We can't get a Daytona C and why we want it that way

[SMD]

Man, you could get a very good buzz off all the whine on his thread.

[lhanddds]

Originally Posted by FremStar

I am going to add insult to injury here... Ken is 1000% correct! It's all about the relationship you have with your authorized dealer! Retail is lovely, however, paying below retail is even better. Everyone that wants a 116500 will eventually get one. In the interim there are other watches to buy in Rolex land... A wise person once told me they are massed produced unreliable watches so it shouldn't be hard to seek out alternatives!



My

Sorry Sam you cannot be 1000% correct


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Speed]

Time for a Speedy Pro?




I'll get me coat.

[HL65]

I went back and looked at some old threads from 08' and funny how they sound exactly like today. Daytona and wait lists aren't a new phenomenon for those who have been here a while and collecting for years. Just for fun here are a few....Dejavu

http://www.rolexforums.com/showthrea...tona+wait+list

http://www.rolexforums.com/showthrea...tona+wait+list

http://www.rolexforums.com/showthrea...tona+wait+list

[speedmaster73]

Originally Posted by HL65

I went back and looked at some old threads from 08' and funny how they sound exactly like today. Daytona and wait lists aren't a new phenomenon for those who have been here a while and collecting for years. Just for fun here are a few....Dejavu

http://www.rolexforums.com/showthrea...tona+wait+list

http://www.rolexforums.com/showthrea...tona+wait+list

http://www.rolexforums.com/showthrea...tona+wait+list

most dont disagree with you. this is correct.however, its 2017 and daytona-cs are NOT scarce....they can be purchased DAILY at an inflated price from resellers....

the grey market etc is much much much bigger today than 2008

basically all rolex has done is create another 'middle' man.....

daytona-c is only rare @ MSRP from an AD....if not one could have tomorrow by end of day no problem. none.....at a premium of course.....

[sawhornsoff]

As far as the watch goes, if their movement production has a limit, Rolex will always allocate the majority of the movements to higher margin PM or 2 tone watches. Why not? They still sell every watch they make.

Rolex will do whatever they want to do. Just ask the AD who is at the mercy of Rolex. Rolex will walk into the store and say "the entire Rolex section needs to be expanded and updated". They will dictate the square footage, force you to remodel and use the vendors they specify. However selling a Rolex is a privilege and many ADs feel that it is absolutely necessary to bring in customers and give legitimacy to their store. How many times have you passed by a store and mentally ranked them second tier or lower because they didn't carry Rolex? If margin on a watch is around 40 percent of the MSRP, the retailer would also prefer selling the 2 tone or the occasional PM over the 12.5k stainless.

[HL65]

Originally Posted by speedmaster73

most dont disagree with you. this is correct.however, its 2017 and daytona-cs are NOT scarce....they can be purchased DAILY at an inflated price from resellers....

the grey market etc is much much much bigger today than 2008

basically all rolex has done is create another 'middle' man.....

daytona-c is only rare @ MSRP from an AD....if not one could have tomorrow by end of day no problem. none.....at a premium of course.....

Very true - although they weren't scarce back in 08' either. Plenty around and people either waited the wait or paid premium similar to today.

[Rain49king]

Originally Posted by onethirtypanda

That sucks. I'd never buy from them again. There's plenty of other ADs (or grey) to buy from. Everyone talks about building a "relationship", well it goes both ways.

But on the flip side I get that the grey dealers get the good ones such as Daytona's but they also help the ADs offload the not so popular watches. Just part of the business I guess.

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

I have nothing against grey dealer's making money but make no mistake AD's create the market for grey dealer's. I will give you an example..I really wanted a SS YM2 so I shopped around and received the typical AD responses towards discounts "we would get in trouble with Rolex if we offered discounts" or "AD's never discount stainless models" blah blah. I then called a guy I know who is a grey dealer he asked me what I was looking to spend, I said i would pay $14000.00 otd for NIB. He said he would make a few phone call and the next day I got the watch from one of the AD's I had been shopping. I was confused so I asked why I couldn't get that deal from AD and he said for several reasons 1) he buys all thier new old stock 2) AD does not want the reputation of offering discounts 3) He eliminates the sales person commission (although he made $1000 because he purchased watch for $13,000.00). I am not whining I waited 7 years to get my 116520 and honestly I don't even like it (my wife wears it) so I probably will only buy the Daytona-C if I stumble across one and it will be to upgrade the wife's 116520.

