Rolex buying "experience" has left me kinda sour

[joe100]

The frustration is real, I get it. It wasn’t this way in the past, and the games are real. However, I also understand the other side of it. If a person has spent a lot of money at an AD, they should get first refusal on the hot watches, that’s just fair. Sometimes folks get lucky and get a Pepsi or Daytona having never spent a dime at that AD, but that’s an outlier.

I haven’t spent tons with my AD so obviously I’m far down the list, fair is fair after all. While I don’t have status with an AD, I do with certain other “hobbies” and you bet your booty when new things come up, I expect early allocation.

This whole thing is frustrating, but flip it around and democratize the process and one creates a whole new raft of issues and frustrations. The current system is annoying, but it does favor those who have been playing the long game, whether it be spending or waiting.

[6SpeedTA95]

Originally Posted by bluestreak

I’m going to come out and say I don’t believe the OP. Sure a GMT is hard to get, that part is true. But those prices he’s quoting are outrageous.

Also, I doubt a reseller is going to out his connection by naming them. Much less admitting that split the proceeds. And saying the AD will verify this to someone who buys grey? Come on…

People believe this because they are inclined to dislike Rolex because they can’t get a watch. But seriously people.

Also, why does everyone want the same 5 watches? OPs, Explorers, Datejusts, even Subs terrific are attainable after reasonable waits if you shop around. Not to mention the multitudes of other watches that are fantastic. I’d buy one of those before getting angry that I can’t get a GMT or a Daytona. Everyone wants the same watch. Not everyone is going to get one.

Also, I love how people are calling grey sellers “dishonest,” and “sleazy” or “greasy.”
Most of these people have a product, clearly mark the price, and will send you a genuine watch and usually stand by their product. Where is the dishonesty and sleaze in that?

People’s brains are addled by not being able to get a watch.

They are insane prices but in touristy areas I guess it's par for the course? I dunno, in one case he said he'd had the Rootbeer for 18 months and I thought to myself ....yeah I know why. Whether or not you believe me is up to you, but I don't know why someone would lie about their frustrations on a forum. But hey you do you.

[bluestreak]

Originally Posted by 6SpeedTA95

They are insane prices but in touristy areas I guess it's par for the course? I dunno, in one case he said he'd had the Rootbeer for 18 months and I thought to myself ....yeah I know why. Whether or not you believe me is up to you, but I don't know why someone would lie about their frustrations on a forum. But hey you do you.

People lie on the forum all the time. It’s the internet. I don’t know why people do what they do. But coming here to complain about ADs will certainly get someone validation…


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[7enderbender]

Originally Posted by Kevin of Larchmont

I’m going to make a generalization and say we are all capitalists here, that we all have the luxury of contributing to a Rolex forum because we collectively do well as a group. So why is it that while capitalism has empowered us to enjoy the brand so many of us become socialists when it comes to acquiring the brand and demand transparency and equality above all else?

As has been discussed here Rolex dealer margins are small while their infrastructure requirements are high. The Rolex brand provides their dealer network with a powerful draw to bring clients into their stores. Rolex has very stringent requirements for their ADs and as long as those requirements are met then the ADs have free rein to administrate the brand in their stores. Clearly some do it more appealingly others.

This isn’t bread and water, none of us deserve a Rolex or any other toy or bauble that we want whenever we want it. To wave the banner of fairness while we buy multiples of luxury watches is absurd, maybe insane. To paraphrase another poster, capitalism is a rough sport. But history shows that socialism is rougher.

Demanding transparency has nothing to do with socialism - one of the worst and deadliest ideas ever. All I’m saying is it’s a two way street. Somebody has a product that is in high demand which dictates wait lists and higher prices? No
problem there. As a consumer I have a choice. When I don’t know what my choice actually is that’s bad business. I don’t ask for “fairness” (I tell my kids and my employees that there is no such thing). And again, this is not a Rolex problem in the sense that they behave that way. But they have not come up with an alternative and let more or less shady “ADs” damage the brand.

I’m on a few waitlists. I have money set aside. And yes, there are a few other watch brands I like and I may just go somewhere else eventually. And I’m sure this is true for a lot of people. At the moment it makes no difference to Rolex. That could change quickly. And then people will remember that. It would be capitalism to invest in long term satisfaction and reputation. They need to run the stores. They need to run the order process.
Free markets have non-tangible components, especially in the luxury market. I’m not buying from a “grey” dealer, no matter the price. If I buy a new watch I want it from the source.

