Tipping has gotten out of control

[TheHulk]

This is a hot button with me too. I’m a great tipper at restaurants if Svc is really good (30% or more) but tipping at drive thru windows or when i go inside of a restaurant is a no go for me. I drove there myself, walked inside, and I’m expected to tip…. NOPE!!!!

[bayerische]

Originally Posted by superdog

Was in Miami a few weeks ago.

They include 20% on everything. As gratuity.

But…they also have an another line for additional gratuity. And the service is, in my experience, provided with a frown. No smiles. No nice attitude. No friendly.

And god forbid you left that additional line blank and went back the next day.

It was frustrating to say the least.

I was in Florida a week ago. Man has the service everywhere gone to Sh*t.

[EEpro]

Originally Posted by bayerische

I was in Florida a week ago. Man has the service everywhere gone to Sh*t.

Covid ruined everything. Vegas too.

[Blansky]

Originally Posted by bayerische

I was in Florida a week ago. Man has the service everywhere gone to Sh*t.

I hope your vacation was great anyways.

Covid definitely caused an upheaval, and readjustment of thinking in a lot of service professions. I’m guessing for the most part it will get back to a normal soon.

Talked to 2 different bartenders (well obviously more than 2, c’mon) while in Hawaii and one said they couldn’t get any wait staff for love nor money, and the other one said they had zero issues.

So perhaps it was more of a reflection of that particular establishment than the situation overall.

[bayerische]

Originally Posted by EEpro

Covid ruined everything.

Yes.

[Ike]

The thing that I get annoyed with is when the owner of a business quotes a price then asks for a tip after the service is completed. This happens with fishing guides, car detailers, etc. I have no issue tipping employees but the owner gets to set his prices, if he wants a certain amount he should quote it, not a lower price and try to make up for it with a tip.

[Maleg]

Originally Posted by Blansky

I hope your vacation was great anyways.

Covid definitely caused an upheaval, and readjustment of thinking in a lot of service professions. I’m guessing for the most part it will get back to a normal soon.

Talked to 2 different bartenders (well obviously more than 2, c’mon) while in Hawaii and one said they couldn’t get any wait staff for love nor money, and the other one said they had zero issues.

So perhaps it was more of a reflection of that particular establishment than the situation overall.

All good points.

I think covid practices proved to some business owners what the minimum acceptable standards are for their customers. Good businesses have returned to pre-covid performance expectations and greedy businesses continue to work the minimum. Who wants to work for the establishment that is happy at the bottom of the barrel?

[TheVTCGuy]

Originally Posted by TheHulk

This is a hot button with me too. I’m a great tipper at restaurants if Svc is really good (30% or more) but tipping at drive thru windows or when i go inside of a restaurant is a no go for me. I drove there myself, walked inside, and I’m expected to tip…. NOPE!!!!

I would say I agree, with the exception of a friendly server and if I am paying cash. When I get the change, I will throw the coins in to the tip jar.

[Blansky]

Originally Posted by TheVTCGuy

I would say I agree, with the exception of a friendly server and if I am paying cash. When I get the change, I will throw the coins in to the tip jar.

Ok Paul, but I’m not sure if purging change and lint out of your pocket so it doesn’t jangle around and create a hole, would be considering an altruistic event.

Any more than the cashier at Tommy Bahama clothing store yesterday asking me, since my total was $79.99, if I wanted to donate a penny to cancer research.

And knowing that penny could make the difference, felt good about myself for the rest of the day knowing that I’d done my bit.

I mean what on earth are we supposed to do with a penny, a nickel, or a dime anyways.

[Maleg]

Originally Posted by Blansky

Ok Paul, but I’m not sure if purging change and lint out of your pocket so it doesn’t jangle around and create a hole, would be considering an altruistic event.

Any more than the cashier at Tommy Bahama clothing store yesterday asking me, since my total was $79.99, if I wanted to donate a penny to cancer research.

And knowing that penny could make the difference, felt good about myself for the rest of the day knowing that I’d done my bit.

I mean what on earth are we supposed to do with a penny, a nickel, or a dime anyways.

Pennies are for smashing under the wheels of trains.

