Bad sign, serial number issue :(

[andrewjb88]

Rolex should have a global service that you can pay to check before purchasing.

[johnsonsxusfrt]

Originally Posted by andrewjb88

Rolex should have a global service that you can pay to check before purchasing.

Yeah, that service is letting people register their watches online like AP does.

[KenV]

Hi,

I have received a response from Rolex Köln to the email I sent them last week. I am glad that Rolex took the time to reply. It appears I will get an official letter detailing the theft. If I need to hire a lawyer, I can give them these documents. I have not had a response to the email I sent Chrono24 yet, and no response back from the manager of the Munich store. I was told they would be returning this week.

Translation of the email from Rolex. (I removed the name of my local AD since they are just caught in the middle)
-------------------------------------------
We regret to hear of the circumstances that have arisen for you.

In this context, I would first like to point out that Rolex does not release any information about the theft entries to third parties. The online portal you mentioned therefore does not communicate any official data from Rolex.

As you did not hand in the watch in person, we ask for your understanding that we cannot give you any detailed information due to the GDPR. However, we can confirm the information from (my local AD) that an international theft has been reported for this watch and will be picked up by the police this week. We will send the seizure report with a corresponding letter to the (my local AD) and they will certainly contact you regarding the handover of the documents.

We hope that this information can help and remain with best regards from Cologne.
----------------------------------

Ken

[madsitalia]

Originally Posted by KenV

Hi,

I have received a response from Rolex Köln to the email I sent them last week. I am glad that Rolex took the time to reply. It appears I will get an official letter detailing the theft. If I need to hire a lawyer, I can give them these documents. I have not had a response to the email I sent Chrono24 yet, and no response back from the manager of the Munich store. I was told they would be returning this week.

Translation of the email from Rolex. (I removed the name of my local AD since they are just caught in the middle)
-------------------------------------------
We regret to hear of the circumstances that have arisen for you.

In this context, I would first like to point out that Rolex does not release any information about the theft entries to third parties. The online portal you mentioned therefore does not communicate any official data from Rolex.

As you did not hand in the watch in person, we ask for your understanding that we cannot give you any detailed information due to the GDPR. However, we can confirm the information from (my local AD) that an international theft has been reported for this watch and will be picked up by the police this week. We will send the seizure report with a corresponding letter to the (my local AD) and they will certainly contact you regarding the handover of the documents.

We hope that this information can help and remain with best regards from Cologne.
----------------------------------

Ken

Any news on this? Fingers crossed for you

[Mr. K]

Ken, great news. Glad it worked out. Although a huge hassle.

[londondude]

Great news! Really happy it worked out as well as it could given the circumstances.

[madsitalia]

Awesome news.

[Boopie]

Great news! Thanks for the updates.

I was wondering if you insured your watch…my insurance company asks for the model and serial number…I presume my insurance carrier has access to some database to determine if the watch is stolen. Otherwise, they’d be insuring a stolen watch. Can anyone verify if insurance carriers run a serial number check?

If you did insure your watch, and you gave the insurance carrier the serial #, I d be curious to see their reaction to the determination that your watch was previously reported stolen.

[1William]

Good news. Keep us posted.

[alphadweller]

Excellent! Glad to hear you're getting your money back. One of the pitfalls from buying preowned, unfortunately.

[Runfar]

essshhh not good at all sorry to hear that and glad they did right by you after that experience

[KenV]

I received a full refund this morning.

I bought the watch in November 2019, so I had it for coming up to five years. Fortunately the dealer was still in business and gave a refund.

So, what did I learn?

• Even though Rolex papers can be forged, I think the papers add one more level of security to the purchase.
• I would not buy from an unknown private seller since there would be little recourse in the event of an issue
• I should have had the watch serviced by Rolex soon after buying it. I would rather find out it was stolen not too long after the purchase. I did take the watch into my local AD in December 2021 due to an issue with the clasp. They fixed it and returned it. I guess it is only for an internal service that the AD may contact Rolex.
• I think a healthy secondary market is good for Rolex. A secondary market allows people to easily trade or sell their watches and helps maintain watch values. This in turn may encourage someone to buy new if they know it can be easily sold if required. Rolex should allow registered aftermarket sellers access to their stolen/lost watch database. I am sure these dealers would be willing to pay an access fee since it would make their purchases safer. If dealers could check the serial numbers before they buy a used watch it would allow them to reject stolen watches. If a thief can not easily flip a stolen watch then maybe there would be less theft since it is not easy cash.
• The Rolex stolen/lost database seems to be the definitive database. The Watch Register database may be large, but my watch was not listed there. If I had a watch stolen I would definitely register the theft with Rolex. I did not even know there are other databases.