[bluestreak]

Originally Posted by 7enderbender

Demanding transparency has nothing to do with socialism - one of the worst and deadliest ideas ever. All I’m saying is it’s a two way street. Somebody has a product that is in high demand which dictates wait lists and higher prices? No
problem there. As a consumer I have a choice. When I don’t know what my choice actually is that’s bad business. I don’t ask for “fairness” (I tell my kids and my employees that there is no such thing). And again, this is not a Rolex problem in the sense that they behave that way. But they have not come up with an alternative and let more or less shady “ADs” damage the brand.

I’m on a few waitlists. I have money set aside. And yes, there are a few other watch brands I like and I may just go somewhere else eventually. And I’m sure this is true for a lot of people. At the moment it makes no difference to Rolex. That could change quickly. And then people will remember that. It would be capitalism to invest in long term satisfaction and reputation. They need to run the stores. They need to run the order process.
Free markets have non-tangible components, especially in the luxury market. I’m not buying from a “grey” dealer, no matter the price. If I buy a new watch I want it from the source.

You do have a choice: wait for a watch that may or may not come, or take your business elsewhere. That’s pretty transparent to me. And I fully understand that option 1 is unacceptable to many people. And understandably so. But it’s unclear to me why the AD owes someone any more transparency than that. If they were taking people’s money, that’s one thing. But otherwise they are asking for no commitment from you in return for no commitment from them.

[KatGirl]

Originally Posted by 7enderbender

Demanding transparency has nothing to do with socialism - one of the worst and deadliest ideas ever. All I’m saying is it’s a two way street. Somebody has a product that is in high demand which dictates wait lists and higher prices? No
problem there. As a consumer I have a choice. When I don’t know what my choice actually is that’s bad business. I don’t ask for “fairness” (I tell my kids and my employees that there is no such thing). And again, this is not a Rolex problem in the sense that they behave that way. But they have not come up with an alternative and let more or less shady “ADs” damage the brand.

I’m on a few waitlists. I have money set aside. And yes, there are a few other watch brands I like and I may just go somewhere else eventually. And I’m sure this is true for a lot of people. At the moment it makes no difference to Rolex. That could change quickly. And then people will remember that. It would be capitalism to invest in long term satisfaction and reputation. They need to run the stores. They need to run the order process.
Free markets have non-tangible components, especially in the luxury market. I’m not buying from a “grey” dealer, no matter the price. If I buy a new watch I want it from the source.

Things may change somewhat, with their acquisition of Bucherer. It’s likely some of the smaller Mom and Pop ADs will lose their AD status, in areas where Bucherer exists. To me, that would be a shame. From what I’ve heard, on here, it is mostly those very same smaller family owned ADs that are providing great service, and treating customers right. It certainly is the case with my own AD.

Kat


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[Hulkhunter]

Originally Posted by Eagles

Had some time to kill whilst in Glasgow a few days ago and checked out several watch shops / boutiques (fwiw Glasgow is fantastic for watch shopping)

Both Rolex boutiques were a severe let down. In one I got told a GMT “is impossible” and felt like I was an irritation to the SA, whilst in the other the sales staff were legitimately so rude I couldn’t wait to leave. I could kinda of expect that treatment if it was busy but I was one of about four people in there.

Stark contrast to the other brand shops I walked into where all staff were so friendly and accommodating it’s a wonder anyone wants a Rolex anymore.

Sad state of affairs!

The reason the other stores Rolled out the red carpet is because they have many watches in stock they are struggling to sell.
They are hoping you will take something off their hands thus the special treatment.

Contrast that to the Rolex AD. You are one of 30 guys who have been in that day trying to get their hands on a Batman/Pepsi that they could allocate 1000 times over. You would get the same treatment at the Rolex Ad if asked for a watch they had available that they were struggling to shift.

Go in and ask for a Skydweller on oysterflex, a WG sub or RG GMT and see how different it is.

However, I will say you should still get treated with respect regardless.

[huncho]

another thread where the OP wants the same watch everyone else wants but thinks he deserves it more than everyone else. great

[bluestreak]

Originally Posted by Hulkhunter

The reason the other stores Rolled out the red carpet is because they have many watches in stock they are struggling to sell.
They are hoping you will take something off their hands thus the special treatment.

Contrast that to the Rolex AD. You are one of 30 guys who have been in that day trying to get their hands on a Batman/Pepsi that they could allocate 1000 times over. You would get the same treatment at the Rolex Ad if asked for a watch they had available that they were struggling to shift.