Loose change goes in the tray for people to use to make exact change, thus avoiding loose change in the first place. Any kind of tip jar gets bills or nothing. If you're going to tip the jar, put a proper tip in it. Don’t be Judge Smails Paul!

[enjoythemusic]

See this is proof that Canadiens are smarter than Americans... pennies.

[DocHorton]

Originally Posted by Moondoggy

You don’t even have to add 20% there is already enough fat in it, for the business owner to pay the wait staff a decent wage.

Not true for most restaurants. The average profit margin for a restaurant is under 10%. I owned a restaurant for about 7 years, and there is no way you could have paid the entire staff even $15/hour and it have been profitable enough to be worth owning it, especially considering the investment involved and the risks associated with business ownership.

Plenty of folks like to talk about "paying a living wage", but have no experience owning and operating a business.

[bayerische]

Originally Posted by DocHorton

Not true for most restaurants. The average profit margin for a restaurant is under 10%. I owned a restaurant for about 7 years, and there is no way you could have paid the entire staff even $15/hour and it have been profitable enough to be worth owning it, especially considering the investment involved and the risks associated with business ownership.

Plenty of folks like to talk about "paying a living wage", but have no experience owning and operating a business.

Must be something fundamentally wrong with the business model then in the US, as restaurants pretty much everywhere else don't rely on tip's for their staff.

[Beo3]

I’m in the UK for a few days and tipped the waitress yesterday 25% after a nice dinner. She looked at me like I was nuts and even asked if I had made a mistake. I did not realize that here 10% is considered a large tip.

She was very appreciative and said that I had made her night.

Just different customs I suppose.

[Moondoggy]

Originally Posted by bayerische

Must be something fundamentally wrong with the business model then in the US, as restaurants pretty much everywhere else don't rely on tip's for their staff.

‘Hello’

[The Londonist]

Originally Posted by Confuscious

In the UK you tip if the service impressed you. In the States you are FORCED to tip which is quite ridiculous. Although that entitled attitude is spreading to the UK.

This.

In my (somewhat limited) experience, in the US, a tip of say 10%, (which by the way would be completely normal and perfectly acceptable in the UK/EU), is met with derision which feels like a form of psychological intimidation.

I do hope I’m wrong as it made us feel distinctly unwelcome and makes me have second thoughts about holidays in the US.

Are restaurant salaries on the low side and mainly made up by tips? If it’s the case that job security is poor (and thus access to healthcare), then I could understand the need to get anything extra.

Just trying to understand the drivers to US tipping expectations.

[Maleg]

Originally Posted by bayerische

Must be something fundamentally wrong with the business model then in the US, as restaurants pretty much everywhere else don't rely on tip's for their staff.

Originally Posted by Moondoggy

‘Hello’

Restaurants have a notoriously thin margin in the US. I considered investing in a restaurant about ten years ago. My FA told me it was a risky low return investment and a deeper look validated his advice. You really need to have a passion for the restaurant business to want to take on that kind of risk.

It’s also unfair to compare European wage structure to the US. While business is business, the regulatory and risk environments are not the same.

[The Londonist]

Originally Posted by Maleg

It’s also unfair to compare European wage structure to the US. While business is business, the regulatory and risk environments are not the same.

Interesting observations; could you elaborate on the differences you see in the regulatory and risk environments between the EU and US? Thanks.

[brandrea]

Originally Posted by Maleg

Pennies are for smashing under the wheels of trains.

Loose change goes in the tray for people to use to make exact change, thus avoiding loose change in the first place. Any kind of tip jar gets bills or nothing. If you're going to tip the jar, put a proper tip in it. Don’t be Judge Smails Paul!

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

See this is proof that Canadiens are smarter than Americans... pennies.

Something that always resonated with me as a youngster …

Save your pennies and the dollars will look after themselves.

[uscmatt99]

Originally Posted by The Londonist

This.

In my (somewhat limited) experience, in the US, a tip of say 10%, (which by the way would be completely normal and perfectly acceptable in the UK/EU), is met with derision which feels like a form of psychological intimidation.

I do hope I’m wrong as it made us feel distinctly unwelcome and makes me have second thoughts about holidays in the US.

