Hang Tags

[rufio0811]

for real, let’s say after months, maybe years of obsessing over a grail piece and one day you finally come across a deal on that piece where it’s priced on the lower end of fair market value, you may even trade a few from your collection to attain it, it’s advertised as a “full set” but does not come with the white hang tag. Are you really going to pass on it because it’s missing the hang tag? No you’re not let’s be real, you want that grail piece and the likelihood of finding another at a similar deal is few and far between.

Anyone who says otherwise is posturing.

[moofur]

Originally Posted by rufio0811

for real, let’s say after months, maybe years of obsessing over a grail piece and one day you finally come across a deal on that piece where it’s priced on the lower end of fair market value, you may even trade a few from your collection to attain it, it’s advertised as a “full set” but does not come with the white hang tag. Are you really going to pass on it because it’s missing the hang tag? No you’re not let’s be real, you want that grail piece and the likelihood of finding another at a similar deal is few and far between.

Anyone who says otherwise is posturing.

As others have stated, it depends on the watch. For example, if your grail piece is the John Mayer where the value is all in the dial, an argument can be made that one should not buy it without the white swing tag. Again, the white tag is the only piece of identification that is linked directly to the watch which outlines the model number, serial number, and original configuration of the watch, including what the original dial was. If you’re going to pay tens of thousands for a watch simply because of the dial, many would want it to be original to the watch instead of an after the fact swap. Many would be ok if the dial swap was done by a RSC, but for popular configs like the John Mayer, RSC would not entertain a dial swap, which means if it’s swapped it would definitely be done after the fact independently which makes it a frankenwatch, severely affecting the value.

It’s a shame that many ADs do not supply the white tag anymore, but to say that it has no value especially for unique/in demand pieces like the John Mayer, a Blue dial Dweller and of course, the Le Mans, to say that the white tag has no value is ludicrous, unless you’re a grey dealer trying to push the narrative.

In the OPs case, I think it’s fine since we’re talking about a Sea Dweller, but given that it’s NOS it should have it since ADs withholding the white tag is more of a recent phenomenon.

[acorn]

Originally Posted by moofur

As others have stated, it depends on the watch. For example, if your grail piece is the John Mayer where the value is all in the dial, an argument can be made that one should not buy it without the white swing tag. Again, the white tag is the only piece of identification that is linked directly to the watch which outlines the model number, serial number, and original configuration of the watch, including what the original dial was. If you’re going to pay tens of thousands for a watch simply because of the dial, many would want it to be original to the watch instead of an after the fact swap. Many would be ok if the dial swap was done by a RSC, but for popular configs like the John Mayer, RSC would not entertain a dial swap, which means if it’s swapped it would definitely be done after the fact independently which makes it a frankenwatch, severely affecting the value.

It’s a shame that many ADs do not supply the white tag anymore, but to say that it has no value especially for unique/in demand pieces like the John Mayer, a Blue dial Dweller and of course, the Le Mans, to say that the white tag has no value is ludicrous, unless you’re a grey dealer trying to push the narrative.

In the OPs case, I think it’s fine since we’re talking about a Sea Dweller, but given that it’s NOS it should have it since ADs withholding the white tag is more of a recent phenomenon.

Where does one find an authentic green Daytona dial? Honestly

[moofur]

Originally Posted by acorn

Where does one find an authentic green Daytona dial? Honestly

It was an example. And stranger things have happened. Fraudsters go to great lengths to make money. Perhaps the authentic John Mayer was in really poor condition so they swapped out the green dial and put it into another all gold Daytona that was in pristine condition. They might end up with a higher return this way.

[acorn]

Originally Posted by moofur

It was an example. And stranger things have happened. Fraudsters go to great lengths to make money. Perhaps the authentic John Mayer was in really poor condition so they swapped out the green dial and put it into another all gold Daytona that was in pristine condition. They might end up with a higher return this way.

Yeah, and maybe Rolex will switch all the yellow gold Daytonas to green when they buy them for CPO. This white hang tag topic is simply hilarious with all these genius scam possibilities

[rufio0811]

Originally Posted by moofur

As others have stated, it depends on the watch. For example, if your grail piece is the John Mayer where the value is all in the dial, an argument can be made that one should not buy it without the white swing tag. Again, the white tag is the only piece of identification that is linked directly to the watch which outlines the model number, serial number, and original configuration of the watch, including what the original dial was. If you’re going to pay tens of thousands for a watch simply because of the dial, many would want it to be original to the watch instead of an after the fact swap. Many would be ok if the dial swap was done by a RSC, but for popular configs like the John Mayer, RSC would not entertain a dial swap, which means if it’s swapped it would definitely be done after the fact independently which makes it a frankenwatch, severely affecting the value.