Go in and ask for a Skydweller on oysterflex, a WG sub or RG GMT and see how different it is.

However, I will say you should still get treated with respect regardless.

Hell, go into the omega boutique and ask for the Ed White Speedmaster.

[the dark knight]

I get the frustration, but the insinuation that other brands/ADs are any better is wrong. If they can play the game, they do.

I walked into the IWC boutique last year inquiring about the re-released Genta Ingenieur and they told me it was going to be a very limited piece and that I would need some purchase history to get one. I laughed (as I'm sure many others did) and walked out. I visited again recently and they had each steel dial in stock and was even offered a 10% discount.

Zenith AD tried to pull the same crap when the Chronomaster Sport was released a couple of years ago. And of course Omega with the Snoopy and EW Speedmasters.

And it's well documented what higher end brands like Patek and AP do.

[2loaded]

Originally Posted by huncho

another thread where the OP wants the same watch everyone else wants but thinks he deserves it more than everyone else. great

Tough love, but I do agree with you.

[4reRlxGuy]

Been a collector since the early 90s but the experiences I've had the last 2-3 years with Rolex, Patek, and AP have made consider walking a away.

Life is too short for games on items that are entirely not needed for survival

[Eagles]

Originally Posted by Hulkhunter

The reason the other stores Rolled out the red carpet is because they have many watches in stock they are struggling to sell.
They are hoping you will take something off their hands thus the special treatment.

Contrast that to the Rolex AD. You are one of 30 guys who have been in that day trying to get their hands on a Batman/Pepsi that they could allocate 1000 times over. You would get the same treatment at the Rolex Ad if asked for a watch they had available that they were struggling to shift.

Go in and ask for a Skydweller on oysterflex, a WG sub or RG GMT and see how different it is.

However, I will say you should still get treated with respect regardless.

Fully aware of scarcity of stock…

The last line of your post is what I’m driving at. Aloofness / rudeness isn’t going to engender people to the brand!

[Daveh777]

I can relate to virtually all comments. Once you come to terms with the emotional (and justified) response, you can move on with things and be a whole lot more objective. It all comes down to how much you want a certain Watch model; years ago I told myself for several years that the watches I was buying were great substitutes for the Rolex Sub I always wanted.
FALSE!
I would have been better off focusing on what I really wanted all along.

[L_S_SHOE]

Take a look at discontinued and vintage references. More fun to learn about and collect, and you won’t have to waste your time and money with some kid at the AD.


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[SLWoodster]

I've been where you are. AD missed multiple important events of mine. Unfortunately it's a mass market brand and just too many customers. If I were Rolex... It doesn't need to wake up. They're doing really great.

It's unfortunate. But your frustration is in trying to buy THAT Rolex instead of "a" Rolex.

Remember you are also one of the consumers giving them the power to do that. Your desire for these helps fuel the secondary market.

By the way the wholesale pricing for a gray market 2023-2024 Rootbeer is near retail+tax.

Originally Posted by 6SpeedTA95

Hi everyone, I guess I'm here to vent supreme frustrations with the whole "experience" of trying to buy a Rolex. I'm not definitely not the first with these issues but I guess it just kinda culminated into a crescendo this week and my frustrations have boiled over and finally reached the breaking point.

Been trying to get a GMT Master II for quite some time. Tried to get a Rolex 39mm Explorer locally the year I turned 40, that was a mess. I walked in about 9 months before my birthday, they had one on Display I knew sometimes there was a wait so I asked if it was available he said no, I asked to get on the list he said ok. He supposedly took down my phone number and my email. I followed up a few times and then it was discontinued.

I don't want a 36mm so I went into a holding pattern and just focused my efforts on a GMT. This guy never followed up, always wanted to show me Tag's, Nomos (I actually like Nomos) and a few others. I politely declined. Got on the list of the same stuff at another location because I was told even though it's the same dealer they treat each location independently.

So I got on the list for a 40mm Explorer when it was announced, as Rootbeer and a Batman. Every time I'm in I get asked to buy something I don't want, I get told it's the fastest way to "Move up the list". So I had a buddy make an introduction to the AD he uses a few hundred miles away. In short order (6 weeks) I had my 40mm Explorer. That was a good experience but the AD is quite small. Their number of display pieces is between 8 and 12 every time I'm in there, it's a tiny shop. But they're great to deal with. Needless to say I also asked about the Rootbeer and Batman.