[kwinky]

Originally Posted by speedmaster73

wrong....most harleys are 'ordered'...porsche is like this as well......rolex is not like either......

Being as that my relationship with my HD dealer is far more familiar than with my local Rolex AD, I guarantee its how things work. HD dealers get bikes on an allotment. Want more total to sell this model year? Sell all of last years. Want more of a hot model? Sell a bunch of not so hot models. At least 40% of HD production is Sporsters. A dealer couldn't remain in business if they refused to sell Sporsters. Same with Rolex. To increase delivery of Daytonas they have to sell alot of less desirable models. If this isn't a fact, ask your local AD why they don't order just Daytonas.

[AK797]

Originally Posted by HL65

What do you guys think people whine over more:The Daytona wait or the fact that the new BLRO wasn't made in SS?

We should maybe do a poll?

Originally Posted by watchwatcher

And...maybe add the colors aren't right on the BLRO bezel as one more choice?

My friends, as Basel is 3 months away what the hell else are we gonna do all day?

[bjw]

Originally Posted by RedCarrot

Thank you OP for bringing some good business sense.

Selling the max number for retail would be the goal for a public corporation so the COs and large shareholders get the fattest payout in the shortest time possible. When the brand is deteriorated, they move on to the next company to milk. Selling the max number for retail over a sustained period of time (talking about decades, not quarters) while building the brand would be the goal of a well run private company.

If Rolex flooded the market with DaytonaC so that anyone who wants one can get one within few short months, the public longing for perhaps their halo watch (not talking most expensive watch here) would disappear in short order as would Rolex's ability to command retail price for it. Is anyone paying retail at ADs for a saturated Rolex model?

Owners and future owner should also consider the positives of this scarcity, not the least of which is the future detained value of the watch. Even as future heirloom the watch would feel more special. I have no doubt there are some that do not care about either, but most do.

What is truly saddening for me to see is adult cry babies acting more childish than 5yo spoiled brats demanding I must have what I want when I want or there's something wrong with the system or there's some injustice. As much as I really like the watch myself and waiting for one, it is still just the newest shiny toy that will briefly satisfy your need for materialistic acquisition until the next shiny toy comes along.

If you make a list of 100 most important things you have in your life, a DaytonaC should be no where close to making that list. So why throw tantrum over such small thing? Be thankful, be at peace. Happy New Year!

Perfectly stated! Not only is Rolex privately held it is also a Non profit company/charitable foundation which I cant help to think makes it easier not rely on quick money. I wonder if this it what Hans Wildorf partially had in mind when developing the companys business model?

[bjw]

Originally Posted by SMD

Man, you could get a very good buzz off all the whine on his thread.

[speedmaster73]

Originally Posted by kwinky

Being as that my relationship with my HD dealer is far more familiar than with my local Rolex AD, I guarantee its how things work. HD dealers get bikes on an allotment. Want more total to sell this model year? Sell all of last years. Want more of a hot model? Sell a bunch of not so hot models. At least 40% of HD production is Sporsters. A dealer couldn't remain in business if they refused to sell Sporsters. Same with Rolex. To increase delivery of Daytonas they have to sell alot of less desirable models. If this isn't a fact, ask your local AD why they don't order just Daytonas.

what i was saying is harley and porsche have whats called 'build dates'...

you if you want a vrod 'muscle' or porsche 'cayenne' you need to get a 'build date' from the dealer at that point you place your order for the bike the way you want it.....

rolex is not like this...you dont' order' a sub or gmt or daytona-c etc etc...

thats how harley controls inventory....selling the cheap sportsters are easy.....there also isnt grey dealers for harley....

[HL65]

Originally Posted by AK797

My friends, as Basel is 3 months away what the hell else are we gonna do all day?

[GB-man]

Think its high time I send my AD a case of wine. Not all ADs are created equal.

[Duey]

Originally Posted by hl65

what do you guys think people whine over more:the daytona wait or the fact that the new blro wasn't made in ss?

We should maybe do a poll?

yesss !!

[ap1]

Originally Posted by GB-man

Think its high time I send my AD a case of wine. Not all ADs are created equal.

