Is my "new" watch really 13 years old?

[lsettle]

Pick one:

1. Be happy with the watch.

or

2. Demand a refund. As it was not what you were told it was when you bought the watch PERIOD.

This thread is not going anywhere.

Lawrence

[handsfull]

Originally Posted by msjenbowen

Update... the seller now says that Rolex told him they won't appraise if the watch has been altered in any way. He admits the dial was taken from another watch, but insists it is a genuine Rolex dial with aftermarket diamonds.

He now wants to send it to an independent appraiser who can evaluate it. Any suggestions for an expert who can verify the authenticity (or lack thereof) of the parts, especially the dial? Thanks in advance!

Im sorry, but this thread is becoming frustrating.

Is there any confusion on the commentary left here for you? Your ignoring the valuable information gifted to you by the community. Your watch dial is fake, and is THE REASON your seller doesn't want it sent to Rolex. Cut your loss and go after a refund. Simple/No-brainer.

[mannyv11]

Originally Posted by handsfull

Im sorry, but this thread is becoming frustrating.

Is there any confusion on the commentary left here for you? Your ignoring the valuable information gifted to you by the community. Your watch dial is fake, and is THE REASON your seller doesn't want it sent to Rolex. Cut your loss and go after a refund. Simple.

x2

[CDNWatchNut]

Originally Posted by msjenbowen

Hopefully, they will agree to refund the money based on the great information I've found on this forum, as well as the obvious bad condition of the case. I happen to be a lawyer myself, but hope to resolve it in the way you suggest, as the seller is a friend and I believe he is doing all he can at this point to get a good result.

I don't get it...what kind of friend would screw a friend over? Shouldn't he just agree to undo the deal???
In any case, good luck with it, hope you can work it out fairly.

[msjenbowen]

Originally Posted by lsettle

Pick one:

1. Be happy with the watch.

or

2. Demand a refund. As it was not what you were told it was when you bought the watch PERIOD.

This thread is not going anywhere.

Lawrence

Trust me, if it were that easy, I would have my money back already. The seller is a friend and seems genuinely confused and concerned about the situation. He got the watch from another supplier and I believe he represented it to us based on what they told him. I think he just wants to have all the facts before confronting them.

I don't think his supplier will accept TRF message board responses as proof of this watch's condition, although TRF posters are probably just as accurate, or more so, than anyone I've found so far in dealing with this situation. So, the best thing I can think of is to send it to an expert, get an accurate report of the components (genuine and aftermarket), damage, and value. Once we have that information, I think it will be hard for the seller and the supplier to insist the watch is new and I think they will have no choice but to refund it. I am simply trying to handle this in the nicest way possible, in an attempt to maintain the friendship, because I honestly feel our seller friend was duped, too.

Disclaimer: The seller did tell us the dial had come from another watch and that the diamonds were set after market, but he told us the dial was 100% genuine Rolex. If the dial is, in fact, genuine, I will be happy with it. I have a feeling it is after-market, but no one is admitting anything without an official appraisal.

I still am unhappy with the damage, so if anyone is interested, I'll post the results. If everyone is still frustrated with my taking my time to give them a chance to make it right without demanding a refund, based on no official proof, I will stop responding. Trust me, I'm as frustrated as anyone and want a resolution now, but this is a particularly delicate situation, at least to me.

[msjenbowen]

Originally Posted by CDNWatchNut

I don't get it...what kind of friend would screw a friend over? Shouldn't he just agree to undo the deal???
In any case, good luck with it, hope you can work it out fairly.

Yes, a good friend should do exactly that, and I'm hoping he will.

[Alan G]

Just Read this post its almost a week old, what was the end result?
I am curious as to wether a serial was on the rehault

[Alan G]

Sorry I was reading the first page Lol!

I should pay more attention

[msjenbowen]

Originally Posted by Alan G

Just Read this post its almost a week old, what was the end result?
I am curious as to wether a serial was on the rehault

No end result yet, but yes, there is a "V" serial number engraved on the rehaut.