The watch needed an 800 Euro repair and in the past, the AD said that the fix they did on the clasp was the best that could be done, and if the issue happened again, then a replacement band would be required. Since this was a two tone, I would guess that would not be cheap. So maybe I saved some Euros on current/future repairs.

So, where to from here? My wife and I went to the local AD to pickup the seizure report and said we are interested in a blue steel Sky-Dweller. Maybe he felt sorry for us, but he did register my name and said it should be possible to get one within a year. Time will tell.

Thanks for all the responses to this thread.

Ken

(The look we gave the AD when asking about the Sky-Dweller)

[77T]

Originally Posted by KenV

I received a full refund this morning.

I bought the watch in November 2019, so I had it for coming up to five years. Fortunately the dealer was still in business and gave a refund.

So, what did I learn?

• Even though Rolex papers can be forged, I think the papers add one more level of security to the purchase.
• I would not buy from an unknown private seller since there would be little recourse in the event of an issue
• I should have had the watch serviced by Rolex soon after buying it. I would rather find out it was stolen not too long after the purchase. I did take the watch into my local AD in December 2021 due to an issue with the clasp. They fixed it and returned it. I guess it is only for an internal service that the AD may contact Rolex.
• I think a healthy secondary market is good for Rolex. A secondary market allows people to easily trade or sell their watches and helps maintain watch values. This in turn may encourage someone to buy new if they know it can be easily sold if required. Rolex should allow registered aftermarket sellers access to their stolen/lost watch database. I am sure these dealers would be willing to pay an access fee since it would make their purchases safer. If dealers could check the serial numbers before they buy a used watch it would allow them to reject stolen watches. If a thief can not easily flip a stolen watch then maybe there would be less theft since it is not easy cash.
• The Rolex stolen/lost database seems to be the definitive database. The Watch Register database may be large, but my watch was not listed there. If I had a watch stolen I would definitely register the theft with Rolex. I did not even know there are other databases.

The watch needed an 800 Euro repair and in the past, the AD said that the fix they did on the clasp was the best that could be done, and if the issue happened again, then a replacement band would be required. Since this was a two tone, I would guess that would not be cheap. So maybe I saved some Euros on current/future repairs.

So, where to from here? My wife and I went to the local AD to pickup the seizure report and said we are interested in a blue steel Sky-Dweller. Maybe he felt sorry for us, but he did register my name and said it should be possible to get one within a year. Time will tell.

Thanks for all the responses to this thread.

Ken

(The look we gave the AD when asking about the Sky-Dweller)

I am relieved to hear the refund was made. Your other advice should serve others well in my opinion.


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[KenV]

I received this letter on Friday from the Köln police. It gives some details on the theft that occurred in 2017. I see it gives a 30 minute window for the time of the theft. I would guess that someone grabbed the watch off the owners wrist. I wonder if this is why I had to take the watch into the AD twice to get the clasp adjusted, maybe it was damaged during the theft.

I will mail the purchase documentation I have to the Köln police. If they want to follow-up, they can contact the Munich store and get the details on who sold them the watch. It was stolen in June 2017, and I bought it from the dealer in October/November 2019. The person that sold it to them could not have had it for more than two years and a bit. This person may be able to give details on how they acquired the watch.

Maybe the original owner will have a chance to get their watch back after seven years.

At least for me, I was able to get my money back.

Thanks,

Ken

[cascadez71]

Originally Posted by KenV

I received this letter on Friday from the Köln police. It gives some details on the theft that occurred in 2017. I see it gives a 30 minute window for the time of the theft. I would guess that someone grabbed the watch off the owners wrist. I wonder if this is why I had to take the watch into the AD twice to get the clasp adjusted, maybe it was damaged during the theft.

I will mail the purchase documentation I have to the Köln police. If they want to follow-up, they can contact the Munich store and get the details on who sold them the watch. It was stolen in June 2017, and I bought it from the dealer in October/November 2019. The person that sold it to them could not have had it for more than two years and a bit. This person may be able to give details on how they acquired the watch.

Maybe the original owner will have a chance to get their watch back after seven years.

At least for me, I was able to get my money back.

Thanks,

Ken

Glad it worked out. Thanks for sharing updates as the case progressed.

Just a head's up, your last name is visible in one of the reports you posted, may be worth it to redact.

[fskywalker]

Originally Posted by KenV

I received this letter on Friday from the Köln police. It gives some details on the theft that occurred in 2017. I see it gives a 30 minute window for the time of the theft. I would guess that someone grabbed the watch off the owners wrist. I wonder if this is why I had to take the watch into the AD twice to get the clasp adjusted, maybe it was damaged during the theft.

I will mail the purchase documentation I have to the Köln police. If they want to follow-up, they can contact the Munich store and get the details on who sold them the watch. It was stolen in June 2017, and I bought it from the dealer in October/November 2019. The person that sold it to them could not have had it for more than two years and a bit. This person may be able to give details on how they acquired the watch.