I'd say so

[AMCK87]

We all know this is a game. Whether we like it or not depends on when our order gets filled. Some of us will have to wait longer than others, and there is not necessarily any rhyme or reason. I haven't spent millions (not even close) with my AD but I have the black one and was told I'll have the white one very soon.

Simply a factor of ADs deciding who to allocate watches too - be it consistent customers or grey dealers or whomever. Don't blame Rolex, if anything think about your AD and your relationship with them. Have you bought from them? Referred friends to them and helped them make sales? Ever just genuinely reach out to them to shoot the shit and hear about how their business is doing? There are a lot of ways to build and develop a relationship with your AD. More so than anything else, that is something you can control and will help your chance at getting any popular model.

Or just pay the premium and be happy.

[watchdoc-]

Originally Posted by Spartacus

Scarcity is good. Inequity of distribution is not. Seeing members posts that they have obtained two Daytona Ceramic models while other good customers are being placated by position numbers in a non linear line is hard to justify.

Well said!!

[andyxxx]

Originally Posted by RedCarrot

Thank you OP for bringing some good business !

Selling the max number for retail would be the goal for a public corporation so the COs and large shareholders get the fattest payout in the shortest time possible. When the brand is deteriorated, they move on to the next company to milk.

Most large companies do not trade in this way.

Selling the max number for retail over a sustained period of time (talking about decades, not quarters) while building the brand would be the goal of a well run private company.

Yes – but none of that is happening with Rolex – They seem to be selling the least possible (and not bothering to whom) which leads to a ‘false’ price on the grey market which (according to many posts on various forums) is not doing the brand any good.

If Rolex flooded the market with DaytonaC so that anyone who wants one can get one within few short months, the public longing for perhaps their halo watch (not talking most expensive watch here) would disappear in short order as would Rolex's ability to command retail price for it. Is anyone paying retail at ADs for a saturated Rolex model?

Nobody is suggesting they flood the market.

What is truly saddening for me to see is adult cry babies acting more childish than 5yo spoiled brats demanding I must have what I want when I want or there's something wrong with the system or there's some injustice.

Sorry – I don’t see that in the posts I have read. I see people discussing in a fairly rational and gentlemanly manor the issue in hand.

As much as I really like the watch myself and waiting for one, it is still just the newest shiny toy that will briefly satisfy your need for materialistic acquisition until the next shiny toy comes along.

Quite – none of us need a Rolex, but are enthusiasts with an interest that encourages us to waste time on a forum discussing various points of issue/interest about the brand we like.

If you make a list of 100 most important things you have in your life, a DaytonaC should be no where close to making that list.

Yes I hope you are right. But if you re-phraze that as a list of the top 100 possessions you own I would imagine many Rolex are well up there.

[RedCarrot]

Originally Posted by speedmaster73

what i was saying is harley and porsche have whats called 'build dates'...

you if you want a vrod 'muscle' or porsche 'cayenne' you need to get a 'build date' from the dealer at that point you place your order for the bike the way you want it.....

rolex is not like this...you dont' order' a sub or gmt or daytona-c etc etc...

thats how harley controls inventory....selling the cheap sportsters are easy.....there also isnt grey dealers for harley....

Have you tried to order a GT4 or 911R from a Porsche dealer you have no prior relationship with? They are the equivalent of SS Daytona, except they are even more sought after and difficult to get at retail from AD.

[mailman]

Originally Posted by AK797

My friends, as Basel is 3 months away what the hell else are we gonna do all day?

Talk about Rolex releasing a SS Coke

[kwinky]

Originally Posted by speedmaster73

what i was saying is harley and porsche have whats called 'build dates'...

you if you want a vrod 'muscle' or porsche 'cayenne' you need to get a 'build date' from the dealer at that point you place your order for the bike the way you want it.....

rolex is not like this...you dont' order' a sub or gmt or daytona-c etc etc...

thats how harley controls inventory....selling the cheap sportsters are easy.....there also isnt grey dealers for harley....

You have never custom ordered a Harley. I know this for a fact because HD doesn't build to order. At some point early in the year the factory commits to a known quanity of each model to the dealer. As a buyer you would be purchasing one of what the dealer is expecting. I suspect Rolex does the same thing. So does Debeers with diamonds, Ferrari and I'm sure a number of other exclusive manufacturers.