[pol]

I too have been following along this thread for some time. I would agree, it's time for a refund. Obviously you are trying to maintain a friendship, however IMHO this sentiment should be reciprocated as the watch was misrepresented as new, whether intentional or not. Good luck.

[Alan G]

I dont know if Rolex have approved service centres in your country, but there are several in the UK, I understand that Rolex often send the overspill to these service centres and they are then returned via rolex ,

I know that most of these approved centres would openly confirm authenticity (at a cost), this would be worth checking out if and who they are in your country. its the only proof that all parties will agree on and I would expect them to supply this on Rolex Service centre headed paper.

Myself I would get a refund the argument with his supplier is not your issue if he does this for a living its called seller beware in the UK , he is deemed to know more than yourself being in the business, If Walmart sold you a mouldy loaf of bread would they make you wait whist they go to there supplier it wont change the mould so to speak and it isnt your argument you didnt buy it private .

If your really stuggling send it to my Local RSC in the UK whats $120 (approx inc insured postage) to confirm this on RSC Paper given whats at stake but you must have something more local.
Good luck

[GeoGio Greece]

It is obvious that this is a fake. THe hands, the diamonds, the looks shout it !

[Silvio Mosiello]

Just get rid of the watch.

[freddyttt]

I would not give this "seller" the watch for verification. Im guessing you paid CC.

A. take it to a AD yourself.(dial and watch is prolly not rolex)

B.damand a refund.

C.contact CC FOR A REFUND.


friends like this-. you dont need.

[msjenbowen]

Originally Posted by pol

I too have been following along this thread for some time. I would agree, it's time for a refund. Obviously you are trying to maintain a friendship, however IMHO this sentiment should be reciprocated as the watch was misrepresented as new, whether intentional or not. Good luck.

Thank you. He believes the watch was new when he sold it, so unfortunately, it's going to take a little time to prove to him it wasn't (and even more so that it's not authentic).

I have insisted that we send the watch to RSC in New York and they should have an answer within 7-10 days. I am confident that, when the seller gets their report, he will realize the mistake and will handle it accordingly by refunding our money and going after his supplier.

I know everyone thinks I should demand a refund now, but I am content to let it go to Rolex for its verdict. Another few days won't hurt. I'll post the results within the next couple of weeks.

[honeybear]

Originally Posted by msjenbowen

Thank you. He believes the watch was new when he sold it, so unfortunately, it's going to take a little time to prove to him it wasn't (and even more so that it's not authentic).

I have insisted that we send the watch to RSC in New York and they should have an answer within 7-10 days. I am confident that, when the seller gets their report, he will realize the mistake and will handle it accordingly by refunding our money and going after his supplier.

I know everyone thinks I should demand a refund now, but I am content to let it go to Rolex for its verdict. Another few days won't hurt. I'll post the results within the next couple of weeks.

I still think you paid too high a price for the watch if you only received a $2K discount off the MSRP of a new Rolex Datejust with a diamond dial. The MSRP for a non-diamond dial is about $7450, and with the diamond dial, it's $9000.

To me, the fact that diamond dial is aftermarket, coupled with the poor job of fitting the dial, and the damage to the case, means that even if everything besides the dial was legit, the value of the watch is less than that of a new Datejust with non-diamond dial.

Given the fact that you could probably have easily negotiated a $1K discount off the MSRP at an AD on a new Rolex Datejust with diamond dial, you're receiving an additional $1K "discount" but on a watch that is worth substantially less, so on the balance, you made a very poor deal.

[handsfull]

Originally Posted by msjenbowen

Thank you. He believes the watch was new when he sold it, so unfortunately, it's going to take a little time to prove to him it wasn't (and even more so that it's not authentic).

What the seller 'believes' is irrelevant, there are people who believe in Unicorns.