Maybe the original owner will have a chance to get their watch back after seven years.

At least for me, I was able to get my money back.

Thanks,

Ken

Glad you got your money back and that the owner will likely get his watch back


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[madsitalia]

Awesome. I’m so glad it turned out good after all of your troubles.
Thank you for posting your story and keeping us updated. I think a lot of us cheered for you.

All the best, and keep in touch when you get the call

[brandrea]

Glad it all worked out for you in the end

[londondude]

Good to hear you got your money back. In my opinion this really highlights the risks of buying a second had watch. I really wish Rolex opened up their stolen register so that people could easily check whether a watch is stolen or not. I guess that’s not in their interest, especially now that they are offering their very own CPO program.

[1William]

Glad that this worked out. I like your commentary and some of that would work.

[NigeG]

A great ending to what must have been a difficult, frustrating and stressful 10 weeks. Good that the dealer you purchased from supported you correctly.

Initially I was really quite excited about the prospect of the CPO programme until I saw the prices being charged by WoS group here in the UK. Whilst they’re priced at these levels I’m never going to buy anything. £14K + for GMT Master 16710s and plenty of them. Seen lots of others between £8 - £10K several with boxes and papers at a variety of well established bricks n mortar sellers.

I bought my 16610 privately. The previous owner had taken it to St James RSC and purchased a new link for the bracelet. I have the invoice for that with the serial number of the watch printed on it. I thought it’s quite a robust way of checking it’s not on Rolex’s stolen watch database. Whether you can get that into a condition of sale with an independent dealer I don’t know but I would certainly try.


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[KatGirl]

Great news! I hope your AD gets you that Skydweller sooner, rather than later. I’ve seen both the blue and green in person, and both are stunning.

Kat


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[worldofoyster]

glad it works out in OP's favor.

[Cambo]

Great news!

[alphadweller]

Thanks for sharing your experience and glad to hear about the positive outcome and the lesson learnt. Good luck with the blue SkyD.

[S’portEye]

Unfortunately, I think the take home point is do not send a secondhand watch to the RSC. Glad you got your money back and especially happy that the original owner will get his watch, but this could have ended so much worse for the OP.

[Cambo]

Originally Posted by S’portEye

Unfortunately, I think the take home point is do not send a secondhand watch to the RSC. Glad you got your money back and especially happy that the original owner will get his watch, but this could have ended so much worse for the OP.

I vehemently disagree
The take home point should be “do your homework before purchase”. If there is even a chance that the watch could be stolen you should not make the transaction. And if there is evidence that it was stolen, it should be reported immediately.
I simply can’t understand this “wink wink, nod nod, head-in-the-sand” tripe. I would like to think most honest Rolex owners would agree.

[S’portEye]

Originally Posted by Cambo

I vehemently disagree
The take home point should be “do your homework before purchase”. If there is even a chance that the watch could be stolen you should not make the transaction. And if there is evidence that it was stolen, it should be reported immediately.
I simply can’t understand this “wink wink, nod nod, head-in-the-sand” tripe. I would like to think most honest Rolex owners would agree.

Of course you can disagree. There is no wink, wink. My point is that this can happen to any reseller anywhere. Many people would have no idea and neither would the gray. They have done their homework. It happens. Are you saying that everyone that has a watch bought on the secondary market should send their watch to a RSC for service? Even if it costs more? Even if there are other watchmakers that are closer and have great reputations? Just in case? Because that will never happen and this is one of the reasons why. Stop with the faux outrage.

[Cambo]

Originally Posted by S’portEye

Of course you can disagree. There is no wink, wink. My point is that this can happen to any reseller anywhere. Many people would have no idea and neither would the gray. They have done their homework. It happens. Are you saying that everyone that has a watch bought on the secondary market should send their watch to a RSC for service? Even if it costs more? Even if there are other watchmakers that are closer and have great reputations? Just in case? Because that will never happen and this is one of the reasons why. Stop with the faux outrage.

Faux outrage my a**. I can assure you the outrage is real. You overtly recommend bypassing a known confirmation/red flag, that being RSC. “It happens”???!!!
Nice! Tell that to the honest owner who was robbed.

Edit: the only reason this turned out to be a good ending is because the responsible purchaser (OP) sent the watch in to RSC.

[S’portEye]

Originally Posted by Cambo

Faux outrage my a**. You overtly recommend bypassing a known confirmation/red flag, that being RSC. “It happens”???!!!
Nice! Tell that to the honest owner who was robbed.

Yes, faux outrage. Calm down. There was no red flag that the OP mentioned. The OP did his homework. Send all your secondhand watches to a RSC. I said I was glad the original owner or insurance company got their watch back. I just feel that sending a secondhand watch to the RSC is a risk that many people may not want to take, and I could not blame them.