It’s a shame that many ADs do not supply the white tag anymore, but to say that it has no value especially for unique/in demand pieces like the John Mayer, a Blue dial Dweller and of course, the Le Mans, to say that the white tag has no value is ludicrous, unless you’re a grey dealer trying to push the narrative.

In the OPs case, I think it’s fine since we’re talking about a Sea Dweller, but given that it’s NOS it should have it since ADs withholding the white tag is more of a recent phenomenon.

If you’re buying a high ticket item like that and it’s not from a reputable dealer, that’s on you. It’s a strawmanning & posturing.

[moofur]

Originally Posted by acorn

Yeah, and maybe Rolex will switch all the yellow gold Daytonas to green when they buy them for CPO. This white hang tag topic is simply hilarious with all these genius scam possibilities

I've actually seen people post this happening on XHS (China's version of Instagram) numerous times, so yes it does happen. One was a John Mayer with a dial swap.

This whole "white tag doesn't matter" is pushed by greys for the obvious reason that ADs have implemented this to deter greys and make their inventory less appealing and harder to sell in some cases.

[KatGirl]

Originally Posted by Hardtimes

Okay, folks, I am at a loss. Unless you are a flipper who really gives a rat's behind

People who want to make sure they are getting their watch as originally configured by Rolex. There are a lot of folks selling brand new watches with aftermarket dial swaps. All mine have the white hang tag.

Kat


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[acorn]

Originally Posted by moofur

I've actually seen people post this happening on XHS (China's version of Instagram) numerous times, so yes it does happen. One was a John Mayer with a dial swap.

This whole "white tag doesn't matter" is pushed by greys for the obvious reason that ADs have implemented this to deter greys and make their inventory less appealing and harder to sell in some cases.

Oh on China’s instagram? That settles it

If ADs aren’t giving out the tags then it’s just the people who somehow got tags who are pushing this nonsense that they mean anything

[KatGirl]

Originally Posted by Harry-57

Sure, if a buyer wants a "full set" with all the tags there are plenty available, but the white tag is not supposed to leave the AD with the watch. This throws up another variable - how can the buyer of a used "full set" be certain that the white tag supplied originally came with the watch being sold.

While the green tag is supplied with every Rolex, it is the Superlative Chronometer Certification and therefore import. It can be had from a variety of sellers on line, but so can a white tag.

It has the watches serial number imbedded…..

Kat


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[KatGirl]

Originally Posted by Harry-57

Sure, if a buyer wants a "full set" with all the tags there are plenty available, but the white tag is not supposed to leave the AD with the watch. This throws up another variable - how can the buyer of a used "full set" be certain that the white tag supplied originally came with the watch being sold.

While the green tag is supplied with every Rolex, it is the Superlative Chronometer Certification and therefore import. It can be had from a variety of sellers on line, but so can a white tag.

Apparently, in the US some ADs routinely provide them, and others claim they are not supposed to provide them, per Rolex. Mine always includes them.

Kat


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[acorn]

Originally Posted by KatGirl

People who want to make sure they are getting their watch as originally configured by Rolex. There are a lot of folks selling brand new watches with aftermarket dial swaps. All mine have the white hang tag.

Kat


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Fake dials are harder to make than fake plastic tags. As I said above, people who got tags from the AD are the ones pushing this “authentic “ story, like you’ve just done.

Rolex CPO has these little plastic pieces, yes or no? Does that mean Rolex CPO is not to be trusted?

[acorn]

Originally Posted by KatGirl

It has the watches serial number imbedded…..

Kat


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Originally Posted by KatGirl

Apparently, in the US some ADs routinely provide them, and others claim they are not supposed to provide them, per Rolex. Mine always includes them.

Kat


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The watch has a serial number, it can be completely checked by them without a little piece of plastic, which is not ever needed for service.

Yes, you have the sacred tags, we know

[KatGirl]

Originally Posted by acorn

Fake dials are harder to make than fake plastic tags. As I said above, people who got tags from the AD are the ones pushing this “authentic “ story, like you’ve just done.

Rolex CPO has these little plastic pieces, yes or no? Does that mean Rolex CPO is not to be trusted?

