$$.

[Cooper33]

Originally Posted by sillo38

I wasn't even born at this point, but I have read that it wasn't unheard of for dealers to swap in the new gloss dials into old stock since it was the new thing and people love new things. This also can go in the opposite direction when dealers realized that matte dials were hot. Swap in a spare matte dial to a slightly later serial and make some $$$.

Not only that - you also need to swap out the date wheel, bracelet, clasp and end links. Seems a lot of work for a few extra bucks (but I'm not saying it never happened!).

Also, I believe it was standard for matte dials to be replaced for gloss ones when they were sent to RSC. As with everything involving vintage watches, "buy the seller!"

[srlwatch]

Originally Posted by sillo38

Typically understood to be around 8.4 million serial, which is ~1984. This isn't a hard number though.

What does “This isn’t a hard number though” mean? Curious because wouldn’t it be the mark 1 of that dial?


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[sillo]

Originally Posted by srlwatch

What does “This isn’t a hard number though” mean? Curious because wouldn’t it be the mark 1 of that dial?

This was in regards to serial numbers not mark 1, mark 2, etc. It isn't a hard number because nobody actually knows the exact serial number when Rolex switched from matte to gloss. There is also most likely some overlap where you would see a higher numbered serial with matte dial and a gloss with a lower.

Nothing is perfectly straight forward when it comes to dating Rolex stuff.

[srlwatch]

Originally Posted by sillo38

This was in regards to serial numbers not mark 1, mark 2, etc. It isn't a hard number because nobody actually knows the exact serial number when Rolex switched from matte to gloss. There is also most likely some overlap where you would see a higher numbered serial with matte dial and a gloss with a lower.

Nothing is perfectly straight forward when it comes to dating Rolex stuff.

Ahhh. I understand now. Thank you for your help!


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[Cmoe]

Good afternoon everyone, it’s a long shot, after emailing and messaging people on everything from ADs to Chrono24, I’ve found myself on this forum looking for my dads watch. He had a Rolex 16800 serial number 7478XXX, he sold the watch to get my brother into college and I’m looking to purchase the watch. He sold it in the 2011 to 2013 time frame in Texas through eBay and at the time it had its original box and papers, if anyone can help me find it that would be amazing.

[bizzlebot]

I think the Matte dials are amazing, I wish they kept it for the 168000 models.

[Filipão]

Dear Knowledgeable Gents,

What MK would my 8.275.XXX matte be, please?

Thank you so much,

Merry Xmas!!!

[sillo]

looks like a mark IV. The ft give it away. the f in ft is also directly above the left side of the V in superlative

[Filipão]

@sillo

Thank you so much!

(Mine has an original insert without the flat 4)

[srlwatch]

Another question if you guys can help on my 16800. It has the Zorro dial. The flat Z in the submariner line. How rare do you think this is and what would you value a complete set.


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[Tac1964]

Hi
Did u find any more details regarding your sub
I have an identical dial on my 16800 dated 2004

[Throttle]

There is only one insert for the 16800.
The flat four insert belongs to the 16610 era starting very late 80s

The correct insert for the 16800 is the semi flat 4 long tail serif insert.
The pearl of that insert would ALWAYS be darker patina than the markers.

This is the same as the SeaDweller 16660 of the same era.

Note that the inserts of the SD 16660 & Sub16800 are not interchangeable.
The font on both inserts are the same and is evidence of the period correctness.

If your 16800 comes with a flat four insert ( i see a handful in this thread), it means that it has been replaced!

[Classique Breguet]

I just bought this 1984 16800 matte dial. This is a mk4, yes?

[TuRo]

Originally Posted by Classique Breguet

I just bought this 1984 16800 matte dial. This is a mk4, yes?

Yes, a MK4, the only one with a wispy italic 'ft' like the old Tudor 792*s and some 50/60s 37mm Rolex Sub.

[sgoody1]

Originally Posted by Classique Breguet

I just bought this 1984 16800 matte dial. This is a mk4, yes?

Congratulations - looks a beauty - love the Pip colour.

[bob101]

Here’s an mk1 from 1980. Serial is 6.4m. I guess best not to touch the hands but has a bit of oxidation / corrosion. Beautiful pumpkin patina however!

[Classique Breguet]

Lovely :0)

[sgoody1]

nb I finally did get myself one - in an auction....

[Classique Breguet]

Parts from eBay arrived today. Can people please opine if these are genuine and correct for a 1984 16800 matte dial?

The seconds had was sold on eBay as gen, as was this insert. I don't know much, just want to be sure these are genuine and correct

[Classique Breguet]

The insert that arrived has a different shaped 4 than the one advertised. Here is a pic of the ebay ad with the flared 4, as opposed to the not flared 4 that arrived.
Unless you guys tell me the unflared is genuine and correct, I'll be sending this back :0(

[Classique Breguet]

The seller accepted the return, the printing under magnification was clearly not rolex quality

[Jaegodylan]

Here’s mine.



upload images

[Classique Breguet]

Looks good. How often do people wear these vs other watches? I just got mine so I wear it more days than not since it is new to me.

The 16800 insert above does not have the flared 4. Which years, or which Mks had which fonts on the inserts? Which are original, and which are service inserts??

[sgoody1]

Originally Posted by Classique Breguet

Looks good. How often do people wear these vs other watches? I just got mine so I wear it more days than not since it is new to me.

The 16800 insert above does not have the flared 4. Which years, or which Mks had which fonts on the inserts? Which are original, and which are service inserts??

I wear mine pretty regularly, but avoid wearing it in very wet weather, or generally when there may be significant water present (beach or on the occasion I am forced to wash up).
Also, if I am somewhere where I am concerned for my safety, I will wear a Casio or a seiko diver if I want to keep the same vibe.
The 16800s are not super valuable (still a lot, but thousands, but not tens of thousands)- and they are made to be worn, so enjoy (unless yours is an absolute minter never polished, and no scratches at all - or you have just bought it as an investment piece).
Anyway - those are my thoughts, which may not be the same as others.

[Classique Breguet]

I'm wearing mine daily. Since it passed the pressure test, I'm not worrying about it getting dunked in aquariums, or washing my hands, etc. It was made as a dive watch after all and it has new gaskets.

I even did some shallow diving with a double red, but got it pressure tested right before my trip, before I sold it 7 years ago (regret selling that now of course)