Are restaurant salaries on the low side and mainly made up by tips? If it’s the case that job security is poor (and thus access to healthcare), then I could understand the need to get anything extra.

Just trying to understand the drivers to US tipping expectations.

Yes the income for service staff is majority tip based. Hourly wage is something miniscule along the order of USD3-4 per hour. Everyone who lives here is aware of this, but visitors often aren't, understandably. It keeps the posted prices of items down. Depending on where you visit, expect to add anywhere from 5-10% for sales tax (which is set by the state and subsequently the locality), plus 18-22% for a tip (on the pre-tax price of the meal) to be considered "average". This is voluntary in most places, but expected. When we visited Miami, we found that it was pretty much mandated/included on the final bill and there was no expectation of additional tipping, and this is because there are so many international visitors and employees felt they were getting stiffed by those parties.

As a fun side note. When visiting European destinations, it seems that places that serve high American tourist populations have started leaving the option for tips. Given our rigid tip training in the states, one can feel compelled to leave one when asked, even though the business model at these places makes it unnecessary.

[AzPaul]

What would you all say is the proper tip for a standard haircut (or whichever term you prefer for a third-party shortening of your hair)? Set total or a percentage-based number?

[Maleg]

Originally Posted by AzPaul

What would you all say is the proper tip for a standard haircut (or whichever term you prefer for a third-party shortening of your hair)? Set total or a percentage-based number?

Barber $5. Salon stylist nothing extra (it’s priced at professional wages).

[brandrea]

Originally Posted by AzPaul

What would you all say is the proper tip for a standard haircut (or whichever term you prefer for a third-party shortening of your hair)? Set total or a percentage-based number?

I’ll bite … I tip 20% same as with most things where I think it’s appropriate

[SDGT3]

Originally Posted by AzPaul

What would you all say is the proper tip for a standard haircut (or whichever term you prefer for a third-party shortening of your hair)? Set total or a percentage-based number?

I tip 30% on personal services such as haircuts. Not the same as bringing out a plate of food.

[austinp]

Originally Posted by AzPaul

What would you all say is the proper tip for a standard haircut (or whichever term you prefer for a third-party shortening of your hair)? Set total or a percentage-based number?

My barber charges $22 round up to $30.


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[RyanJ]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

See this is proof that Canadiens are smarter than Americans... pennies.

haha.. I love Canadians but they lose a point for calling any money a Loonie.... Then you did it again with a Toonie. I swear you would have had a 3'fer if allowed..Err.. Maybe it is a threenie... I don't know!

[Blansky]

Originally Posted by AzPaul

What would you all say is the proper tip for a standard haircut (or whichever term you prefer for a third-party shortening of your hair)? Set total or a percentage-based number?

They’re standing there with very sharp scissors, and often a straight razor pretty handy.

I’m thinking whatever amount of tip they say, is the safe bet.

[MrGoat]

Originally Posted by AzPaul

What would you all say is the proper tip for a standard haircut (or whichever term you prefer for a third-party shortening of your hair)? Set total or a percentage-based number?

My barber died and I’m growing it out for locks of love.

When he was alive I’d tip him 100% on top of a premium price but he would come to my house on my schedule and cut my hair. He was a good dude and a friend.

I’ve found another barber I have heard great things about and went to long ago that will do the same deal. So when the time comes to donate and start getting regular cuts again it will again be 100% tip on top of the premium.


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[daveathall]

My barber, a brilliant and lovely man from Iran, cuts my hair for £25, I pay that and always give him a fiver on top. Passionate Leeds supporter so he must be good.

[East Bay Rider]

My barber charges $15.00. She gets paid cash with a $20.00 bill. If her rate goes to $16, she'll still get paid with a $20.00 bill, but will get less of a tip I suppose. I don't always have singles and if she wants to put the bill in her pocket rather than the cash register that's up to her. It's a simple cut done entirely with 2 clippers and takes only minutes.

As has been said before, when dealing with a single owner/employee business the idea of tipping the employee get muddled because you're really tipping the owner who already gets 100% of the money to put back into the business, or not. I generally consider tipping as a means to help the employee above his regular wage.