1. From the pictures you presented, any prudent person could see that your watch is CLEARLY, without question.....NOT NEW. Period.

2. Not only is it NOT NEW, it's been altered. CLEARLY ALTERED. He even admitted it was altered AFTER BEING CONFRONTED! This situation is akin to buying a 'new' vehicle and finding the odometer has been rolled back, with a new paint job.

Originally Posted by msjenbowen

I know everyone thinks I should demand a refund now, but I am content to let it go to Rolex for its verdict. Another few days won't hurt. I'll post the results within the next couple of weeks.

Wow....you must really like this seller. I can tell you that if a seller had sold this watch to my Mom...it wouldn't be pretty. Good luck on your adventure.

[psv]

Last post I'll make since you are not taking any advise, which are based on owning/selling Rolex and other watches for a great many years.

Reverse your thinking - it is not your job to maintain this so called friendship at this point - it is up to your "friend" to do what it takes to keep you as a friend. The watch has case damage, the dial/diamond/hands doesn't belong on this vintage and might very well be fakes, he sold it to you as "new" and my guess is that you paid a couple of thousands too much. Just demand the refund and get yourself a genuine product. Over and out.

[mmmk604]

I think the watch has a genuine Rolex dial. However, it's an older tritium dial that has been altered (diamond set markers were put on).
It's up to you what you want to do. If he won't give you a refund, you should at least get a bigger discount as compensation.

Sending the watch to RSC won't do much...they'll send it back right away telling you they won't work on it.

[caryyee]

Originally Posted by msjenbowen

I know everyone thinks I should demand a refund now, but I am content to let it go to Rolex for its verdict. Another few days won't hurt. I'll post the results within the next couple of weeks.

I wish you luck, please keep us posted on developments. We here are all passionate about our watches, especially Rolex, so we are all wishing a satisfactory resolution for you. You obviously have a lot of patience plus goodwill with your seller so I understand you wanting all the facts first. Good idea to insist that a proper RSC look at it. The results of which the seller (and original supplier) cannot argue with.

[turboevo2]

looks like an aftermarket face.

[pol]

Originally Posted by handsfull

What the seller 'believes' is irrelevant, there are people who believe in Unicorns.

1. From the pictures you presented, any prudent person could see that your watch is CLEARLY, without question.....NOT NEW. Period.

2. Not only is it NOT NEW, it's been altered. CLEARLY ALTERED. He even admitted it was altered AFTER BEING CONFRONTED! This situation is akin to buying a 'new' vehicle and finding the odometer has been rolled back, with a new paint job.




Wow....you must really like this seller. I can tell you that if a seller had sold this watch to my Mom...it wouldn't be pretty. Good luck on your adventure.

I agree with Jeff. What the seller believes is irrelevant. The watch is not new, is misrepresented (either intentionally or not) and you shouldn't have to prove it. Your friend should refund your money and return the watch, then prove to himself what it is or is not and take this up with his supplier. It is respectable that you want to attempt to maintain friendship, but your friend, in my opinion, should as well, and in doing so refund your money. Again, good luck.

[yemenmocha]

I'm losing sleep over this thread.

[mmmk604]

Originally Posted by yemenmocha

I'm losing sleep over this thread.

Don't stress yourself out too much

[caryyee]

Originally Posted by yemenmocha

I'm losing sleep over this thread.

You'll be losing sleep for a bit longer, gotta wait till it comes back from the RSC for the next update! :-)

[mikkolopez]

I just read the thread from start to finish and
1. I really cannot understand why the OP would take it upon herself to deal with the hassle of "settling" (to the point of defending the seller) with this obvious frankenRollie (and a bad one at that), an independent appraiser is no use to me IMO because that is not Rolex appraising
2. Rolex has said it will not appraise (translate to srvice) the said watch so all hope of getting the watch (if it were genuine) up to factory spec is out the window,
3. what is the problem of getting a refund, ask for your cash back (and let your friend deal with his supplier) or cancel the CC transaction. It is that easy.
4. review your friendship with this seller/appraiser because apparently he in in for the money on this and not because of the goodness of his heart.