We aren’t talking about CPO, but rather “brand new Rolexes with complete sets”. CPO watches are all at least three years old, and have been inspected and certified as all original by Rolex, have had a full servicea and include a separate CPO 2 year warranty card.

Kat


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[acorn]

Originally Posted by KatGirl

We aren’t talking about CPO, but rather “brand new Rolexes with complete sets”. CPO watches are all at least three years old, and have been inspected and certified as all original by Rolex, have had a full servicea and include a separate CPO 2 year warranty card.

Kat


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And no precious little tag

[moofur]

Originally Posted by acorn

Oh on China’s instagram? That settles it

If ADs aren’t giving out the tags then it’s just the people who somehow got tags who are pushing this nonsense that they mean anything

You do realize that the Chinese are one of the largest purchasers of Rolexes worldwide and that China is either the #1 or #2 market for Rolexes right? Your post reeks of sheer ignorance.

And no it's not called "Chinese Instagram" but it's an analogy cause that's the closest to it. The amount of information and knowledge that is shared on there is probably on par if not better than a lot of the information that you would see on Western social media simply because of the number of affluent Chinese globally.

[moofur]

Originally Posted by acorn

And no precious little tag

Her point is that CPOs are sold by Rolex ADs, and they go through the rigorous process of inspection and background checks to ensure that the watch has not been tampered with and not "frankenstein" per se. Grey dealers do not have access to the same information and database that the Crown does.

If you don't understand that difference then I can't help you. If you think that the value of the "white tag" is pushed by people who have white tags, fair enough, but on the same token the idea that these white tags are unimportant are pushed by Greys who have a vested interest to push the narrative if the fact that ADs aren't giving them out anymore is to make it harder for them to do business without it.

[KatGirl]

Originally Posted by acorn

And no precious little tag

Rolex only includes the white hang tags with brand new watches. The CPO program only sells used watches. I guess you didn’t understand me.

Kat


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[k3nnis]

I’m in Australia and both my recent Rolex purchases, explorer 1 and DJ 36, it did not come with the white tag. Both AD’s kept them.

[KatGirl]

Originally Posted by acorn

The watch has a serial number, it can be completely checked by them without a little piece of plastic, which is not ever needed for service.

Yes, you have the sacred tags, we know

Who said it was needed for service? There is a YouTube video, where a female shows what a customer should expect in a complete box set, when buying a brand new Rolex. The white hang tag was part of her teaching video. I am glad I have them in my complete sets.

Kat


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[acorn]

Originally Posted by moofur

Her point is that CPOs are sold by Rolex ADs, and they go through the rigorous process of inspection and background checks to ensure that the watch has not been tampered with and not "frankenstein" per se. Grey dealers do not have access to the same information and database that the Crown does.

If you don't understand that difference then I can't help you. If you think that the value of the "white tag" is pushed by people who have white tags, fair enough, but on the same token the idea that these white tags are unimportant are pushed by Greys who have a vested interest to push the narrative if the fact that ADs aren't giving them out anymore is to make it harder for them to do business without it.

Exactly the same when they sell new watches and if the AD gives you the sacred tag or not it doesn’t matter.

Originally Posted by KatGirl

Rolex only includes the white hang tags with brand new watches. The CPO program only sells used watches. I guess you didn’t understand me.

Kat


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ADs include the tags or not, Rolex doesn’t and don’t for the CPO. It’s crazy how some people have chosen this little piece of plastic hill to die on. Enjoy your tags

[moofur]

Originally Posted by acorn

Exactly the same when they sell new watches and if the AD gives you the sacred tag or not it doesn’t matter.

No one said that the white tags are a make or break for all watches and in all circumstances. What people are saying is that the white tag is an added insurance policy to ensure that the watch is sold to you in its original configuration. It's an additional peace of mind when you're spending $70K USD on a John Mayer Daytona for example. The value of it is most likely higher for unique pieces like that and less so for say a SS sub, SD, etc.

I think another issue is that you seem to equate greys with ADs. No matter how reputable the grey dealer is, they are not an AD and do not have access to the same information, knowledge (in theory at least), and database that an AD would have. When you buy from an AD, you are basically guaranteed that the watch is genuine and not tampered with. If it is, you are protected and Rolex will make you whole. The same cannot be said of ANY Grey Dealer no matter how reputable. There is always a risk and it is always higher than buying from an AD.