[mailman]

Originally Posted by kwinky

You have never custom ordered a Harley. I know this for a fact because HD doesn't build to order. At some point early in the year the factory commits to a known quanity of each model to the dealer. As a buyer you would be purchasing one of what the dealer is expecting. I suspect Rolex does the same thing. So does Debeers with diamonds, Ferrari and I'm sure a number of other exclusive manufacturers.

You can customize your HD online or at the dealer with accessories from their P&A and SE catalog and have the dealer order it for you

[speedmaster73]

Originally Posted by kwinky

You have never custom ordered a Harley. I know this for a fact because HD doesn't build to order. At some point early in the year the factory commits to a known quanity of each model to the dealer. As a buyer you would be purchasing one of what the dealer is expecting. I suspect Rolex does the same thing. So does Debeers with diamonds, Ferrari and I'm sure a number of other exclusive manufacturers.

not a custom build as per say.....selections from factory build sheet....porsche exact same way....you can buy a box on wheels or fully loaded and everything in between.....

theres always floor inventory.....

i speak from experience buying not because i have connections w harley davidson......porsche as well.....not really a big deal....we both agree they 'control' their sales......difference again being their is no 'grey' harley dealers...

[melrob1]

Originally Posted by speedmaster73

most dont disagree with you. this is correct.however, its 2017 and daytona-cs are NOT scarce....they can be purchased DAILY at an inflated price from resellers....

the grey market etc is much much much bigger today than 2008

basically all rolex has done is create another 'middle' man.....

daytona-c is only rare @ MSRP from an AD....if not one could have tomorrow by end of day no problem. none.....at a premium of course.....

Also a different time. Not as many grays back then and internet has become more prevalent so it may seem like more but probably the same

[melrob1]

Originally Posted by HL65

Also know that many grey dealers are paying premiums from private sellers or members here and selling for even more. Sure they get some from AD's but they get many from private parties both here and other forums.

This is where the majority of the ones the greys have. People will argue that but it's true. I could have flipped mine on the spot for 2500 profit to a gray. Grey would then flip for a nice quick profit. We live in America folks!

[kwinky]

Originally Posted by speedmaster73

not a custom build as per say.....selections from factory build sheet....porsche exact same way....you can buy a box on wheels or fully loaded and everything in between.....

theres always floor inventory.....

i speak from experience buying not because i have connections w harley davidson......porsche as well.....not really a big deal....we both agree they 'control' their sales......difference again being their is no 'grey' harley dealers...

The reason behind a lack of grey market Harleys is because they. don't have a MAP pricing policy like Rolex does. Dealers are free to sell for what ever price they choose. Rolex could halt grey market sales any time they choose. It's an effective way to eliminate excess stock, everyone benefits.

[T. Ferguson]

Originally Posted by Robbyman

Unless your Porsche, who will not make enough GT3 and GT4 to meet demand.

Or 917's or 918's or 911R's.

Frankly, I'm not so disturbed by the grey market getting the D500 even if they are charging a premium. For all we know they PAID over MSRP from their source. Besides, the fact is that most grey dealers are the best customer and have the best relationship with the AD's they source from so if they are getting the watch first well, that's the way it works anyway - the best customers cut in line. The benefit is the grey market at least is providing a more democratic means for anyone that wants one to buy it. I highly doubt that the ceramic stainless Daytona would be readily available if the grey dealers weren't getting them. There would still be wait lists at the authorized dealers. If anything they are more available to the average Joe Blow because of the grey market.

[Robbyman]

Originally Posted by T. Ferguson

Or 917's or 918's or 911R's.



Frankly, I'm not so disturbed by the grey market getting the D500 even if they are charging a premium. For all we know they PAID over MSRP from their source. Besides, the fact is that most grey dealers are the best customer and have the best relationship with the AD's they source from so if they are getting the watch first well, that's the way it works anyway - the best customers cut in line. The benefit is the grey market at least is providing a more democratic means for anyone that wants one to buy it. I highly doubt that the ceramic stainless Daytona would be readily available if the grey dealers weren't getting them There would still be wait lists at the authorized dealers. If anything they are more available to the average Joe Blow because of the grey market.

There is the same amount of Daytona regardless of grey v AD.

All those at grey dealers do not have average Joe owners as you put it, so they cannot therefore be more available, because if they were sold by the AD at retail to the average Joe and not the grey market, then the average Joe would have them and not the grey dealer!!!!!!