Keep it longer and you are just punishing yourself. Lots of luck.

[bottom of the ninth]

Well that's 15min I can never get back...What a thread!
Bottom line...I hope the OP gets his money back!

[zeuloa]

Just on the basis of the damage done to the case your "friend" should give you a refund. It is his problem if he has unreliable suppliers, not yours!

[msjenbowen]

Originally Posted by mikkolopez

I just read the thread from start to finish and
1. I really cannot understand why the OP would take it upon herself to deal with the hassle of "settling" (to the point of defending the seller) with this obvious frankenRollie (and a bad one at that), an independent appraiser is no use to me IMO because that is not Rolex appraising
2. Rolex has said it will not appraise (translate to srvice) the said watch so all hope of getting the watch (if it were genuine) up to factory spec is out the window,
3. what is the problem of getting a refund, ask for your cash back (and let your friend deal with his supplier) or cancel the CC transaction. It is that easy.
4. review your friendship with this seller/appraiser because apparently he in in for the money on this and not because of the goodness of his heart.

Keep it longer and you are just punishing yourself. Lots of luck.

It may be obvious to everyone here that the dial is aftermarket, but it wasn't obvious to me until I posted it here. If it was obvious to me, I wouldn't have purchased it. Plus, I've worn the watch almost every day since July, so it's not like I just bought it a week ago. We paid by check, so I can't cancel the CC transaction. The seller lives in another state, so it's not like I can just run over and handle it face-to-face.

I agreed to send it to RSC because I didn't realize the dial was aftermarket until posting it here and I know the seller didn't either. I've told him that I've been told it's aftermarket, but he thinks aftermarket just means that a genuine Rolex dial has been taken from one watch and put in another. I need someone official to tell him it's fake, because I'm not an expert and I can't see why he would take my word for it, even though we are friends. This man sells very few Rolexes and did so as a favor to us. I think he made $500 on the deal, so he is obviously not getting rich off of our watch transaction. I am simply trying to be fair and nice.

I love this forum and have learned so much, but at this point, I don't understand why people keep beating me up for not putting my big girl boots on and demanding a resolution right this second. The watch is being sent to RSC today and we'll have a "yay" or "nay" within the next two weeks. Please don't lose any sleep over this... I'm sure I'm losing enough for everyone.

[toph]

Originally Posted by msjenbowen

It may be obvious to everyone here that the dial is aftermarket, but it wasn't obvious to me until I posted it here. If it was obvious to me, I wouldn't have purchased it. Plus, I've worn the watch almost every day since July, so it's not like I just bought it a week ago. We paid by check, so I can't cancel the CC transaction. The seller lives in another state, so it's not like I can just run over and handle it face-to-face.

I agreed to send it to RSC because I didn't realize the dial was aftermarket until posting it here and I know the seller didn't either. I've told him that I've been told it's aftermarket, but he thinks aftermarket just means that a genuine Rolex dial has been taken from one watch and put in another. I need someone official to tell him it's fake, because I'm not an expert and I can't see why he would take my word for it, even though we are friends. This man sells very few Rolexes and did so as a favor to us. I think he made $500 on the deal, so he is obviously not getting rich off of our watch transaction. I am simply trying to be fair and nice.

I love this forum and have learned so much, but at this point, I don't understand why people keep beating me up for not putting my big girl boots on and demanding a resolution right this second. The watch is being sent to RSC today and we'll have a "yay" or "nay" within the next two weeks. Please don't lose any sleep over this... I'm sure I'm losing enough for everyone.

Don't worry I think you are handling this very maturely. It will get fixed I am sure and you will have not lost a friend. He is in the wrong but as you say he was wronged too. It is still his responsibility to make it up to you and I am sure he will when the truth is confirmed