ADs include the tags or not, Rolex doesn’t and don’t for the CPO. It’s crazy how some people have chosen this little piece of plastic hill to die on. Enjoy your tags

Again, Greys are not ADs, see above.

[acorn]

Originally Posted by KatGirl

Who said it was needed for service?

Kat


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It seems I’ve entered into one of your back and forths.

I raised it as an example of how no one will ever need the little piece of plastic that has nothing to do with how good or authentic your watch is. Won’t ever be needed for anyone’s enjoyment who actually cares about the Rolex watch itself.

[moofur]

Originally Posted by k3nnis

I’m in Australia and both my recent Rolex purchases, explorer 1 and DJ 36, it did not come with the white tag. Both AD’s kept them.

I'm finding that some ADs are actually putting a lot of the information on the official purchase receipt instead, which would have the letterhead of the AD, address, etc., including S/N and the original configuration of the watch. That would serve the same purpose. Perhaps that is what they're doing instead if we're really going the way of withholding the white tags.

[k3nnis]

Originally Posted by moofur

I'm finding that some ADs are actually putting a lot of the information on the official purchase receipt instead, which would have the letterhead of the AD, address, etc., including S/N and the original configuration of the watch. That would serve the same purpose. Perhaps that is what they're doing instead if we're really going the way of withholding the white tags.

Yes you’re right. I looked up the invoice and it has the serial number on it. Cheers.


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[OldLume]

Wow, this is better than the Do They Sell Exhibition Watches thread.

[acorn]

Originally Posted by moofur

No one said that the white tags are a make or break for all watches and in all circumstances. What people are saying is that the white tag is an added insurance policy to ensure that the watch is sold to you in its original configuration. It's an additional peace of mind when you're spending $70K USD on a John Mayer Daytona for example. The value of it is most likely higher for unique pieces like that and less so for say a SS sub, SD, etc.

I think another issue is that you seem to equate greys with ADs. No matter how reputable the grey dealer is, they are not an AD and do not have access to the same information, knowledge (in theory at least), and database that an AD would have. When you buy from an AD, you are basically guaranteed that the watch is genuine and not tampered with. If it is, you are protected and Rolex will make you whole. The same cannot be said of ANY Grey Dealer no matter how reputable. There is always a risk and it is always higher than buying from an AD.




Again, Greys are not ADs, see above.

It has no value at all. It gives no added insurance. It is a cheap piece of plastic that is child’s play to fake.

This topic is actually incredibly illuminating about how Rolex has degenerated into something that has nothing to do with owning a Rolex watch. I’m 200% with Padi and SearChart on the topic and I hope that people who are obsessed with these little tags can liberate themselves and enjoy WATCHES

[KatGirl]

Originally Posted by acorn

Exactly the same when they sell new watches and if the AD gives you the sacred tag or not it doesn’t matter.




ADs include the tags or not, Rolex doesn’t and don’t for the CPO. It’s crazy how some people have chosen this little piece of plastic hill to die on. Enjoy your tags

Read up on what the CPO program is. it’s for 3 years or older Rolex watches. The white hang tags are produced when brand new Rolexes are manufactured. They are a nonissue with CPO watches. The CPO warranty cards guarantee that the watches are all original, not franken, in any way.


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[moofur]

Originally Posted by acorn

It has no value at all. It gives no added insurance. It is a cheap piece of plastic that is child’s play to fake.

This topic is actually incredibly illuminating about how Rolex has degenerated into something that has nothing to do with owning a Rolex watch. I’m 200% with Padi and SearChart on the topic and I hope that people who are obsessed with these little tags can liberate themselves and enjoy WATCHES

If you and others truly believe that the white tag is "worthless" ask yourself what and others would do if there were two John Mayers side by side that are both BNIB with the same date, one with the white tag and the other without. The same goes for other pieces like the Celebration dial.

If it truly was worthless they would be equally attractive to a buyer who is in the market for one. However, I'm willing to bet that 99% of buyers would choose the one with the white tag if they are the same price. Heck, I would be willing to bet that most buyers would pay a premium (however small) to have the white tag.

[moofur]

Originally Posted by k3nnis

Yes you’re right. I looked up the invoice and it has the serial number on it. Cheers.


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I have a feeling that they're going this way because it serves the same purpose but deters greys at the same time since 9/10 grey market watches do not have the original purchase receipt, the reason being that people who sell it to greys usually don't want to give them the original receipt since it has a lot of their personal information.