I've since hit another career milestone that I planned to celebrate with a watch, the reason I got on the list for the Rootbeer! Needless to say no Rootbeer obviously.

This week on vacation we've visited a couple of Rolex ADs along with numerous other jewelers and watch shops. I've found several Rootbeers, Batman's and Pepsi's for sale. On a couple of occasions I've walked it down the aisle to see/gather information. The cheapest Rootbeer was $26,800, most of them were right around 30k. All the Pepsi's regardless of shop were $30k for the modern rendition, I did find a 10-12 year old piece that was 22k. The Batman's were 21-23k. One individual flat and told me his pieces are from an AD but he sells them and splits the profits with the AD, he offered to show me the warranty cards and the information on all the pieces as well as letting me contact the AD if we decided to proceed, that way I could verify warranty information. This is when I basically decided what the hell am I doing? On a list, trying to get a company to take my money? Being pushed all kinds of other garbage or getting told I can buy what I want at 60-80% markups? It's just insanity.


In the meantime I've found several pieces that I love, IWC, Zenith and Omega (Omega is probably my personal favorite to begin with) have some great stuff. All of these great pieces are available right now, the dealers actually treat you like you matter and like you're a paying customer. They break open champaign when you buy a new piece, they call you a week or two later to see how you like it, etc, etc, etc.

Most importantly the Omega piece I found is absolutely stunning and I know the place I normally buy my watches from will do it for a certain price. If they match it here I might do it to commemorate the trip with the family and my career milestone. I'd never seen it in person before this week but wow it's a looker.

Rolex needs to wake up, I know for a fact I'm not the only one that feels this way and they're turning off an entire generation of affluent buyers who value their own time and personal likes/dislikes and don't want to deal with bullshit. The watch company that's done a great job building a brand and building some timeless pieces along the way needs to get their AD network under control.

[2000-NJDEVILS]

Originally Posted by huncho

another thread where the OP wants the same watch everyone else wants but thinks he deserves it more than everyone else. great

I was gonna say the exact same thing……..

[6172crew]

I’m in the same boat so to speak. A couple of years ago I was told I needed to be a customer, not a watch customer.

I bought my wife a few things and was told I would be getting a BLNR Batman or Batgirl, but he knew I wanted the BLRO. Even today I was told the BLNR should be here next month. The BLNR is a sweet watch and I’d be proud to own and wear it.

By chance I visited another AD near by and the guy didn’t seem to think the BLRO is out of reach and seemed to think he could get me one. At that time he offered me a Daytona two tone which is a bit too busy for me but really liked the looks and feel enough that I see why it’s popular. The bad part of this whole thing is the ADs are owned by the same company so you aren’t getting 2 higher end watches right now so should I just pass on the Batman or wear it until things cool off and the Pepsi models start showing up.
Either way, I feel your pain.

[Watchman001]

Move on from Rolex. Their peak was in the 5 digit era. Get neovintage or buy another brand.

[bluestreak]

Originally Posted by huncho

another thread where the OP wants the same watch everyone else wants but thinks he deserves it more than everyone else. great

QFT


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[Watchman001]

Guess some people missed this part of the OP:

« One individual flat and told me his pieces are from an AD but he sells them and splits the profits with the AD, he offered to show me the warranty cards and the information on all the pieces as well as letting me contact the AD if we decided to proceed, that way I could verify warranty information. This is when I basically decided what the hell am I doing? On a list, trying to get a company to take my money? Being pushed all kinds of other garbage or getting told I can buy what I want at 60-80% markups? It's just insanity.l »

Not exactly an unfounded complaint, or a sense of entitlement.

[Zach69SS]

They all do it now, all the major brands, the bundles and offerings of something you don’t want to get what you want, if you get it? To me it’s stupid take care of the customer and sell them what they want if available or with a reasonable wait. Then as they become a customer most people with buy other things later especially a watch enthusiast, with customers you never know? Start a history with a new client it may work for both.

The wait list thing is total BS and is on its way out. The market has changed and the demand is not there anymore with some exceptions, Daytona SS, Pepsi and a few others.
I see big trouble for the PM pieces they will have to discount them or bundle them somehow.

[the dark knight]

Originally Posted by Zach69SS

They all do it now, all the major brands, the bundles and offerings of something you don’t want to get what you want, if you get it? To me it’s stupid take care of the customer and sell them what they want if available or with a reasonable wait. Then as they become a customer most people with buy other things later especially a watch enthusiast, with customers you never know? Start a history with a new client it may work for both.

The wait list thing is total BS and is on its way out. The market has changed and the demand is not there anymore with some exceptions, Daytona SS, Pepsi and a few others.
I see big trouble for the PM pieces they will have to discount them or bundle them somehow.

I was speculating on another thread they are probably already bundling out PMs to grey market dealers and packaging steel sports, one reason why despite the market downturn it's still so hard to get steel sports at the AD.

[Torshalla]

The loval Omega boutique (WoS) openly ask for buying other watches to potentially be able to buy harder to get watches… something my Rolex AD does not… it is down to the actual individual dealers and not the brands…


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[Neil McCauley]

Originally Posted by Watchman001

Move on from Rolex. Their peak was in the 5 digit era. Get neovintage or buy another brand.

Great advice, I literally just threw all my 11 and 12 references away, thanks to this well-rounded and thought-provoking guidance.

[Neil McCauley]

Originally Posted by L_S_SHOE

Take a look at discontinued and vintage references. More fun to learn about and collect, and you won’t have to waste your time and money with some kid at the AD.


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For me personally, I've been there, tried that, I didn't like the fact that it's a complete minefield. Slimy dealers can basically make up prices, and you have to wade through swathes of watches that don't meet what you're looking for, along with originality and quality being a problem. Bracelets often feel like crap, and that's not what I expect when I'm used to the later models.

I understand why some people want to do that and that's fine, I suppose for them, part of the fun is the waiting and searching to find that right piece. However, I think it's fair to appreciate that some people just don't want vintage, and they would rather have a new watch, not owned by anyone else, so they can put their own mark on it.

[bluestreak]

Originally Posted by Watchman001

Guess some people missed this part of the OP:

« One individual flat and told me his pieces are from an AD but he sells them and splits the profits with the AD, he offered to show me the warranty cards and the information on all the pieces as well as letting me contact the AD if we decided to proceed, that way I could verify warranty information. This is when I basically decided what the hell am I doing? On a list, trying to get a company to take my money? Being pushed all kinds of other garbage or getting told I can buy what I want at 60-80% markups? It's just insanity.l »

Not exactly an unfounded complaint, or a sense of entitlement.

I find it difficult to believe an AD is going to field questions about a watch sold by a reseller.


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[Oxfordian]

Originally Posted by 6SpeedTA95

IWC, Zenith and Omega (Omega is probably my personal favorite to begin with) have some great stuff. All of these great pieces are available right now, the dealers actually treat you like you matter and like you're a paying customer. They break open champaign when you buy a new piece, they call you a week or two later to see how you like it, etc, etc, etc.

Most importantly the Omega piece I found is absolutely stunning and I know the place I normally buy my watches from will do it for a certain price. If they match it here I might do it to commemorate the trip with the family and my career milestone. I'd never seen it in person before this week but wow it's a looker.

Rolex make great watches, they are highly sought after and although a million plus new Rolex watches come onto the market each year it is not enough to satisfy the demand.

What you have found is that there are other companies out there who make brilliant watches as well, in many respects they are the equal or better of Rolex, I particularly like the Omega Planet Ocean line up and have my eye on one to add to my collection.

Whilst IWC, Zenith, Omega and others have top quality watches they do not have the pull that owning a Rolex brings, as a result the watches are often more readily available.

I am more than happy with my Omega watches I certainly don't feel as though they are less of a watch because they're not a Rolex.

[KatGirl]

Originally Posted by Oxfordian

Rolex make great watches, they are highly sought after and although a million plus new Rolex watches come onto the market each year it is not enough to satisfy the demand.

What you have found is that there are other companies out there who make brilliant watches as well, in many respects they are the equal or better of Rolex, I particularly like the Omega Planet Ocean line up and have my eye on one to add to my collection.

Whilst IWC, Zenith, Omega and others have top quality watches they do not have the pull that owning a Rolex brings, as a result the watches are often more readily available.

I am more than happy with my Omega watches I certainly don't feel as though they are less of a watch because they're not a Rolex.

Ahh, but so many people DO and therein lies the problem!

Kat


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[6SpeedTA95]

Originally Posted by bluestreak

I find it difficult to believe an AD is going to field questions about a watch sold by a reseller.


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I wondered the same thing, I didn't walk it down the aisle that far, didn't have time, wasn't going to go grey, but it did piss me off.